What bulb for pulse strike ballast

lynxdevlopment · 02/18/2007, 12:34 PM

It's time to replace my 400w mh bulbs. Right now I have 10000k bulbs and not sure of the brand, they came with the set up from aqua medic. I'm looking to go more blue somewhere in the 15000k range. but I'm not sure what bulb is designed for a pulse strike ballast. this is the ballast I have Oceanballast M 400 Mogul (M-135 Pulse Strike). Any advise is appreciated

Thanks Chris

tom obrecht · 02/18/2007, 01:07 PM

I've always used Ushio bulbs in my pulse start ballasts. I like the look and think they are of high quality.

lynxdevlopment · 02/18/2007, 01:24 PM

If I went with the 10k bulbs what would be the best way to add actinic on an 8 foot tank, without blocking the MH's? Could I see the actinic over the MH?

tom obrecht · 02/18/2007, 05:10 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by lynxdevlopment
If I went with the 10k bulbs what would be the best way to add actinic on an 8 foot tank, without blocking the MH's? Could I see the actinic over the MH?

This is what I did on my 8 footer.

[/IMG]

I put two 2' bulbs runing across the width of the tank in between each halide which is in a Lumanarc reflector. So in total I have 3-400 watt 10K Ushio bulbs and 8-2' VHO bulbs.

tom obrecht · 02/18/2007, 05:10 PM

Sorry, here's the picture. I messed up!

[IMG]

[/IMG]

lynxdevlopment · 02/19/2007, 07:12 AM

Great idea, love the tank

thanks chris

lynxdevlopment · 06/03/2007, 04:17 PM

So I installed my new Ushio 400w bulbs and after about four weeks they have a really hard time firing up, that is if they do at all. What should my next step be to solving the problem?

Thanks Chris

PaulErik · 06/03/2007, 04:34 PM

What do you mean by having a hard time firing up? Do they light right away but have problems warming up or do they not light up at all for awhile?

With an ANSI M135 ballast the Ushio bulbs should fire/ignite right away.

lynxdevlopment · 06/03/2007, 04:43 PM

They do not light up at all. But sometimes after an hour or longer they light up. Once they are on they work great untill I turn them off.

PaulErik · 06/03/2007, 06:01 PM

Iâ€™m personally not familiar with that ballast but if it is a true M135 ballast this should not be happening.

A M135 ballast is equipped with a lamp ignitor. Does the ballast make a high pitch noise when the ballast is on but the lamp is not? If it does this indicates the ignitor is working but for some reason the ignition/starting voltage is not high enough at the lamp socket to fire/ignite the lamp. A voltage drop from long cables can cause starting problems. How long are the cables from the ballast to the lamp?

lynxdevlopment · 06/04/2007, 08:08 AM

No high pitch noise but the ballast hums and gets warm. The cord from the ballast to the lamp is about eight feet long the way it came from the factory. On the old Aqua medic web site it said these where m135 ballast. I can no longer find them on the web site. I will try to post a pic of the label on the ballast and maybe some one can tell me what it means. This is the only web site I could find that still has them, mine is the 36' 2x400w.

http://www.aquamartonline.com/01663_1_4_1575.html

PaulErik · 06/04/2007, 08:18 AM

Actually Aqua Medic use to have the lamp ignitor inside the pendant (light fixture) but in this fixture and the other newer fixtures they use a different ballast made by a different manufacturer. In the new fixtures I am not sure where the ignitor is housed. It could be in the light fixture or inside the ballast case.

Does the fixture make any noise? If the ignitor is in the light fixture it will use a superimposed ignitor which will make some noise (buzz) even when the lamp is lit.

lynxdevlopment · 06/04/2007, 01:14 PM

no noise from the fixture and the only noise from the ballast seems to be the fan. When I turn them on the ballast makes a clunk like noise but that is it. The bulbs that came with the fixture are aqualine 10000k 400w there also number 7221058 and 41 on the bulb at the base. I don't know if this will help?

PaulErik · 06/04/2007, 01:31 PM

Something isnâ€™t right. The Aqualine lamp has almost the same electrical specification. The Ushio and Aqualine lamps are recommended for the same ballasts.

It would help to know exactly what ballast and ignitor is used in that ballast. It could be your ballasts donâ€™t have a high enough starting voltage to strike the Ushio lamps but if they are truly pulse start ballasts and do meet ANSI M135 standards then this should not be a problem.

