A Few Thoughts on P.Eichler's List

[davidryder]

I just got finished reading the thread and I was absolutely shocked how emotional people were getting. I'm not sure what the problem is... the list is comparable to any book I've read. Each one makes recommendations and usually lists hardiness, captive survival rates, etc. Peters list just became a bookmarked one-stop list that I feel very comfortable referencing for myself and to other threads I would feel fit.

It's a great list. hank, I do think you may have misinterpreted its intentions. It's just a list of fish that are currently difficult to keep. Take it or leave it.

These quotes really stood out to me:

Originally posted by King-Kong
Uhmm.. everyone should? That's why Eichler's list should be required reading.

I have never seen such a resistance to the spreading of information.. very odd. Almost like you're insulted that someone would call something difficult to have / avoid if not experienced. Very bizarre.

I absolutely couldn't agree more!! It makes no sense to me, either.

Originally posted by hankthetank
To be honest when I was young and stupid I always looked at lists like that as a menu of goals to strive for.Oh that's right, I still think that way!

When you were young and stupid? Don't take offense, it just seems this is still your attitude today. Things may not be as simple as you are making them out to be. Like others have said, we have only seen a handful of species even reproduce in captivity... it just seems you may be getting ahead of the game.

Originally posted by hankthetank
Uh Pete I did mention the words"trash can lid" right?When I'm asked directly"what size tank does this batfish need" my answer is always the same"olympic sized".And when the customer tells me that they have a 55,"but we're going to get a bigger tank"I should according to you say"well I will not sell you this fish until you have a bigger tank"You seem to want to relieve the buyer of all responsibility for doing what you consider irresponsible.But tell me what do you think about my air freight law?

Now this is where your logic gets me all mixed up. You suggest an "olympic sized" aquarium for batfish and yet you still offer them for sale? Special ordering a fish for someone is one thing, but regularly offering it for sale, knowing the # of people with olympic sized tanks are probably very small, is well, I'll let you finish that one.

Anyway, experimenting with fish by casual and/or new hobbyists to attempt success is IMO irresponsible. Imagine how many scientists & experts have professionally experimented and are still professionally experimenting with these species. The fact is, some fish may never be able to survive outside of their natural environment.

And FW angelfish are a type of discus. That said, the only thing that was to be discovered about those fish was PH & temperature. Instead of a "buy it and hope it survives" attitude, why don't you lay down a solid plan and setup some tanks to run some thorough experiments with documenting everything that you see. I would like to hear how you plan on keeping some of the fish on the list alive - aside from buying it hoping it survives. Because I assure you everything you can think of has probably already been thought of. Seriously though, no mud throwing - real ideas.

Casual observation and anecdotal evidence isn't going to advance the hobby, and advocating the purchase of species with <= 0% survival rate by such observance seems like such a waste.

Just one hobbyist looking out for another hobbyist, and waste is attempted to be laid to it. Just craziness!