N/P reducing pellets (solid vodka dosing) - Page 6

Frogmanx82 · 10/29/2009, 11:20 PM

Will pods or bristleworms eat the biopellets?

Frogmanx82 · 10/29/2009, 11:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eliashickman

I just got finished talking with the owner of D. van Houten. Mr. Houten himself. A really great guy by the way.

http://www.dvh-import.com/Site2/english/Contact.html

Okay so for ordering, you can just send him money through info@dvh-import.com he said.

So I ordered a liter by going to the site and using paypal to send payment to the email address after exchanging a few emails.

Question, will pods or bristleworms eat the biopellets?

tatuvaaj · 10/30/2009, 01:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frogmanx82

Question, will pods or bristleworms eat the biopellets?

I don't think so. If you somehow manage to introduce them into the tank some deposit feeders like sea cucumbers would love to eat the bacteria growing on the pellets but my guess is that the pellets themselves would come out of the animal unharmed

tatuvaaj · 10/30/2009, 01:04 AM

Seems like the placement of the pellets inside the sump is important: yesterday I moved them in front of the skimmer (as recommended by the manufacturer) and noticed 0.2 higher pH (7.8 -> 8.0) in the morning.

Initially I wasn't concerned about this because of the very high water exchange rate between the tank and the sump but it really seems to matter!

buddah001 · 10/30/2009, 07:27 AM

[QUOTE=Frogmanx82;15941014]So I ordered a liter by going to the site and using paypal to send payment to the email address after exchanging a few emails.

How much was liter delivered?

Frogmanx82 · 10/30/2009, 07:47 AM

[QUOTE=buddah001;15941768]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frogmanx82

So I ordered a liter by going to the site and using paypal to send payment to the email address after exchanging a few emails.

How much was liter delivered?

$125

chaderic26 · 10/30/2009, 07:57 AM

[QUOTE=Frogmanx82;15941850]

Quote:

Originally Posted by buddah001

$125

Did you get a kiss first?

Frogmanx82 · 10/30/2009, 08:51 AM

They better be some darn good pellets or I got something other than a kiss.

AquariumSpecialty · 10/30/2009, 10:57 AM

Please vist our Sponsor forum for more info on NP Biopellets.

Thank you,

Frogmanx82 · 10/30/2009, 01:55 PM

Well I ordered from dvh but Aquarium Specialty now has them.
http://www.aquariumspecialty.com/cat...?cPath=103_777

At 99 a liter plus shipping, I maybe could have saved a couple bucks, not much.

We really need to get some data on the performance of these pellets, where they can be used, and should the bacteria be filtered out or does it depend on whether you have filter feeders in the tank.

eliashickman · 10/31/2009, 02:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by buddah001

So how do we get these?

Check my post a few up. I went ahead and sent money, via PayPal, to the info@dvh-import.com.
I used Skype to call him to find out about shipping and handling. I don't know what that is for the States but I'm sure some of these other guys could tell you. I'm sure it's either 25 euros or some standard flat rate.

BTW, I just ordered mine. I can't wait till the come.

tatuvaaj · 10/31/2009, 03:02 AM

Very nice that we have more people trying this product out, be sure to report your findings here

Some reported observations:
- Improved water clarity (CDOM reduction?)
- Lower nitrate (as expected)
- No effect on phosphates (doesn't make sense... do the pellets contain phosphorous? Bacteria promoted by this media has unusually high N:P ratio? Or is it simply because of low N:P ratio in water column?)
- Very high bacterial biomass production (expected)
- Lower tank pH (expected, depends on nutrient levels)
- Works best in fluidizing reactor (?)

tatuvaaj · 10/31/2009, 03:07 AM

Double

Frogmanx82 · 10/31/2009, 08:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tatuvaaj

Very nice that we have more people trying this product out, be sure to report your findings here

Some reported observations:
- Improved water clarity (CDOM reduction?)
- Lower nitrate (as expected)
- No effect on phosphates (doesn't make sense... do the pellets contain phosphorous? Bacteria promoted by this media has unusually high N:P ratio? Or is it simply because of low N:P ratio in water column?)
- Very high bacterial biomass production (expected)
- Lower tank pH (expected, depends on nutrient levels)
- Works best in fluidizing reactor (?)

