Sulfur DeNitrators - Page 9

skydancer · 12/05/2007, 10:30 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by mz3bo
wholy batman thread resurrection...

My SWC reactor is running for 3 days now, however, my water output is showing CRAZY BAD numbers...

No3 = +100 PPM
No2 = + 5 PPM

In the tank:
No3 = 45 PPM
No2 = 0.25 PPM

Also, the effluent smells eggs, and drip rate is at 1 per second.

What sould I do ??? I am now trasing all drops, preventing it from going into the tank...

Thanks

Your dinitrifier hasn't cycled yet. Slooow down the drip rate as much as you can (1 drop per minute if possible) and wait for the nitrates to go to zero. Test the affluent periodically (3 - 5 days). In about 3 weeks to 1 month you should have 0 nitrates, and then you increase the drip rate slowly to 5 drips per second or more...
Good luck

skydancer · 12/25/2007, 08:48 PM

Here are some more of my "experiences" of the unit in the two plus years that I own one. (XL size in a 300 gal system).

I would recommend the denitrifier, but there are a few details that the user needs to know to get the most benefit of the unit from day one.

I found these things over the course of owning one for 2 years, instead of Midwest having the recommendations included in the manual from day one.
The bottom line is this.
1) start cycling the unit as they recommend in the manual.
2) if your system has hi nitrates (mine was at 80) in a time period of 2 to 3 months your system will be down to 10 or less BUT... the denitrifier will have built up A LOT OF BACTERIA in the reactor because there was a lot of food for the bacteria to munch on.
3) After about 3 months I'd recommend opening up the unit, rinse the sulfur media and put it back but replace the ARM media. Then cycle the unit again per the instruction in the manual. BTW, the unit will cycle a lot faster this time, as the sulfur media is seeded well.

The reason for this sulfur rinse as a first step of maintenance is that as your nitrates go down there is less and less food for the bacteria to feed on so they die off. As they die off, the water starts smelling like rotten eggs and it screws up with the system's water chemistry. (That was my mistake, as I didn't know and left black/dead bacteria in the unti for a long time).

From then on, monitor the unit and once it takes the nitrates down to zero, go thru the above rinsing the sulfur cycle again, and you'll be fine.
The idea is, like everything else in the reef, to create an equilibrium between the nitrates generated by the system, and the amount of nitrate-eating-bacteria in the reactor.

As a word of caution, if you ever see black bacteria in the reactor, open it up and rinse the sulfur.
Other than that, it works great... and it should reduce your nitrate down to zero, provided you do it right.

I wish I had these instructions when I first set up my unit.
Good luck.

RobNJ · 01/19/2008, 09:30 PM

Hey Sky... I had the rotten eggs smell also so I opened mine up and rinsed it and the smell is gone. Question for you. I saw you mentioned using ARM to refill the reactor? Any reason in particular. I had extra left over from when I got my unit, about 4 months ago. However I decided to upgrade it to ARM as well, not even reading this post. I used the larger piece ARM. Do you think I will have a problem? Also does this reasctor really replenish Calcium? I thought you needed a Calcium Reactor with C02 to do such a thing.

I had Nitrates near 100... Now I have none, well the salifert test shows the slightest hint of pink so I would assume its less than 10...

Great Product

skydancer · 01/19/2008, 10:37 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by RobNJ
Hey Sky... I had the rotten eggs smell also so I opened mine up and rinsed it and the smell is gone. Question for you. I saw you mentioned using ARM to refill the reactor? Any reason in particular. I had extra left over from when I got my unit, about 4 months ago. However I decided to upgrade it to ARM as well, not even reading this post. I used the larger piece ARM. Do you think I will have a problem? Also does this reasctor really replenish Calcium? I thought you needed a Calcium Reactor with C02 to do such a thing.

I had Nitrates near 100... Now I have none, well the salifert test shows the slightest hint of pink so I would assume its less than 10...

Great Product

The top half of the reactor should be filled with ARM media to raise the ph of the water after it goes thru the surfur media.
The ARM is not there to provide calcium to the system. But according to the instruction manual, it should be replaced every time the unit is opened and the sulfur is rinsed.

mz3bo · 01/20/2008, 07:18 AM

Hey,

I had my reactor for over 3 months now. My main problem is that it is getting clogged with white thick gelly stuff " I think it's bacteria ". In three months, I had to clean it 4 times since water will not flow anymore... My tank No3 is quite low, only 2-5ppm...

Anyone can help...

