Caribbean Biotope Seagrass Tank

[Michael Hoaster]

Thanks, collegereefs!

I am thinking about what fish next. I was considering doing a harem of Cherub Angels, but I think they might be too mean for my peaceful community. If they stress other fish out, they stress me out-not cool. The Blue Chromis is an option, but I don't want them to kill each other off. I've been looking and reading, but I'm just not sure what to add next. I may take the opportunity to get a few more small fish like sail fin blennies.

Any ideas?

[wilder]

Love how the tank is soo natural. I've done freshwater planted, but would love to try manatee and shoal grass in the future.
As far as fish, I was going to suggest Caribbean sailfin blennies. I have them, barnacle blennies and yellowhead jawfish planned for my next tank along with a few other Caribbean species.
BTW your tank is such an inspiration to me.

[Michael Hoaster]

Thank you, wilder!

This tank was originally a reef tank, but I was never able to achieve my goals. I just wasn't good enough! Then I tried my hand at fresh water planted, and did very well. I love plants! And I love how they make keeping an aquarium so much easier. Plants are the missing piece of the puzzle! I also think changing up what you're doing, as I did, helps you grow as an aquarist and get better at it.

With this salt water planted tank, I am combining what I've learned on the reef side with the planted side, and it works! I also realized that I just didn't want a lot of technology. I wanted to rely more on the natural processes that are already there, waiting to help. So, I keep it pretty low tech, and spend more time observing and thinking. I love a good gadget. I just think our hobby is getting a bit too obsessed with them.

I like your fish choices for your next tank!

Thanks for posting!

[Michael Hoaster]

Tall seagrasses, a happy condylactis anemone, and caulerpa racemosa coming back, on the back wall. I'm also seeing some turf algae come back, which is nice and very natural looking. Lots of tiny red plants popping up on rocks around the tank. It's fun watching the plants regrow! Everyday it changes.

Sponge hunt today! I captured some purple encrusting sponge and some pink sponge. I cut them into pieces and distributed them around the roots, rocks and wall - at the right end of the tank, with lower light levels. If these guys take off, it's going to be pretty cool!

[taricha]

Love seeing your tank progress.
Question since you watched it more closely than anyone. How much bigger do you think the tank would have had to be to outdo the tang's appetite in macro growth?

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[Michael Hoaster]

Thanks, taricha!

Man, that's a good question! I tipped the balance myself, when I removed the huge overhanging bunch of caulerpa. Had I left that alone, I'm confident there'd still be enough. Plus, I added him when the caulerpa wasn't in an overgrown state. So, I think I could have made it a year or so. But those tangs get big, so I'm sure he would have overtaken growth at some point. I think somewhere in the 300-400 gallon range would do it, if allowed to overgrow into a massive jungle.

The problem with a massive jungle is it doesn't look so great as a display. And at that point, you've really just got yourself a huge species tank. So, it was a pretty cool experiment. It relieved me of pruning duty for a while, which was nice. It was fascinating, watching him feed naturally too.

I wonder if there is another, smaller species, that could work better in my tank.

[Darth_Tater]

I've been browsing around the internets today (VERY slow day at work...) and happened across the Flower Garden Banks National Marine Sanctuary website. They have a list of species of fish that frequent the sanctuary, and among the list was Ptereleotris Calliura, AKA Blue Dartfish AKA Blue Goby. They looked interesting, but I didn't find any for sale in a quick web search.

I also happened across a thread about Purple Chromis on RC. A former Caribbean fish collector chimed in and mentioned Blue Reef Chromis. Here's the link: http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/sh...05&postcount=5.

If I'm understanding correctly, he says that Blue Reef Chromis are peaceful with each other if they have enough space. But, of course, this is only one person's experience and I haven't seen much else written about them.

[Michael Hoaster]

Wow, thanks, Darth Tater!