The problem you describe is common when someone tries to use a pulse start lamp on a standard (ANSI M59) ballast. A M59 ballast is not equipped with an ignitor. Pulse start type lamps can sometimes start on them but over time starting becomes unreliable because when a metal halide lamp ages the starting voltage requirement increases.

It could be the ignitor failed for some reason. How many ballasts do you have? If you have multiple ballasts are they all doing this?

lynxdevlopment · 06/04/2007, 01:50 PM

I have two separate ballast each is a 2x400. One fixture has two brand new bulbs in it and works great. The other fixture has two bulbs that are about four weeks old and will no longer light up. But it doesn't make a difference what ballast I plug the fixture into. The ballast itself does not have ANSI number on it. It does say class1 D149143 Bissendorf Germany 854 watt.

Reefer_Addickt · 06/04/2007, 01:55 PM

I dont know if this is the same problem but:

I bought Ushio 10k's and had a real hard time getting them to both fire consistently on a M57x2 ballasts.

It turns out that my ballast had the bulbs sharing a common ground to the transistor, so my electrician friend rewired it so that each have their own common ground to the transistor and the bulbs fire pretty steadily.

Occasionally they will both fire, and one shuts off after about 1 min. When it does this i have to wait 10min and try to fire them up again.

I have read other places also that quite a few people have trouble lighting them on M57 ballasts, which is a pulse start ballast. Not sure if the same problem exists with the M135.

PaulErik · 06/04/2007, 02:03 PM

Have you tried switching the bulbs around in the fixtures? This would show if the lamps are at fault or the fixture/ballast.

The Ushio lamps do not light up at all anymore?

lynxdevlopment · 06/04/2007, 02:06 PM

I'll try switching the lamp around. The last few days the Ushio's will not go on at all.

PaulErik · 06/04/2007, 02:33 PM

Itâ€™s really sounding like those ballasts may not be compatible with those Ushio lamps. I do remember seeing somewhere that the ballasts you have are supposed to be M135 ballasts.

Reefer_Addickt,

The Ushio 175-watt lamps are not designed for an ANSI M57 (probe start) ballast. The recommended ballast is a pulse start (ANSI M137/M152) ballast. Many people have had problems using the 175-watt lamps on a standard M57 ballast.

Usually that setup is very sensitive. The Ushio 175-watt lamp is a pulse start lamp. A common problem using a M57 ballast is the lamp can become a hard/difficult starter because when the lamp ages the starting voltage requirement increases and a M57 ballast does not meet the lamps requirements. Another problem is the lamp can have difficulty during the warm up phase. A M57 ballast usually has a lower sustaining voltage (Vss) than required for this lamp. It can cause the arc to become unstable and fail during the warm up phase (right after lighting up) but the lamp will re ignite/fire. Sometimes the lamp will only cycle once every switching period but sometimes can get worse and continue cycling.

Reefer_Addickt · 06/04/2007, 02:42 PM

Thanks Paul,

I bought the bulbs before i did the research. Next bulbs I buy for my ballast wont be the Ushio's. Go figure i buy like 1 of the 2 bulbs i cant use on my ballast correctly, the other being a Radium i think.

PaulErik · 06/04/2007, 02:59 PM

Reefer_Addickt,

Radium currently does not make a 175-watt lamp. The other lamp to avoid is the AB Aqualine 175-watt lamp when using a standard M57 ballast. It has almost the same electrical requirements as the Ushio.

This article has a chart that shows which lamps are recommended for which ballast: http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2007-03/sj/index.php

Hope that helps

reefkrazy · 06/04/2007, 06:34 PM

here is a great link for you....http://www.aquarium-lighting-guide.c...al-halide-ansi

lynxdevlopment · 06/05/2007, 03:22 PM

I put my old aqualine bulbs in and they light right up. Ushio must just not compatible with these ballast. I like the look of the Ushio much better.

