Blue spot jawfish?

Xxxtremewv · 05/11/2018, 04:39 PM

So I snagged a 60g cube from a buddy last month and I think I am going to give a seahorse tank a shot.

I have always wanted a blue spot jawfish, but never had deep enough substrate in my 120 to be able to do it, now I have done a little searching around on fusedjaw and other resources and what few references I have found say they should be just fine together. Any thoughts or experiences with this guys? Was thinking on throwing a 3-4" medium grade sand substrate in and giving it a try

Was planning on a couple lightning clowns, a trio of pipefish, and the horses. Maybe a mandarin someday way down the road.

Now off to research hitching post ideas!

vlangel · 05/11/2018, 09:51 PM

Just know going into this that there are risks. Seahorses do not have the same ability to fight off pathogens as other marine fish, so any time they are introduced to new pathogens they are going to be vulnerable. The risk is very high with wild caught fish, and not quite as high with captive bred fish.

I personally would never keep clownfish of any kind with seahorses again. I did it once and I do not recommend it. The only pipefish I would keep with seahorses are the captive bred banded flagfin pipefish that Ocean Rider sell and that would work best if the seahorses were from Ocean Rider as well.

rayjay · 05/12/2018, 08:51 AM

Obviously the best chances of success come with a species only tank.
However, there ARE successful mixed tanks but like Dawn says, you really need to understand the risks.
Seahorses are most susceptible to bacteria problems followed by poor ability to acclimate to pathogens introduced to them by other tankmates, especially if coming from the wild like most pipefish do.
I agree that Ocean Ryder pipefish are the best chances of success for that.
While occasionally it has worked out for clownfish companions, usually it doesn't. It's not too bad when clowns are small, but they get more territorial as they mature causing stress to seahorses that often is followed by bacterial problems. More clowns equal more stress
If you have the RIGHT temperament of clown(s) and if the seahorse happens to have a better than average capability of dealing with stress, you win. Unfortunately the alternative is most often the result.
Seahorses, like humans, have varying levels of disease resistance, where some people seem to be always coming down with something while others never seem to get sick. In the fish world, most seahorses appear to be on the very worst end of susceptibility.
As for substrate, while it looks nice, it can be a detritus trap, especially the coarser the grade as it allows the smaller portions of detritus to get down into the substrate fuelling bacteria propagation.
IMO, husbandry for seahorse tanks has to be much more so than that of the fussiest reef tank because of the bacteria problems.
Now, the latest recommendations of 30g for a pair of standard seahorses with an additional 15g for each additional pair, have begun to change now that Dan Underwood of seahorsesource.com has reported that he has seen better chances of success for those going 30g for EACH pair, not just the first so that your 60g tank would be suitable for two pair of standard adult seahorses. Adding MORE livestock is going to require an even larger tank, OR, it will require a LOT more husbandry and larger water changes than a normal seahorse tank which is already more than you would do with your reef tank.
The BAD part about extra diligence is that we humans often tend to become slack in needed chores when over time, nothing wrong has occurred, but skipping a task here or there, or going a bit lighter on cleaning once in a while, means the water quality gradually degrades to the point where nasty bacteria have food and bedding to go into expansion mode leaving the more susceptible seahorses at risk.
There are NO test kits available to the hobbyist to be able to tell you when this bacteria expansion is going to happen so we need to do the preventative husbandry to try to avoid problems.
I've been keeping and breeding seahorses for 15 years now and I hate to think of how many losses I had in my earlier years just because I thought I could handle things well having been in the reefing hobby for 20.

Xxxtremewv · 05/12/2018, 10:45 AM

Well shoot. I am now wondering if its even a good idea to get into this. Guess I have a decision to make. They almost sound not worth the trouble

Thanks for the responses

rayjay · 05/12/2018, 01:28 PM

It's most definitely not for everyone even if they are already in the saltwater hobby. You also need a trained "seahorse sitter" for going away on holidays so you don't come back to problems.
I can say that over the years I've found that probably only a very minor percentage of people getting into the hobby actually last even five years, with many not getting much more than one year if that.

Xxxtremewv · 05/12/2018, 06:32 PM

Yeah I think Ill pass (for now at least). Another thing that had been worrying me was how warm my house stays. Even my other reef tank this time of year with fans and no heater and good vent in the sump area and tops open I cant seem to get it down past 79-80. Thanks for the input! Ill use the tank for something else for the moment! Better to not try at all than end up killing a few pairs at a time hah

vlangel · 05/13/2018, 06:23 AM

Its hard for us aquarists to say 'no' to an animal that we would like to keep but I applaud you for recognising that seahorses are not right for you at this time! Its always best to keep the creature's best interest in mind because its heartbreaking when we don't. Good luck to you with whatever you choose to do with the tank.

Louis Z · 05/13/2018, 11:52 PM

Check on temps for blue spot jawfish . Many do not do well , I wonder if they are being kept at improper higher temps since they come from pacific waters around Mexico .

