Weeds

[Chasmodes]

Steve, have you tried putting your scrubber screen into your tank to see if the fish eat it? If that works, you could have a couple or a few screens and swap them out. Free food is always a plus in this expensive hobby!

[Michael Hoaster]

Thanks for reading, Kevin! I appreciate all the questions!

I will do a video at some point. I know I've been saying that for a while now. Sorry for the delay. I was waiting to get a few more fish, and the main circulation pump running, but that's still aways off, so I might as well. I'm in the middle of a big catch-up cleanup/export. After that, I'll have no excuses.

The tufted joint algae is cool, but it is getting overrun by other algae. I had the same experience previously with this plant. This is where an herbivorous fish (like a Herald's Angel) could come in handy. Though I'd like to avoid the situation I had in the Caribbean Biotope tank, with the Caribbean Blue Tang, which ate pretty much all of my macros. I need a fish that eats the nuisance algae and leaves the ones I want to keep alone. Its a bit of a conundrum.

The turtle weed on the rock is still hanging in there, but gets overrun as well. In general, I'd say its declining, and not spreading around the wall, unfortunately. I have found this plant challenging. Another bummer is that the rock its on brought in a couple of nuisance algae that have spread around. Again, I think an angelfish might help. At least the pods like it…

A heavy fish load would definitely lessen the need for dosing. But I'm not really a big fish load kind of guy. Maybe if I was richer… For now, dosing is easy, and pretty infrequent. Between the dirty sand bed and CO2 injection, I'm pretty well covered, but an occasional Nitrogen input helps. Dosing Nitrate is less risky, but I feel that there is a baseline level of Nitrate already, so I give the plants a treat of their favorite form of Nitrogen on occasion. I wouldn't recommend dosing ammonia to anyone, unless they have a large, heavily-planted tank, like mine. The only other person I know of dosing ammonia is Subsea, who grows a lot of macros as well. I haven't seen any posts from him in a while. Patrick, you still out there?

I've not seen any fry or eggs for the blennies. That would awesome! I'm just happy the two I have left haven't done the death spiral.

I did replace the blue bulb with another one with a lower wattage, so it's effect is less visible. My red macros are still not as red as I'd like. They may still be getting too much light from the metal halide.

The mangroves have yet to put out any the aerial roots that this tree is known for. There are a few roots visible, but only just. It would be cool to see how extensive the root system is. It seems like maybe they are putting their energy into reaching the water surface. Another possibility is that with the fertile substrate and high nutrient water column, that provides plenty of uptake for this phase of their lives. Once they reach the surface, maybe they will kick into overdrive and need to put out more roots. For now, I'm happy they're still growing. They're definitely on a different time scale than anything else in the tank. I'm really enjoying them!

All caught up? Thanks for the great questions!

[Chasmodes]

Yep, all caught up. Thanks for answering my questions. I promise that I'll be patient and not bug you about producing videos LOL. I don't mean to sound pushy. Better yet, how about a live feed streaming weedcam!

[Michael Hoaster]

Weedcam! That sounds awesome. I did use a cheap webcam, years ago, when my tank was a reef tank. I had a remote sump in my crawlspace/basement that was difficult to get close enough to monitor. So I put a webcam on it, so I could check that all was well from my computer. That's probably as high tech as I'll ever be!

[Michael Hoaster]

The process of clearing the sand bed continues. I've been working on it every other day. It's tedious, and it's what I get for slacking. Anyway, I should be close to pulling shoal grass soon. It will be nice to tidy up the grasses!

About a month ago I added some kalkwasser, to boost Calcium. Over the last couple weeks, coralline algae has popped up on the front glass. Also, on the seagrasses, what I thought at first was coralline, I think maybe a calcium precipitate. It's an off-white, golden color, which hides the lovely green blade. I may have to prune a lot, unfortunately. Or I could let Nature take it's course. I've had coralline grow on grasses before. It was a nice, pink color.

[Chasmodes]

I started peeling the black stringy algae off of the Vallisneria in my stream tank, and have been doing it for about a half hour to an hour each night for the last three days. As I was pulling the algae out, I thought of all of the work that you do on your tank, and the amount of effort that you must put into it with pruning your favorite macros and the removal of the undesirable ones. It sounds like a daunting task.

[Michael Hoaster]

It can be a lot of work, especially when I neglect my weekly maintenance, then try to catch back up! That's the situation I'm in at the moment. Plus I'm doing some extra clearing I wouldn't normally do, so it's more work.