02/18/2007, 12:34 PM	#1
lynxdevlopment Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Boulder Colo Posts: 56	What bulb for pulse strike ballast It's time to replace my 400w mh bulbs. Right now I have 10000k bulbs and not sure of the brand, they came with the set up from aqua medic. I'm looking to go more blue somewhere in the 15000k range. but I'm not sure what bulb is designed for a pulse strike ballast. this is the ballast I have Oceanballast M 400 Mogul (M-135 Pulse Strike). Any advise is appreciated Thanks Chris

02/18/2007, 01:07 PM	#2
tom obrecht Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: WI Posts: 3,014	I've always used Ushio bulbs in my pulse start ballasts. I like the look and think they are of high quality. __________________ Reef keeping is where Murphy's Law and your bank account collide!! TOTM May 2006

02/18/2007, 05:10 PM	#5
tom obrecht Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: WI Posts: 3,014	Sorry, here's the picture. I messed up! [IMG][/IMG]

06/04/2007, 01:55 PM	#16
Reefer_Addickt Premium Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Oakland Posts: 779	I dont know if this is the same problem but: I bought Ushio 10k's and had a real hard time getting them to both fire consistently on a M57x2 ballasts. It turns out that my ballast had the bulbs sharing a common ground to the transistor, so my electrician friend rewired it so that each have their own common ground to the transistor and the bulbs fire pretty steadily. Occasionally they will both fire, and one shuts off after about 1 min. When it does this i have to wait 10min and try to fire them up again. I have read other places also that quite a few people have trouble lighting them on M57 ballasts, which is a pulse start ballast. Not sure if the same problem exists with the M135. __________________ Andrew Current Tank Info: 150 gallon

06/04/2007, 02:42 PM	#20
Reefer_Addickt Premium Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Oakland Posts: 779	Thanks Paul, I bought the bulbs before i did the research. Next bulbs I buy for my ballast wont be the Ushio's. Go figure i buy like 1 of the 2 bulbs i cant use on my ballast correctly, the other being a Radium i think. __________________ Andrew Current Tank Info: 150 gallon

02/18/2007, 01:24 PM	#3
lynxdevlopment Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Boulder Colo Posts: 56	If I went with the 10k bulbs what would be the best way to add actinic on an 8 foot tank, without blocking the MH's? Could I see the actinic over the MH?

02/19/2007, 07:12 AM	#6
lynxdevlopment Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Boulder Colo Posts: 56	Great idea, love the tank thanks chris

06/03/2007, 04:17 PM	#7
lynxdevlopment Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Boulder Colo Posts: 56	So I installed my new Ushio 400w bulbs and after about four weeks they have a really hard time firing up, that is if they do at all. What should my next step be to solving the problem? Thanks Chris

06/03/2007, 04:34 PM	#8
PaulErik Premium Member Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: North Charleston, SC Posts: 1,703	What do you mean by having a hard time firing up? Do they light right away but have problems warming up or do they not light up at all for awhile? With an ANSI M135 ballast the Ushio bulbs should fire/ignite right away.

06/03/2007, 04:43 PM	#9
lynxdevlopment Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Boulder Colo Posts: 56	They do not light up at all. But sometimes after an hour or longer they light up. Once they are on they work great untill I turn them off.

06/03/2007, 06:01 PM	#10
PaulErik Premium Member Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: North Charleston, SC Posts: 1,703	Iâ€™m personally not familiar with that ballast but if it is a true M135 ballast this should not be happening. A M135 ballast is equipped with a lamp ignitor. Does the ballast make a high pitch noise when the ballast is on but the lamp is not? If it does this indicates the ignitor is working but for some reason the ignition/starting voltage is not high enough at the lamp socket to fire/ignite the lamp. A voltage drop from long cables can cause starting problems. How long are the cables from the ballast to the lamp?

06/04/2007, 08:08 AM	#11
lynxdevlopment Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Boulder Colo Posts: 56	No high pitch noise but the ballast hums and gets warm. The cord from the ballast to the lamp is about eight feet long the way it came from the factory. On the old Aqua medic web site it said these where m135 ballast. I can no longer find them on the web site. I will try to post a pic of the label on the ballast and maybe some one can tell me what it means. This is the only web site I could find that still has them, mine is the 36' 2x400w. http://www.aquamartonline.com/01663_1_4_1575.html

06/04/2007, 08:18 AM	#12
PaulErik Premium Member Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: North Charleston, SC Posts: 1,703	Actually Aqua Medic use to have the lamp ignitor inside the pendant (light fixture) but in this fixture and the other newer fixtures they use a different ballast made by a different manufacturer. In the new fixtures I am not sure where the ignitor is housed. It could be in the light fixture or inside the ballast case. Does the fixture make any noise? If the ignitor is in the light fixture it will use a superimposed ignitor which will make some noise (buzz) even when the lamp is lit.