Thanks

skydancer · 01/20/2008, 08:31 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by mz3bo
Hey,

I had my reactor for over 3 months now. My main problem is that it is getting clogged with white thick gelly stuff " I think it's bacteria ". In three months, I had to clean it 4 times since water will not flow anymore... My tank No3 is quite low, only 2-5ppm...

Anyone can help...

Thanks

You should rinse the sulfur media VERY WELL to get rid of the white bacteria as best as you can. Also clean the lines and the pump.
In the past 3 months, the reactor did its job, since the NO3 in your system is down to 2-5. Now you need to go to the "maintenance mode".
You will only need a small amount of bacteria to maintain your system at 0 NO3.
HTH.

mz3bo · 01/20/2008, 10:09 AM

Hi,

What is the "maintenance mode" consist of ?

Thanks

skydancer · 01/20/2008, 10:57 AM

Here it is:
When you first started your system nitrates were let's say 100.

Step 1:
You put the reactor on line and in 3 months your system nitrates went down to 2-5 (as you stated earlier).

During these 3 months the nitrate-eating bacteria in the reactor multiplied fast and started eating all the food (system nitrates). As more bacteria were generated in the reactor (white slime), the system nitrates went down.

Now you have just completed the NITRATE REDUCTION CYCLE in your system. BUT, you have an excess number of nitrate-eating bacteria in your reactor and your system doesn't have enough food to support this many bacteria. So the bacteria in the reactor will die off (food starvation) and the rotten egg smell starts...

Step 2:
Now you want to go to the "maintenance mode", where you create a bacteria/nitrate equilibrium as follows:
The number of nitrate-eating bacteria in the reactor should be equivalent to the amount of food (nitrates) generated by your system.
The way to do that is to wash/rinse the sulfur media in the reactor (also don't forget to replace the ARM media) to get rid of the excess bacteria. Then put the reactor back on line and enough bacteria will be generated to eat the lesser amount of food (nitrates in the system). Therefore the maintenance mode.

I disagree with people that take their reactor off line once the nitrates are zero. The reason is, the system nitrates will go back up, and then they will have to start the cycle again.

khoivo1 · 02/28/2008, 12:27 PM

hi all,,,after install my xl dinitrifier from midwest i noted my ALK is raise up,,,is this normal/?// it will go down by it own right?/ or should i do water change?? this is 300g system,,,thanks

Scalare102079 · 04/21/2008, 04:23 PM

Does anyone know where you can find the instructions online? I have checked the midwest website, but couldn't find it. I just purchased one secondhand from a shop that went under and the fellow didn't have the manual anymore. Thanks all! Looking forward to seeing results!

Avi · 04/21/2008, 07:36 PM

I think you'll find what you want here, Scalare.....

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&s...estaquatic+pdf

Scalare102079 · 04/22/2008, 09:29 AM

Avi, don't know how I missed it... you rock! thanks!

Scalare102079 · 04/22/2008, 09:29 AM

Avi, don't know how I missed it... you rock! thanks!

tubsy3 · 07/14/2008, 07:37 PM

Did midwest aquatics go out of business or something? I placed an order for a denitrator and paid by paypal but still have not heard anythign from them about the order nor have they replied to my emails? Anyone else have a problem getting in contact with them?

Avi · 07/15/2008, 06:53 AM

Hmmmm....I just looked at their forum at their website and there are current posts. Why not post there and see if you get some answer to your inquiry, tubsy?

Scalare102079 · 09/15/2008, 04:30 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by tubsy3
Did midwest aquatics go out of business or something? I placed an order for a denitrator and paid by paypal but still have not heard anythign from them about the order nor have they replied to my emails? Anyone else have a problem getting in contact with them?

How long ago did you place the order?

tubsy3 · 09/15/2008, 09:38 AM

Oh I never replied to the thread here. Forgot I had it. They were away on business when I ordered. They got back to me and sent it when they returned from the trip. Great product.

Scalare102079 · 11/19/2008, 11:50 AM

Updates??? Tubsy3? Anyone?
I am getting mine online this thursday, my nitrates are 16 ppm

Scalare102079 · 11/19/2008, 11:50 AM

Updates??? Tubsy3? Anyone?
I am getting mine online this thursday, my nitrates are 16 ppm

Scalare102079 · 11/19/2008, 11:51 AM

sorry, double post for some reason.

steved350 · 12/16/2009, 12:17 PM

Any new updates on the Denitrator?

virgin reefer · 12/27/2009, 02:38 PM

I am still pondering the diatom filter, however, there is a nagging feeling that it is only a band aid and not a long term solution to my problems. I am seriousley considering a Sulfer DeNitrifier from Midwest. I have just started my research but looks to good to be true, ofcourse the price is a little harsh....but if it really does what it says....