I was really hoping for a phosphate reduction. Are we sure about the effects or non effects on phosphate. How good is the data?

NaClH2Opgh · 10/31/2009, 08:40 AM

I am curious. When this was first pitched, they did so as an alternative to carbon dosing. Carbon dosing does indeed reduce phosphates along with Nitrates. In my experience with dosing vodka the phosphates just take longer to start coming down. I had zero Nitrates for a couple months but still had phosphate issues. The phosphates did eventually come down though. If this has no effect on phosphates then this is a very expensive Nitrate only remover.

tatuvaaj · 10/31/2009, 08:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frogmanx82

I was really hoping for a phosphate reduction. Are we sure about the effects or non effects on phosphate. How good is the data?

Nonexistent, almost

I just posted what the handful of people here and some other forums have reported.

The pellets are certainly working (producing large amount of biomass) so there must be reduction in phosphate together with nitrogen. Why me and some others don't see it in measurements is the question. I wouldn't rule out operator error

I had an interesting case after washing the pellets completely and letting the bacteria back into the tank: in 24 hrs the PO4 dropped from 0.1 to "zero". Unfortunately the concentration went back to 0.1 - 0.2 in a few days.

tmz · 10/31/2009, 08:49 AM

Might be useful to post N and P ratios along with observations.

NaClH2Opgh · 10/31/2009, 10:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tatuvaaj

Nonexistent, almost

I just posted what the handful of people here and some other forums have reported.

The pellets are certainly working (producing large amount of biomass) so there must be reduction in phosphate together with nitrogen. Why me and some others don't see it in measurements is the question. I wouldn't rule out operator error

I had an interesting case after washing the pellets completely and letting the bacteria back into the tank: in 24 hrs the PO4 dropped from 0.1 to "zero". Unfortunately the concentration went back to 0.1 - 0.2 in a few days.

What are you using to test for phosphates? I hope not a regular test kit.

tatuvaaj · 10/31/2009, 02:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NaClH2Opgh

What are you using to test for phosphates? I hope not a regular test kit.

I'm not sure what you mean by "regular test kit"? Testing for reactive phosphate in seawater is pretty standard method and all kits I've used have been basically the same.

Anyway, I currently use Salifert, Merck and Gilbers kits.

Frogmanx82 · 10/31/2009, 04:06 PM

Phosphates can leach out of rocks so an immediate reduction may not be seen. I travel and so consistent vodka dosing doesn't work for me so the biopellets are my option to setting up an automatic dosing which may end up being cheaper than the biopellet option.

There needs to be a better presentation of what we can really expect out of these. Is it exactly like carbon dosing? Probably not, but a better understanding of whats going on would be nice. I've got the pellets coming. I'll let you know how the phosphates react. My nitrates are pretty low at less than 5 but not 0.

NaClH2Opgh · 10/31/2009, 08:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tatuvaaj

I'm not sure what you mean by "regular test kit"? Testing for reactive phosphate in seawater is pretty standard method and all kits I've used have been basically the same.

Anyway, I currently use Salifert, Merck and Gilbers kits.

I tried all the test kits and never seemed to get an accurate reading. They always read zero. When I got a Hannah meter, I got a more accurate reading.

Frogmanx82 · 10/31/2009, 10:05 PM

I may get a hannah meter. The phosphate tests are not accurate at low levels. After looking at what I've spent this month, I may need to defer.

Maybe I'll ask for one for Christmas.

tatuvaaj · 11/01/2009, 12:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frogmanx82

Phosphates can leach out of rocks so an immediate reduction may not be seen.

