Water changes. Do it, or NOT to do it?

likhten · 07/12/2007, 11:28 AM

I have
Nitrate 50 and
Alk 11 meq/L and 32 dKH
Ca 220
Mg 1050
I think it is too match.
So Iâ€™m planning to do 100% water changes. Not all water but 10% at a time ones per day. It should take 10 days (My tank is 45 gal). Iâ€™m going to use tap water (donâ€™t have RO/DI system yet).
But after mix â€œInstant Oceanâ€ with tap water test result is:
Nitrate 0,
Alk 3 meq/L
Ca 350
Mg 1300
Question: Do it, or NOT to do it?

der_wille_zur_macht · 07/12/2007, 11:35 AM

How old is your tank? What livestock do you have in it? What equipment is running on it? What is your normal water change schedule?

papagimp · 07/12/2007, 11:36 AM

Try a different salt mix.

I probably wouldn't do a 10% per day, I'd do maybe a 10% every other day.
I'd also not use tap and drive to the LFS to buy ro/di water. Using tap is only going to cause other problems.

FYI, in case you didn't know, nitrates are obvioulsy too high for a reef tank, IMO.
Alk is way way way to high
Ca is way way way to low
Mag is kinda low, i'd get it upwards of 1300-1350

I was usuing IO salt mix for a long time and got similar results, even those results show a low Alk and low Ca levels. I switched to Reef Crystals (also made by IO) and it seems to have better results.

Are you dosing CA or ALK supplements? If so, do not add any more alk until that levels drops down to about 7-11dKH or about 4-4.5meg/l and definatly up the dosage of calcium to get it back to about 400-420ppm

So to answer your question: Do it, but do it cautiously.

drummereef · 07/12/2007, 11:38 AM

1. how old is the tank?
2. what kind of filtration are you running?
3. what is your substrate type?

papagimp · 07/12/2007, 11:41 AM

any ammonia or nitrite present? And get a phosphate test kit while your at it.

Duff Man · 07/12/2007, 11:41 AM

Doing 10 10% water changes will not equal a 100% water change. You will only be replacing 10% each time. It will take a long time for the new water to comprise a majority of the water in the tank. As to how beneficial this will be to the tank, I will let others with more experience make a comment.

That being said, I would think twice about using the tap water. Can you get water from your LFS? I have heard of people using water from the grocrey store. I think that anything but tap water should be used.

hmello@bermexin · 07/12/2007, 11:50 AM

If nothing else get some distilled water from the grocery store. DO NOT use tap water. You are playing Russion Roulete with alge if you do...

likhten · 07/12/2007, 12:16 PM

1. My tank 6 month old
2. Livestock: Clown fish, crabs and snails
3. what kind of filtration are you running?
LR 45 lb,
Skimmer AquaC,
Filters: EHIME 2213 canister, internal FLUVAL 3
Refugium 4 gal
4. No ammonia or nitrite are present
Thank you for any comments.

der_wille_zur_macht · 07/12/2007, 12:24 PM

What's your current water change schedule? What problems do you think you have? What do you hope to accomplish by doing the changes you mentioned in your post up top?

kevin2000 · 07/12/2007, 12:28 PM

Your high nitrate level isn't going to hurt your clown fish.

You have a high alk level which can only happen if you have been using additives ... the low calc level is probably the result of your using too much alkalinity additives.

I don't see anything to be that concerned about or anything that regular water changes won't cure.

Nanz · 07/12/2007, 01:08 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by papagimp
Try a different salt mix.

I probably wouldn't do a 10% per day, I'd do maybe a 10% every other day.
I'd also not use tap and drive to the LFS to buy ro/di water. Using tap is only going to cause other problems.

FYI, in case you didn't know, nitrates are obvioulsy too high for a reef tank, IMO.
Alk is way way way to high
Ca is way way way to low
Mag is kinda low, i'd get it upwards of 1300-1350

I was usuing IO salt mix for a long time and got similar results, even those results show a low Alk and low Ca levels. I switched to Reef Crystals (also made by IO) and it seems to have better results.

Are you dosing CA or ALK supplements? If so, do not add any more alk until that levels drops down to about 7-11dKH or about 4-4.5meg/l and definatly up the dosage of calcium to get it back to about 400-420ppm

So to answer your question: Do it, but do it cautiously.

I Agree.. Doing the waterchange everyday is not a good idea. I think the best bet is to increase your Ca and ONLY Ca. Since Ca and Alk ar linked together you should see Alk lower. I'd watch your Mg though..