My nitrates are still over 50 ppm and I have been doing water changes 2x a week for months. I think my live rock is holding the nitrates and leaching them back out. If I look at my cost of the tank the denitrifier looks more appealing.

Lindsay

BTW 90G with 75G sump, tunze skimmer, 440 VHO, yada...yada.

Sullyman · 12/27/2009, 04:28 PM

Have you used a powerhead to blow the rocks out, do that before water changes and do it til no more silt comes out of your rocks and they won't be leaching anymore.

virgin reefer · 12/27/2009, 05:26 PM

I use a turkey baster, and I have used the powerhead by hand to blow the rocks. Main problem with that is the LPS hates the movement. I do it as part of my maintenance but it seems no matter how much I do it...never helps.

I also stirred up my fuge and did a water change out on that part of my sump (about 35G), I was told that the nitrates could be held in there. Had never done it because of my Mandarin but since he has long been gone....

I want a wave powerhead to put at the bottom of the tank and face it up through the back of my rocks....the one I really like though is like $150 and I can't spend that on a PH.

My main ?'s with the nitrifier is:

1) does it replace dosing calcium/ALK at least in part.
2) Is there anywhere in Ontario Canada that sells them.

Thanks for the reply.

Sullyman · 12/27/2009, 09:09 PM

It won't help your calcium. Have you considered Vodka or other products like macrobachter7 to help get rid of the nitrate?

12/25/2007, 08:48 PM	#202
skydancer Registered Member Join Date: May 2004 Location: Dallas, Texas Posts: 438	Here are some more of my "experiences" of the unit in the two plus years that I own one. (XL size in a 300 gal system). I would recommend the denitrifier, but there are a few details that the user needs to know to get the most benefit of the unit from day one. I found these things over the course of owning one for 2 years, instead of Midwest having the recommendations included in the manual from day one. The bottom line is this. 1) start cycling the unit as they recommend in the manual. 2) if your system has hi nitrates (mine was at 80) in a time period of 2 to 3 months your system will be down to 10 or less BUT... the denitrifier will have built up A LOT OF BACTERIA in the reactor because there was a lot of food for the bacteria to munch on. 3) After about 3 months I'd recommend opening up the unit, rinse the sulfur media and put it back but replace the ARM media. Then cycle the unit again per the instruction in the manual. BTW, the unit will cycle a lot faster this time, as the sulfur media is seeded well. The reason for this sulfur rinse as a first step of maintenance is that as your nitrates go down there is less and less food for the bacteria to feed on so they die off. As they die off, the water starts smelling like rotten eggs and it screws up with the system's water chemistry. (That was my mistake, as I didn't know and left black/dead bacteria in the unti for a long time). From then on, monitor the unit and once it takes the nitrates down to zero, go thru the above rinsing the sulfur cycle again, and you'll be fine. The idea is, like everything else in the reef, to create an equilibrium between the nitrates generated by the system, and the amount of nitrate-eating-bacteria in the reactor. As a word of caution, if you ever see black bacteria in the reactor, open it up and rinse the sulfur. Other than that, it works great... and it should reduce your nitrate down to zero, provided you do it right. I wish I had these instructions when I first set up my unit. Good luck. __________________ ...You are free... because of the BRAVE... Current Tank Info: 300G reef, 800lb LR, APEX, Deltec AP702, LEDs, PF601, KM500, UV, RODI, Ozone, carbon, Biopellets