05/11/2018, 04:39 PM	#1
Xxxtremewv Registered Member Join Date: May 2016 Posts: 144	Blue spot jawfish? So I snagged a 60g cube from a buddy last month and I think I am going to give a seahorse tank a shot. I have always wanted a blue spot jawfish, but never had deep enough substrate in my 120 to be able to do it, now I have done a little searching around on fusedjaw and other resources and what few references I have found say they should be just fine together. Any thoughts or experiences with this guys? Was thinking on throwing a 3-4" medium grade sand substrate in and giving it a try Was planning on a couple lightning clowns, a trio of pipefish, and the horses. Maybe a mandarin someday way down the road. Now off to research hitching post ideas!

05/12/2018, 08:51 AM	#3
rayjay Registered Member Join Date: Oct 1999 Location: London, Ontario, Canada Posts: 3,969	Obviously the best chances of success come with a species only tank. However, there ARE successful mixed tanks but like Dawn says, you really need to understand the risks. Seahorses are most susceptible to bacteria problems followed by poor ability to acclimate to pathogens introduced to them by other tankmates, especially if coming from the wild like most pipefish do. I agree that Ocean Ryder pipefish are the best chances of success for that. While occasionally it has worked out for clownfish companions, usually it doesn't. It's not too bad when clowns are small, but they get more territorial as they mature causing stress to seahorses that often is followed by bacterial problems. More clowns equal more stress If you have the RIGHT temperament of clown(s) and if the seahorse happens to have a better than average capability of dealing with stress, you win. Unfortunately the alternative is most often the result. Seahorses, like humans, have varying levels of disease resistance, where some people seem to be always coming down with something while others never seem to get sick. In the fish world, most seahorses appear to be on the very worst end of susceptibility. As for substrate, while it looks nice, it can be a detritus trap, especially the coarser the grade as it allows the smaller portions of detritus to get down into the substrate fuelling bacteria propagation. IMO, husbandry for seahorse tanks has to be much more so than that of the fussiest reef tank because of the bacteria problems. Now, the latest recommendations of 30g for a pair of standard seahorses with an additional 15g for each additional pair, have begun to change now that Dan Underwood of seahorsesource.com has reported that he has seen better chances of success for those going 30g for EACH pair, not just the first so that your 60g tank would be suitable for two pair of standard adult seahorses. Adding MORE livestock is going to require an even larger tank, OR, it will require a LOT more husbandry and larger water changes than a normal seahorse tank which is already more than you would do with your reef tank. The BAD part about extra diligence is that we humans often tend to become slack in needed chores when over time, nothing wrong has occurred, but skipping a task here or there, or going a bit lighter on cleaning once in a while, means the water quality gradually degrades to the point where nasty bacteria have food and bedding to go into expansion mode leaving the more susceptible seahorses at risk. There are NO test kits available to the hobbyist to be able to tell you when this bacteria expansion is going to happen so we need to do the preventative husbandry to try to avoid problems. I've been keeping and breeding seahorses for 15 years now and I hate to think of how many losses I had in my earlier years just because I thought I could handle things well having been in the reefing hobby for 20. __________________ Seahorses. Culture nanno, rotifers and brine shrimp. Current Tank Info: Seahorses

05/12/2018, 01:28 PM	#5
rayjay Registered Member Join Date: Oct 1999 Location: London, Ontario, Canada Posts: 3,969	It's most definitely not for everyone even if they are already in the saltwater hobby. You also need a trained "seahorse sitter" for going away on holidays so you don't come back to problems. I can say that over the years I've found that probably only a very minor percentage of people getting into the hobby actually last even five years, with many not getting much more than one year if that. __________________ Seahorses. Culture nanno, rotifers and brine shrimp. Current Tank Info: Seahorses

05/11/2018, 09:51 PM	#2
vlangel Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Posts: 2,409	Just know going into this that there are risks. Seahorses do not have the same ability to fight off pathogens as other marine fish, so any time they are introduced to new pathogens they are going to be vulnerable. The risk is very high with wild caught fish, and not quite as high with captive bred fish. I personally would never keep clownfish of any kind with seahorses again. I did it once and I do not recommend it. The only pipefish I would keep with seahorses are the captive bred banded flagfin pipefish that Ocean Rider sell and that would work best if the seahorses were from Ocean Rider as well.

05/12/2018, 10:45 AM	#4
Xxxtremewv Registered Member Join Date: May 2016 Posts: 144	Well shoot. I am now wondering if its even a good idea to get into this. Guess I have a decision to make. They almost sound not worth the trouble Thanks for the responses

05/12/2018, 06:32 PM	#6
Xxxtremewv Registered Member Join Date: May 2016 Posts: 144	Yeah I think Ill pass (for now at least). Another thing that had been worrying me was how warm my house stays. Even my other reef tank this time of year with fans and no heater and good vent in the sump area and tops open I cant seem to get it down past 79-80. Thanks for the input! Ill use the tank for something else for the moment! Better to not try at all than end up killing a few pairs at a time hah

05/13/2018, 06:23 AM	#7
vlangel Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Posts: 2,409	Its hard for us aquarists to say 'no' to an animal that we would like to keep but I applaud you for recognising that seahorses are not right for you at this time! Its always best to keep the creature's best interest in mind because its heartbreaking when we don't. Good luck to you with whatever you choose to do with the tank.

05/13/2018, 11:52 PM	#8
Louis Z Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Montgomery Posts: 1,257	Check on temps for blue spot jawfish . Many do not do well , I wonder if they are being kept at improper higher temps since they come from pacific waters around Mexico .