Check this Link out
Solving Calcium and Alkalinity Problems

Your Problem is in Zone 3

chris31 · 07/12/2007, 01:12 PM

trust me to not use tap water i made that mistake and and now my tank is full of alege trust me try to do what ever you can to get some ro/di water or go by a ro/di unit that what im doing this weekend but what ever you do DO NOT USE TAP WATER! you will regret it

likhten · 07/12/2007, 01:21 PM

I have weekly 10% water change schedule.
I thought to do major water change help bring Nitrate down to 0 as well as resolve Alk-Ca problem.
Am I correct?

der_wille_zur_macht · 07/12/2007, 01:41 PM

Yes, a major water change will help those sorts of problems. However, you want to do a single bigger change, not just a bunch of 10% changes in a row. For instance, you could do a 30% change, instead of 3, 10% changes.

10% weekly sounds like a high frequency but low volume - most people would probably suggest switching to 20 - 30% monthly instead. It'll be less overall work, too.

Regardless, if you got in the situation you are currently in, you need to change something longterm instead of just doing water changes to fix the problem. Check out the link Nanz posted, it has lots of great info.

jeeperrs · 07/12/2007, 01:48 PM

I think doing 10% water changes every 2-3 days would be good. After each water change I would retest your water to see where you are at. Then do another small water change as you have mentioned until you are at the point in which you are comfortable. I don't think anything is so out of whack that your tank is going to crash tonight lol. Also, I think the small water changes will help the livestock adjust to the new water parameters. This is maybe not relative but what is your pH with your water at 11 meq/L??? Just be careful, a lot of people on here do knee jerk reactions then have to correct what they just caused. I think you have a good idea with the small water changes over a period of time. As far as the tap water, if that is what you have, use it

hmello@bermexin · 07/12/2007, 01:50 PM

Anytime I check ammonia, trates and trites they are zero. Calcuim runs in the 400-440 rang, alkk in the 3.5-4 meg range and Mg from in the 1300-1350 range. Mostly I don't even check ammonia or trites anymore. I figure if I see a rise in nitrites then I'll check the others to see what if anything is going on. Most importatnly my livestock looks good. If I see any decline in something I will do more exhaustive testing.
My water change schedule is 10% per week with a good cleaning of the mechanical filtration stuff. Once per month I will do a 20%. Seems to work for me and I might even be overdoing it.

07/12/2007, 11:28 AM	#1
likhten Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: New York, NY Posts: 96	Water changes. Do it, or NOT to do it? I have Nitrate 50 and Alk 11 meq/L and 32 dKH Ca 220 Mg 1050 I think it is too match. So Iâ€™m planning to do 100% water changes. Not all water but 10% at a time ones per day. It should take 10 days (My tank is 45 gal). Iâ€™m going to use tap water (donâ€™t have RO/DI system yet). But after mix â€œInstant Oceanâ€ with tap water test result is: Nitrate 0, Alk 3 meq/L Ca 350 Mg 1300 Question: Do it, or NOT to do it?

07/12/2007, 11:35 AM	#2
der_wille_zur_macht Team RC Member Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: NY Posts: 17,749	How old is your tank? What livestock do you have in it? What equipment is running on it? What is your normal water change schedule? __________________ Inconveniencing marine life since 1992 "It is my personal belief that reef aquaria should be thriving communities of biodiversity, representative of their wild counterparts, and not merely collections of pretty specimens growing on tidy clean rock shelves covered in purple coralline algae." (Eric Borneman)

07/12/2007, 11:36 AM	#3
papagimp COMAS Rocks! Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Oklahoma City, OK Posts: 8,185 Blog Entries: 2	Try a different salt mix. I probably wouldn't do a 10% per day, I'd do maybe a 10% every other day. I'd also not use tap and drive to the LFS to buy ro/di water. Using tap is only going to cause other problems. FYI, in case you didn't know, nitrates are obvioulsy too high for a reef tank, IMO. Alk is way way way to high Ca is way way way to low Mag is kinda low, i'd get it upwards of 1300-1350 I was usuing IO salt mix for a long time and got similar results, even those results show a low Alk and low Ca levels. I switched to Reef Crystals (also made by IO) and it seems to have better results. Are you dosing CA or ALK supplements? If so, do not add any more alk until that levels drops down to about 7-11dKH or about 4-4.5meg/l and definatly up the dosage of calcium to get it back to about 400-420ppm So to answer your question: Do it, but do it cautiously. __________________ 58g Softie & 75g Stoney Member, Central Oklahoma Marine Aquarium Society Current Tank Info: 58g Mixed Reef Project - Started June 2011

07/12/2007, 11:38 AM	#4
drummereef Team RC Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: STL Posts: 14,754	1. how old is the tank? 2. what kind of filtration are you running? 3. what is your substrate type? __________________ -Brett 180g Marineland Starfire In-Wall 278 gallon system

07/12/2007, 11:41 AM	#5
papagimp COMAS Rocks! Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Oklahoma City, OK Posts: 8,185 Blog Entries: 2	any ammonia or nitrite present? And get a phosphate test kit while your at it. __________________ 58g Softie & 75g Stoney Member, Central Oklahoma Marine Aquarium Society Current Tank Info: 58g Mixed Reef Project - Started June 2011

07/12/2007, 11:41 AM	#6
Duff Man Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Chicago's far NW burbs Posts: 629	Doing 10 10% water changes will not equal a 100% water change. You will only be replacing 10% each time. It will take a long time for the new water to comprise a majority of the water in the tank. As to how beneficial this will be to the tank, I will let others with more experience make a comment. That being said, I would think twice about using the tap water. Can you get water from your LFS? I have heard of people using water from the grocrey store. I think that anything but tap water should be used.