01/20/2008, 10:57 AM	#208
skydancer Registered Member Join Date: May 2004 Location: Dallas, Texas Posts: 438	Here it is: When you first started your system nitrates were let's say 100. Step 1: You put the reactor on line and in 3 months your system nitrates went down to 2-5 (as you stated earlier). During these 3 months the nitrate-eating bacteria in the reactor multiplied fast and started eating all the food (system nitrates). As more bacteria were generated in the reactor (white slime), the system nitrates went down. Now you have just completed the NITRATE REDUCTION CYCLE in your system. BUT, you have an excess number of nitrate-eating bacteria in your reactor and your system doesn't have enough food to support this many bacteria. So the bacteria in the reactor will die off (food starvation) and the rotten egg smell starts... Step 2: Now you want to go to the "maintenance mode", where you create a bacteria/nitrate equilibrium as follows: The number of nitrate-eating bacteria in the reactor should be equivalent to the amount of food (nitrates) generated by your system. The way to do that is to wash/rinse the sulfur media in the reactor (also don't forget to replace the ARM media) to get rid of the excess bacteria. Then put the reactor back on line and enough bacteria will be generated to eat the lesser amount of food (nitrates in the system). Therefore the maintenance mode. I disagree with people that take their reactor off line once the nitrates are zero. The reason is, the system nitrates will go back up, and then they will have to start the cycle again. __________________ ...You are free... because of the BRAVE... Current Tank Info: 300G reef, 800lb LR, APEX, Deltec AP702, LEDs, PF601, KM500, UV, RODI, Ozone, carbon, Biopellets Last edited by skydancer; 01/20/2008 at 11:31 AM.

04/21/2008, 04:23 PM	#210
Scalare102079 Paid Reef Geek Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Indianapolis - Home of the COLTS Posts: 279	Does anyone know where you can find the instructions online? I have checked the midwest website, but couldn't find it. I just purchased one secondhand from a shop that went under and the fellow didn't have the manual anymore. Thanks all! Looking forward to seeing results! __________________ 400 gallon reef system 265 gallon display with 100 gallon anemone grow out tank Current Tank Info: 110 planted tank, 28 bow planted tank, 400 gal. Reef System

04/21/2008, 07:36 PM	#211
Avi Premium Member Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: Westchester County, NY Posts: 7,327	I think you'll find what you want here, Scalare..... http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&s...estaquatic+pdf __________________ I'd keep the whole ocean if my den were big enough Current Tank Info: 120 gallon reef with 210 lbs. of live rock, Aqua-C EV180 Skimmer, Aquactinic double 250W MH with blue plus t5 support; 58 gallon freshwater planted tank using CO2 and T5s; 30-gallon cube with a few fancy goldfish; and a 110 gallon FOWLR

04/22/2008, 09:29 AM	#212
Scalare102079 Paid Reef Geek Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Indianapolis - Home of the COLTS Posts: 279	Avi, don't know how I missed it... you rock! thanks! __________________ 400 gallon reef system 265 gallon display with 100 gallon anemone grow out tank Current Tank Info: 110 planted tank, 28 bow planted tank, 400 gal. Reef System

01/19/2008, 09:30 PM	#203
RobNJ Premium Member Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Hasbrouck Heights, NJ Posts: 945	Hey Sky... I had the rotten eggs smell also so I opened mine up and rinsed it and the smell is gone. Question for you. I saw you mentioned using ARM to refill the reactor? Any reason in particular. I had extra left over from when I got my unit, about 4 months ago. However I decided to upgrade it to ARM as well, not even reading this post. I used the larger piece ARM. Do you think I will have a problem? Also does this reasctor really replenish Calcium? I thought you needed a Calcium Reactor with C02 to do such a thing. I had Nitrates near 100... Now I have none, well the salifert test shows the slightest hint of pink so I would assume its less than 10... Great Product

01/20/2008, 07:18 AM	#205
mz3bo Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 7	Hey, I had my reactor for over 3 months now. My main problem is that it is getting clogged with white thick gelly stuff " I think it's bacteria ". In three months, I had to clean it 4 times since water will not flow anymore... My tank No3 is quite low, only 2-5ppm... Anyone can help... Thanks

01/20/2008, 10:09 AM	#207
mz3bo Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 7	Hi, What is the "maintenance mode" consist of ? Thanks

02/28/2008, 12:27 PM	#209
khoivo1 Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: snowta usa Posts: 748	hi all,,,after install my xl dinitrifier from midwest i noted my ALK is raise up,,,is this normal/?// it will go down by it own right?/ or should i do water change?? this is 300g system,,,thanks

04/22/2008, 09:29 AM	#213
Scalare102079 Paid Reef Geek Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Indianapolis - Home of the COLTS Posts: 279	Avi, don't know how I missed it... you rock! thanks! __________________ 400 gallon reef system 265 gallon display with 100 gallon anemone grow out tank Current Tank Info: 110 planted tank, 28 bow planted tank, 400 gal. Reef System

07/14/2008, 07:37 PM	#214
tubsy3 Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 49	Did midwest aquatics go out of business or something? I placed an order for a denitrator and paid by paypal but still have not heard anythign from them about the order nor have they replied to my emails? Anyone else have a problem getting in contact with them?