Frogmanx82,

That is very good point and is likely the explanation in my case

ksed · 11/01/2009, 01:19 PM

For anybody with questions regarding phosphates.
When heavy feeding is required, it is recommended to combine the pellets with standard phosphate adsorbents. The reason for this is that most aquarium feeds contain higher levels of phosphate than is consumed by bacteria, fish and invertebrates, when compared to nitrogen.So it does remove phoshates,but if you put more phosphates in than nitrates then you are out of balance.

Kevin

recife111 · 11/03/2009, 01:30 AM

These Np pellets could be Polyhydroxybutyrate?? used in wastewater

10/29/2009, 11:20 PM	#126
Frogmanx82 Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Charlotte, NC Posts: 1,515	Will pods or bristleworms eat the biopellets? __________________ Exodus 8:2 Check my homepage for tank pics and details. Current Tank Info: 90 gallon, 2x maxspect R420R LED, 4 Ocellaris Clowns, Yellow Eye Kole Tang, Flame Angel, Foxface Rabbitfish, Banggai Cardinals, Azure Damsel, rock flower anemone, cleaner shrimp, serpent star

10/30/2009, 01:04 AM	#129
tatuvaaj Pro-Protozoa Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Tampere, Finland Posts: 1,228	Seems like the placement of the pellets inside the sump is important: yesterday I moved them in front of the skimmer (as recommended by the manufacturer) and noticed 0.2 higher pH (7.8 -> 8.0) in the morning. Initially I wasn't concerned about this because of the very high water exchange rate between the tank and the sump but it really seems to matter! __________________ Tatu Vaajalahti Tampere, Finland Current Tank Info: 240 gal + 50 gal sump,SDSB,LR,ATB Medium, 2x250W HQI + actinic,Balling

10/30/2009, 08:51 AM	#133
Frogmanx82 Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Charlotte, NC Posts: 1,515	They better be some darn good pellets or I got something other than a kiss. __________________ Exodus 8:2 Check my homepage for tank pics and details. Current Tank Info: 90 gallon, 2x maxspect R420R LED, 4 Ocellaris Clowns, Yellow Eye Kole Tang, Flame Angel, Foxface Rabbitfish, Banggai Cardinals, Azure Damsel, rock flower anemone, cleaner shrimp, serpent star

10/30/2009, 01:55 PM	#135
Frogmanx82 Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Charlotte, NC Posts: 1,515	Well I ordered from dvh but Aquarium Specialty now has them. http://www.aquariumspecialty.com/cat...?cPath=103_777 At 99 a liter plus shipping, I maybe could have saved a couple bucks, not much. We really need to get some data on the performance of these pellets, where they can be used, and should the bacteria be filtered out or does it depend on whether you have filter feeders in the tank. __________________ Exodus 8:2 Check my homepage for tank pics and details. Current Tank Info: 90 gallon, 2x maxspect R420R LED, 4 Ocellaris Clowns, Yellow Eye Kole Tang, Flame Angel, Foxface Rabbitfish, Banggai Cardinals, Azure Damsel, rock flower anemone, cleaner shrimp, serpent star

10/31/2009, 03:02 AM	#137
tatuvaaj Pro-Protozoa Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Tampere, Finland Posts: 1,228	Very nice that we have more people trying this product out, be sure to report your findings here Some reported observations: - Improved water clarity (CDOM reduction?) - Lower nitrate (as expected) - No effect on phosphates (doesn't make sense... do the pellets contain phosphorous? Bacteria promoted by this media has unusually high N:P ratio? Or is it simply because of low N:P ratio in water column?) - Very high bacterial biomass production (expected) - Lower tank pH (expected, depends on nutrient levels) - Works best in fluidizing reactor (?) __________________ Tatu Vaajalahti Tampere, Finland Current Tank Info: 240 gal + 50 gal sump,SDSB,LR,ATB Medium, 2x250W HQI + actinic,Balling

10/30/2009, 07:27 AM	#130
buddah001 Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Genoa, IL Posts: 599	[QUOTE=Frogmanx82;15941014]So I ordered a liter by going to the site and using paypal to send payment to the email address after exchanging a few emails. How much was liter delivered?