06/04/2007, 01:14 PM	#13
lynxdevlopment Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Boulder Colo Posts: 56	no noise from the fixture and the only noise from the ballast seems to be the fan. When I turn them on the ballast makes a clunk like noise but that is it. The bulbs that came with the fixture are aqualine 10000k 400w there also number 7221058 and 41 on the bulb at the base. I don't know if this will help?

06/04/2007, 01:31 PM	#14
PaulErik Premium Member Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: North Charleston, SC Posts: 1,703	Something isnâ€™t right. The Aqualine lamp has almost the same electrical specification. The Ushio and Aqualine lamps are recommended for the same ballasts. It would help to know exactly what ballast and ignitor is used in that ballast. It could be your ballasts donâ€™t have a high enough starting voltage to strike the Ushio lamps but if they are truly pulse start ballasts and do meet ANSI M135 standards then this should not be a problem. The problem you describe is common when someone tries to use a pulse start lamp on a standard (ANSI M59) ballast. A M59 ballast is not equipped with an ignitor. Pulse start type lamps can sometimes start on them but over time starting becomes unreliable because when a metal halide lamp ages the starting voltage requirement increases. It could be the ignitor failed for some reason. How many ballasts do you have? If you have multiple ballasts are they all doing this?

06/04/2007, 01:50 PM	#15
lynxdevlopment Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Boulder Colo Posts: 56	I have two separate ballast each is a 2x400. One fixture has two brand new bulbs in it and works great. The other fixture has two bulbs that are about four weeks old and will no longer light up. But it doesn't make a difference what ballast I plug the fixture into. The ballast itself does not have ANSI number on it. It does say class1 D149143 Bissendorf Germany 854 watt.

06/04/2007, 02:03 PM	#17
PaulErik Premium Member Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: North Charleston, SC Posts: 1,703	Have you tried switching the bulbs around in the fixtures? This would show if the lamps are at fault or the fixture/ballast. The Ushio lamps do not light up at all anymore?

06/04/2007, 02:06 PM	#18
lynxdevlopment Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Boulder Colo Posts: 56	I'll try switching the lamp around. The last few days the Ushio's will not go on at all.

06/04/2007, 02:33 PM	#19
PaulErik Premium Member Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: North Charleston, SC Posts: 1,703	Itâ€™s really sounding like those ballasts may not be compatible with those Ushio lamps. I do remember seeing somewhere that the ballasts you have are supposed to be M135 ballasts. Reefer_Addickt, The Ushio 175-watt lamps are not designed for an ANSI M57 (probe start) ballast. The recommended ballast is a pulse start (ANSI M137/M152) ballast. Many people have had problems using the 175-watt lamps on a standard M57 ballast. Usually that setup is very sensitive. The Ushio 175-watt lamp is a pulse start lamp. A common problem using a M57 ballast is the lamp can become a hard/difficult starter because when the lamp ages the starting voltage requirement increases and a M57 ballast does not meet the lamps requirements. Another problem is the lamp can have difficulty during the warm up phase. A M57 ballast usually has a lower sustaining voltage (Vss) than required for this lamp. It can cause the arc to become unstable and fail during the warm up phase (right after lighting up) but the lamp will re ignite/fire. Sometimes the lamp will only cycle once every switching period but sometimes can get worse and continue cycling.

06/04/2007, 02:59 PM	#21
PaulErik Premium Member Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: North Charleston, SC Posts: 1,703	Reefer_Addickt, Radium currently does not make a 175-watt lamp. The other lamp to avoid is the AB Aqualine 175-watt lamp when using a standard M57 ballast. It has almost the same electrical requirements as the Ushio. This article has a chart that shows which lamps are recommended for which ballast: http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2007-03/sj/index.php Hope that helps

06/04/2007, 06:34 PM	#22
reefkrazy Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: southington, CT Posts: 953	here is a great link for you....http://www.aquarium-lighting-guide.c...al-halide-ansi __________________ To reef or not to reef, That is the question! Current Tank Info: 90g display, 55g sump/ Refuge, 400w APO fixture with 20k radiums, 250w 10k hqi, 2-110w vho actinics, Euroreef skimmer, vortech pump, phosban reactor

06/05/2007, 03:22 PM	#23
lynxdevlopment Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Boulder Colo Posts: 56	I put my old aqualine bulbs in and they light right up. Ushio must just not compatible with these ballast. I like the look of the Ushio much better.