I've looked at the blue dartfish a few times. They sell them at KP Aquatics. It sounds like they associate with yellowhead jawfish, using their old burrows. Since I have ruled out jawfish for this tank, I kind of ruled these out too. I wonder if they would take to the gramma caves in the back wall, without jawfish?

I have also looked at the purple and sunshine chromis. Both apparently get big, mean and dull. But not the blue! So maybe I'll give them a try.

[Darth_Tater]

No problem! I too have been thinking about Blue Chromis for my tank. It's a much smaller tank though, so it would just be an individual. I just can't find much info on them. It's kinda weird since most big retailers seem to sell them.

[jraker]

Originally Posted by Darth_Tater

I just can't find much info on them. It's kinda weird since most big retailers seem to sell them.

Same here. Everyone sells them, no one has any info on them. Many online retailers say that blue chromis reach a maximum length of 5 inches, but I have yet to see one over 3 inches. Even in the wild, all of them were in the two inch range.

[Michael Hoaster]

Yes, I think the blues reach 3 inches. I have seen the blue green chromis in the five inch range, but not the blues. I'd like to try them. Maybe with lots of room (and hidey holes) and 3 feedings a day they'll live in harmony. From what I've read, they school as juveniles. Then they mature into grumpy individuals. But at least they stay pretty!

[Michael Hoaster]

Got some pix:


Now that the grammas are the stars of the show, I thought I'd try and get some good ones of them.








Eye-melter!







See the dark area? That's her guts.











OK, here you can see the blue hypnea emerging from the substrate. Also note the tiny, red macros, springing from the rocks.

[sam.basye]

Holy snails! Them things are everywhere!
You weren't kidding there's a lot.
How many do you think you have total?

Pictures look great!

[Michael Hoaster]

Funny, I hardly notice them! I bet there's a thousand of them.

[jraker]

Looks like Phyllis left some aiptasia before she was removed.

[Michael Hoaster]

Yeah bummer! I carefully observed, and they appeared gone for a week before I removed her. But I guess she left enough remains for them to come back - yay… It would seem that you'd need to keep a file fish permanently, to guarantee aiptasia don't return. I wish I could have kept Phyllis, but she was going after my gorgonia and spaghetti worms and possibly even the condylactis. I guess it's back to the chemicals!

[Chibils]

Originally Posted by Michael Hoaster

It's really just the "dream phase" right now. I'd like to apply some of the things I've learned with this tank, to something big enough to comfortably house these "dream fish". It would incorporate a gyre flow, like this one, but with larger, identical pumps at each end, on closed loops. I'd also incorporate more rocky structure at both ends and another fake wall with the bottle caves, for housing. Seagrass would dominate the wide open sand bed. There would be less focus on sessile invertebrates, since the fish would consume them, so it would be more like a FOWLR tank, but with plants. I'd probably go sump-less again. I'm also thinking of a coast to coast overflow, with a trickle tower built in to generate nitrate, so I wouldn't have to dose it.

As for size, I'm thinking maybe eight feet long, three feet front to back, and twenty eight inches tall or so.

I'm kind of partial to the Banded Butterfly, but I may try others as well.

There's a really cool Lookdown/Gyre tank in Atlanta that I find very inspiring. Here's a link: http://youtu.be/jPxeMALyfn4

It bears no resemblance to any ecosystem and it has way too many fish in it, but the concept is cool and would be the foundation for what I'm thinking.

Anyway, it's fun to think about!

Very cool video, Michael! SEA Atlanta was my closest and best LFS for a bit before they closed their storefront and I wasn't aware of this tank! Absolutely incredible!

I haven't been to your thread in a little while, so I just wanted to say that I'm sad to see Phyllis go (I'm hooked on filefish - when I get my tank set up, an ORA filefish is going to be the centerpiece!)

I'm also very sad to see Mr. Zippy go. He's been a part of this thread longer than I have and it looked like he'd transitioned almost fully to blue.