10/30/2009, 10:57 AM	#134
AquariumSpecialty .Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Columbia SC Posts: 323	Please vist our Sponsor forum for more info on NP Biopellets. Thank you,

10/31/2009, 03:07 AM	#138
tatuvaaj Pro-Protozoa Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Tampere, Finland Posts: 1,228	Double __________________ Tatu Vaajalahti Tampere, Finland Current Tank Info: 240 gal + 50 gal sump,SDSB,LR,ATB Medium, 2x250W HQI + actinic,Balling Last edited by tatuvaaj; 10/31/2009 at 03:12 AM.

10/31/2009, 08:40 AM	#140
NaClH2Opgh Moved On Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Pittsburgh, PA. Posts: 647	I am curious. When this was first pitched, they did so as an alternative to carbon dosing. Carbon dosing does indeed reduce phosphates along with Nitrates. In my experience with dosing vodka the phosphates just take longer to start coming down. I had zero Nitrates for a couple months but still had phosphate issues. The phosphates did eventually come down though. If this has no effect on phosphates then this is a very expensive Nitrate only remover.

10/31/2009, 08:49 AM	#142
tmz ReefKeeping Mag staff Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: West Seneca NY Posts: 27,691	Might be useful to post N and P ratios along with observations. __________________ Tom Current Tank Info: Tank of the Month , November 2011 : 600gal integrated system: 3 display tanks (120 g, 90g, 89g),several frag/grow out tanks, macroalgae refugia, cryptic zones. 40+ fish, seahorses, sps,lps,leathers, zoanthidae and non photosynthetic corals.

10/31/2009, 04:06 PM	#145
Frogmanx82 Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Charlotte, NC Posts: 1,515	Phosphates can leach out of rocks so an immediate reduction may not be seen. I travel and so consistent vodka dosing doesn't work for me so the biopellets are my option to setting up an automatic dosing which may end up being cheaper than the biopellet option. There needs to be a better presentation of what we can really expect out of these. Is it exactly like carbon dosing? Probably not, but a better understanding of whats going on would be nice. I've got the pellets coming. I'll let you know how the phosphates react. My nitrates are pretty low at less than 5 but not 0. __________________ Exodus 8:2 Check my homepage for tank pics and details. Current Tank Info: 90 gallon, 2x maxspect R420R LED, 4 Ocellaris Clowns, Yellow Eye Kole Tang, Flame Angel, Foxface Rabbitfish, Banggai Cardinals, Azure Damsel, rock flower anemone, cleaner shrimp, serpent star

10/31/2009, 10:05 PM	#147
Frogmanx82 Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Charlotte, NC Posts: 1,515	I may get a hannah meter. The phosphate tests are not accurate at low levels. After looking at what I've spent this month, I may need to defer. Maybe I'll ask for one for Christmas. __________________ Exodus 8:2 Check my homepage for tank pics and details. Current Tank Info: 90 gallon, 2x maxspect R420R LED, 4 Ocellaris Clowns, Yellow Eye Kole Tang, Flame Angel, Foxface Rabbitfish, Banggai Cardinals, Azure Damsel, rock flower anemone, cleaner shrimp, serpent star

11/01/2009, 01:19 PM	#149
ksed Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 1,867	For anybody with questions regarding phosphates. When heavy feeding is required, it is recommended to combine the pellets with standard phosphate adsorbents. The reason for this is that most aquarium feeds contain higher levels of phosphate than is consumed by bacteria, fish and invertebrates, when compared to nitrogen.So it does remove phoshates,but if you put more phosphates in than nitrates then you are out of balance. Kevin

11/03/2009, 01:30 AM	#150
recife111 Moved On Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 386	These Np pellets could be Polyhydroxybutyrate?? used in wastewater