With the tank getting pretty mature at a year and a half, I'm doing less ecosystem building and more good old gardening. Nature doesn't seem to care whether it looks good or not. So, I garden to get it there. Hopefully, I'll get some help in the form of an herbivorous fish, one of these days.

[vlangel]

Originally Posted by Michael Hoaster

It can be a lot of work, especially when I neglect my weekly maintenance, then try to catch back up! That's the situation I'm in at the moment. Plus I'm doing some extra clearing I wouldn't normally do, so it's more work.

With the tank getting pretty mature at a year and a half, I'm doing less ecosystem building and more good old gardening. Nature doesn't seem to care whether it looks good or not. So, I garden to get it there. Hopefully, I'll get some help in the form of an herbivorous fish, one of these days.

Ha ha, just like in outdoor gardening the maintenance is fun until you get behind and then it can be daunting and overwhelming which is not as fun!

[Michael Hoaster]

That's pretty much it. I got lazy at a time when I was planning to do more than the usual amount of pruning. So now I'm playing catch-up. Almost there!

[Scrubber_steve]

Originally Posted by Chasmodes

Steve, have you tried putting your scrubber screen into your tank to see if the fish eat it? If that works, you could have a couple or a few screens and swap them out. Free food is always a plus in this expensive hobby!

Theoretically you could have two screens, one would be in the display for fish feeding for a week while the other screen does the filtering.

Feeding isn't expensive. Nori is pretty cheap & in a form very practical for feeding. I also feed blended seafood bought fresh from the market.

[Chasmodes]

Michael and Dawn, that's what happens with my entire yard!

Originally Posted by Scrubber_steve

Theoretically you could have two screens, one would be in the display for fish feeding for a week while the other screen does the filtering.

Feeding isn't expensive. Nori is pretty cheap & in a form very practical for feeding. I also feed blended seafood bought fresh from the market.

That makes sense. I thought your idea was a good one though, to not let your algae go to waste LOL.

[vlangel]

[QUOTE=Chasmodes;25669625]Michael and Dawn, that's what happens with my entire yard!

I hear ya Kevin. I have a banner in my garden that reads:
Don't mind the weeds, I am feeding the bees! LOL

[vlangel]

[QUOTE=Chasmodes;25669625]Michael and Dawn, that's what happens with my entire yard!

I hear ya Kevin. I have a banner in my garden that reads:
Don't mind the weeds, I am feeding the bees! LOL

[Scrubber_steve]

Originally Posted by Chasmodes

yard!
That makes sense. I thought your idea was a good one though, to not let your algae go to waste LOL.

Its good garden compost

[Michael Hoaster]

True! Great garden compost.

[neilp2006]

amazing tank and macros- been a pleasure to read Michael. im in the process of doing the same thing in a 40gallon section of my sump and this has been an inspiration

I have a question from a few posts ago- you mentioned 'pulling' the shoal grass. Are you pulling up the entire root and stolons or just trimming back the leaves? Ive been looking for shoal grass but it looks like harvest season isnt here yet and the lockdown sitauation might make procurement difficult. If you are truly pulling it, it would be a shame to waste.

[neilp2006]

Originally Posted by Michael Hoaster

Those nutrient levels are perhaps too low, even for sps corals, so very challenging for plants. Seagrasses can flourish in lower nutrients, but not that low. I'd try to nudge those nutrient levels up to the higher accepted ranges for your corals. That's the tightrope.

I would definitely increase the fish feeding. That'll help get nitrate and phosphate up a little. For carbon, plants prefer CO2, so if you have a calcium reactor you're good. If not, typical reef tank alkalinity levels should provide enough bicarbonates for them to convert to CO2.

What you're doing is challenging, but I think it can be done, with a few changes. Right now, I think you are a little too reef oriented. Bump up those nutrients a touch. And remove the competition - the scrubber and refugium. The fast growing algae on scrubbers will always outcompete grasses for nutrients.

Whats a good nitrate/phosphate level for growing grasses? You say that 20ppm nitrate may be too low, but where is the sweet spot? ive been running my tank at 5ppm nitrate, 0.1ppm phosphate, but ive still to add sps. just lps and softies right now. I know they can be pushed higher, and id like to do SPS too.

thoughts on where i should aim, given that i currently have to dose nitrate and phosphate to hit those levels even with good feeding? i inadvertantly ran ULN for a few months about 18 months ago, and got hit bad with chrysophytes, and the only way to eradicate it was to dose. Ive ended up with a really robust denitrifying bacteria population that reduces my nitrate to 0ppm in 48 hours if i dont dose (180 g display, 180 sump system) so im already used to dialing in those parameters

also- any comment on CO2 injection vs maintaining a water change schedule? i find i dont have to do too many changes as my system stays pretty clean. with such a large volume, injection may be preferable over large volume WCs.

thanks!