07/15/2008, 06:53 AM	#215
Avi Premium Member Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: Westchester County, NY Posts: 7,327	Hmmmm....I just looked at their forum at their website and there are current posts. Why not post there and see if you get some answer to your inquiry, tubsy? __________________ I'd keep the whole ocean if my den were big enough Current Tank Info: 120 gallon reef with 210 lbs. of live rock, Aqua-C EV180 Skimmer, Aquactinic double 250W MH with blue plus t5 support; 58 gallon freshwater planted tank using CO2 and T5s; 30-gallon cube with a few fancy goldfish; and a 110 gallon FOWLR

09/15/2008, 09:38 AM	#217
tubsy3 Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 49	Oh I never replied to the thread here. Forgot I had it. They were away on business when I ordered. They got back to me and sent it when they returned from the trip. Great product.

11/19/2008, 11:50 AM	#218
Scalare102079 Paid Reef Geek Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Indianapolis - Home of the COLTS Posts: 279	Updates??? Tubsy3? Anyone? I am getting mine online this thursday, my nitrates are 16 ppm __________________ 400 gallon reef system 265 gallon display with 100 gallon anemone grow out tank Current Tank Info: 110 planted tank, 28 bow planted tank, 400 gal. Reef System

11/19/2008, 11:50 AM	#219
Scalare102079 Paid Reef Geek Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Indianapolis - Home of the COLTS Posts: 279	Updates??? Tubsy3? Anyone? I am getting mine online this thursday, my nitrates are 16 ppm __________________ 400 gallon reef system 265 gallon display with 100 gallon anemone grow out tank Current Tank Info: 110 planted tank, 28 bow planted tank, 400 gal. Reef System

11/19/2008, 11:51 AM	#220
Scalare102079 Paid Reef Geek Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Indianapolis - Home of the COLTS Posts: 279	sorry, double post for some reason. __________________ 400 gallon reef system 265 gallon display with 100 gallon anemone grow out tank Current Tank Info: 110 planted tank, 28 bow planted tank, 400 gal. Reef System

12/16/2009, 12:17 PM	#221
steved350 Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Houston Posts: 236	Any new updates on the Denitrator? __________________ Don't let your kids Grow up to fast!!

12/27/2009, 02:38 PM	#222
virgin reefer Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 301	I am still pondering the diatom filter, however, there is a nagging feeling that it is only a band aid and not a long term solution to my problems. I am seriousley considering a Sulfer DeNitrifier from Midwest. I have just started my research but looks to good to be true, ofcourse the price is a little harsh....but if it really does what it says.... My nitrates are still over 50 ppm and I have been doing water changes 2x a week for months. I think my live rock is holding the nitrates and leaching them back out. If I look at my cost of the tank the denitrifier looks more appealing. Lindsay BTW 90G with 75G sump, tunze skimmer, 440 VHO, yada...yada. __________________ Forever a newbie=> Current Tank Info: LPS, 440 VHO Ice Cap, 90G w/ 75G Sump, Tunze Skimmer, Approx 100LB LR, toys, toys, toys!

12/27/2009, 04:28 PM	#223
Sullyman Premium Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Buffalo Grove, Il. Posts: 3,764	Have you used a powerhead to blow the rocks out, do that before water changes and do it til no more silt comes out of your rocks and they won't be leaching anymore.

12/27/2009, 05:26 PM	#224
virgin reefer Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 301	I use a turkey baster, and I have used the powerhead by hand to blow the rocks. Main problem with that is the LPS hates the movement. I do it as part of my maintenance but it seems no matter how much I do it...never helps. I also stirred up my fuge and did a water change out on that part of my sump (about 35G), I was told that the nitrates could be held in there. Had never done it because of my Mandarin but since he has long been gone.... I want a wave powerhead to put at the bottom of the tank and face it up through the back of my rocks....the one I really like though is like $150 and I can't spend that on a PH. My main ?'s with the nitrifier is: 1) does it replace dosing calcium/ALK at least in part. 2) Is there anywhere in Ontario Canada that sells them. Thanks for the reply. __________________ Forever a newbie=> Current Tank Info: LPS, 440 VHO Ice Cap, 90G w/ 75G Sump, Tunze Skimmer, Approx 100LB LR, toys, toys, toys!

12/27/2009, 09:09 PM	#225
Sullyman Premium Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Buffalo Grove, Il. Posts: 3,764	It won't help your calcium. Have you considered Vodka or other products like macrobachter7 to help get rid of the nitrate?