Have you considered a butterflyfish? I don't know how they do with macros and sponges, aren't most of them planktivores/corallivores?

The tank is looking great and you've been a big inspiration on the direction of my future build.

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[Michael Hoaster]

It's nice to hear from you again, Chibils!

That Lookdown tank is cool! I want Lookdowns so bad!

I really miss Phyllis. Great fish! And they're easily sexable, so you could do harem or pairs, if you had room for them. I still hold out hope that I could find a caribbean species, that won't harm my desirable inverts. But Phyllis was not that.

Zippy the tang will be missed too. It was awesome observing his changing color. As much as I enjoyed having him, he forced me to come to the conclusion that I wanted macros more.

These are the tough choices we have to make as aquarists, sometimes. IMO it's much worse to keep a destructive-to-your-ecosystem fish, purely for sentimental reasons. I see it all the time. Sometimes pet ownership wins out over ecosystem management, unfortunately. Going down that road, leads you to a rather boring "fish tank". So we have to be dispassionate in order to reach our goals, at times.

Boy have I considered butterfly fish! Unfortunately, they eat anemones and gorgonia. If I were to lose those critters, I'd be all over them!

Thank you for the tank compliment, and I'm thrilled it's an inspiration for your future build. I'd love to hear what you've got planned!

[Chibils]

Hmm, I didn't know about the nem and gorg eating. What other "large" personality fish are there in the Caribbean? It seems they all would munch on sponges and gorgs since that's the abundant food source, right?
Edit: what about Xanthichthys triggers? X. ringens (sargassum trigger) ranges from the southern US to Brazil. Divers Den has one for 179 right now. Have you looked into Caribbean squirrelfish also?

They can be a bit to a lot pricey, but they're planktivores that don't touch gorgs that I know of, and shouldn't destroy your macros like a tang. Maybe I'm wrong.

The tank is definitely looking great. I think it will be good to see the macros growing back in.

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[jraker]

I never did notice that the Sargassum Trigger was a Caribbean species. I would say to get one also, because that might just be the personality fish you are looking for.

[Michael Hoaster]

It's tricky! Not so much finding a personality fish, as finding one that doesn't wipe out other inhabitants that I'd prefer to keep.

I'll take a look at caribbean triggers and squirrels, but I think off the top of my head they'd eat my blennies and grammas.

I'm enjoying the "rebirth" of macro algae all over the tank. It's bouncing back - stay tuned!

[Michael Hoaster]

Thanks guys for the suggestions! I honestly haven't even considered a trigger!

So I looked at the trigger and squirrel - both eat small fish - bummer. Plus, I don't think I have a big enough spot for the trigger to sleep, at the moment. A very outside-the-box idea though! A pair of flame cardinals is an option, though they're not much for personality IMO.

I'd like to get a schooling fish, like the blue chromis, or possibly copper sweepers, or maybe even silversides. I'd like to get a medium fish with personality. I'm also dwelling on a harem of cherub angels…

[taricha]

Originally Posted by Michael Hoaster

I'd like to get a schooling fish, like the blue chromis, or possibly copper sweepers, or maybe even silversides.

Used to have some silversides. They schooled really tight together but weren't very active.
Although, that might have been because they were in a bag in my freezer.

[sam.basye]

Originally Posted by taricha

Used to have some silversides. They schooled really tight together but weren't very active.
Although, that might have been because they were in a bag in my freezer.

Lmao! Funniest thing I've read is while.

[Michael Hoaster]

Ha!

I am kind of curious to see how (live) silversides would work in my tank. I worry they might wipe out my pods, since that's what they eat, but I'm sure the grammas would enjoy having them (for dinner). mblaquaculture.com sells them, and also mysis. It would be interesting to see how my ecosystem would be affected by adding silversides and mysis. I imagine they'd be around for a little while, gradually disappearing over a few months. My pods would surely take a hit, but those are easily replenished. It's a thought.