[Michael Hoaster]

Thanks neilp2006! Your sump refugium sounds cool. What are you doing exactly?

On the shoal grass, yes I will be pulling some soon. I've pretty much promised those plants to vlangel. We're going to make a trade I think. If I have more I'd be happy to work something out with you too.

[neilp2006]

Awesome.

I have a 180g display and a basement fishroom with a 180 sump. Theres a 40g 32" chamber in there thats a failed chaeto fuge. Failed because ive never had nutrients high enough to support growth

Its coming uo for its 2 year birthday and im so bored looking at a dry chamber- so im building a small fake rock wall to separate the back 1/3rd from the front, and making a 7" deep mud bed in back for grasses, and a 2" deep bed to put rocks on for 5-6 macros.

Check out my awesome rendering, lol!

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[Michael Hoaster]

Neilp2006, I don't know what nitrate/phosphate levels are ideal for seagrasses. I do know the ratio of macro nutrients for seagrasses and macro algae (Carbon/Nitrogen/phosphorus-also known as C/N/P). That ratio is 550-30-1, known as the Atkins Ratio, not to be confused with the Redfield Ratio, which refers to phytoplankton.

In my tank, I'm feeding higher nutrients for strong plant growth, with no worries of corals. I rarely test. So I don't know the low end of their range. In the quote above, I'm suggesting you maintain nutrients at the higher end of the coral's range, so they're happy, and maybe there's little leftover for the grasses. I assume the corals are the priority. So start with the coral's preferred numbers. Sorry I don't have solid numbers for you on grasses. I have read that seagrass can outcompete macro algae by surviving in lower nutrient waters. This leads me to believe seagrasses could partner well with corals.

[Michael Hoaster]

Thanks for fleshing that out! I think your design should work well. Do you have a thread for this project? I'd follow!

[neilp2006]

I do on the other forum, kinda. Big build thread. But i will be doing a standalone since its a new project and would be a nice focussed thread.

I like your idea of doing 'ground cover' around the grasses- what are you using to do that?


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[Michael Hoaster]

Right on. I think it's worth it to do a thread.

I was hoping the Caulerpa verticillata (petticoat) was going to be my ground cover, but I'm not so sure. It doesn't seem to like the sand so much. I've shifted it to the fake wall and its doing very well. Right now I have a lot of gauzy algae between the grasses. The pods and mini serpent stars like it but I don't. It's brown. Not a fan of brown. I think a Herald's Angelfish would chow down on it, but I need to wait on that. I also tried fern and feather caulerpa between the grasses. I'm removing them. I like them in general, but I didn't like them in the grasses. I'd prefer to confine them to the wall.

So, my ground cover choice is undecided so far. Great refuge for pods 'n friends, so a good idea I think. I may try to chill and see what Nature comes up with. As long as it's not hideous and provides good refuge…

[neilp2006]

Oof. This is an awesome thread... power reading through it for info. I think im at post 450 or so, lol

I love the substrate. Ive been planning to layer 1" sugar sand, 4" sand and miracle mud mix, 2" top layer of medium course special grade. Thinking if a few flourish tabs right at 4" firva boost.

That would allow me to plant the grass stolons 4" deep, right into that mud mix.

A question, if i may- i love microfauna, but the idea of adding non-quarantined live mud into my clean system (ive been meticulous with QT everything so far) gives me pause. Where are you sourcing things like microbristleworms, etc?

I plan to QT my mud crew by setting up a smaller tank, and adding saltwater adapted mollies as 'canaries'. I can then let it go for 2 weeks, them if the mollies are clean, use the substrate in the seagrass section.

This, of course, depends on the source of the 'live mud'- if its a fish-less system, im good. I just dont know really where to start procuring that.


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[Michael Hoaster]

Thanks for reading neilp2006!

Indo-Pacific Sea Farms (ipsf.com) has some great detrivores, and other critters - Captive bred. Your substrate sounds good. I applaud your meticulousness! QT to your heart's content. The mollies won't give birth to babies if there is ICH.

I got my mud from my yard. If I couldn't do that I'd buy garden soil with no vermiculite.