07/12/2007, 11:50 AM	#7
hmello@bermexin Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Michigan Posts: 1,205	If nothing else get some distilled water from the grocery store. DO NOT use tap water. You are playing Russion Roulete with alge if you do... __________________ Henry Somewhere something incredible is waiting to be known. Current Tank Info: 29g BioCube, AI SOL 12" Super Blue

07/12/2007, 12:16 PM	#8
likhten Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: New York, NY Posts: 96	1. My tank 6 month old 2. Livestock: Clown fish, crabs and snails 3. what kind of filtration are you running? LR 45 lb, Skimmer AquaC, Filters: EHIME 2213 canister, internal FLUVAL 3 Refugium 4 gal 4. No ammonia or nitrite are present Thank you for any comments. __________________ :fish1: Current Tank Info: 45g, LR 45lb, Skimmer AquaC, Filters: EHIME 2213 canister, internal FLUVAL 3, PH201

07/12/2007, 12:24 PM	#9
der_wille_zur_macht Team RC Member Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: NY Posts: 17,749	What's your current water change schedule? What problems do you think you have? What do you hope to accomplish by doing the changes you mentioned in your post up top? __________________ Inconveniencing marine life since 1992 "It is my personal belief that reef aquaria should be thriving communities of biodiversity, representative of their wild counterparts, and not merely collections of pretty specimens growing on tidy clean rock shelves covered in purple coralline algae." (Eric Borneman)

07/12/2007, 12:28 PM	#10
kevin2000 Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 3,805	Your high nitrate level isn't going to hurt your clown fish. You have a high alk level which can only happen if you have been using additives ... the low calc level is probably the result of your using too much alkalinity additives. I don't see anything to be that concerned about or anything that regular water changes won't cure.

07/12/2007, 01:12 PM	#12
chris31 Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: long island NY Posts: 928	trust me to not use tap water i made that mistake and and now my tank is full of alege trust me try to do what ever you can to get some ro/di water or go by a ro/di unit that what im doing this weekend but what ever you do DO NOT USE TAP WATER! you will regret it

07/12/2007, 01:21 PM	#13
likhten Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: New York, NY Posts: 96	I have weekly 10% water change schedule. I thought to do major water change help bring Nitrate down to 0 as well as resolve Alk-Ca problem. Am I correct? __________________ :fish1: Current Tank Info: 45g, LR 45lb, Skimmer AquaC, Filters: EHIME 2213 canister, internal FLUVAL 3, PH201

07/12/2007, 01:41 PM	#14
der_wille_zur_macht Team RC Member Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: NY Posts: 17,749	Yes, a major water change will help those sorts of problems. However, you want to do a single bigger change, not just a bunch of 10% changes in a row. For instance, you could do a 30% change, instead of 3, 10% changes. 10% weekly sounds like a high frequency but low volume - most people would probably suggest switching to 20 - 30% monthly instead. It'll be less overall work, too. Regardless, if you got in the situation you are currently in, you need to change something longterm instead of just doing water changes to fix the problem. Check out the link Nanz posted, it has lots of great info. __________________ Inconveniencing marine life since 1992 "It is my personal belief that reef aquaria should be thriving communities of biodiversity, representative of their wild counterparts, and not merely collections of pretty specimens growing on tidy clean rock shelves covered in purple coralline algae." (Eric Borneman)

07/12/2007, 01:48 PM	#15
jeeperrs Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Oklahoma City Posts: 572	I think doing 10% water changes every 2-3 days would be good. After each water change I would retest your water to see where you are at. Then do another small water change as you have mentioned until you are at the point in which you are comfortable. I don't think anything is so out of whack that your tank is going to crash tonight lol. Also, I think the small water changes will help the livestock adjust to the new water parameters. This is maybe not relative but what is your pH with your water at 11 meq/L??? Just be careful, a lot of people on here do knee jerk reactions then have to correct what they just caused. I think you have a good idea with the small water changes over a period of time. As far as the tap water, if that is what you have, use it

07/12/2007, 01:50 PM	#16
hmello@bermexin Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Michigan Posts: 1,205	Anytime I check ammonia, trates and trites they are zero. Calcuim runs in the 400-440 rang, alkk in the 3.5-4 meg range and Mg from in the 1300-1350 range. Mostly I don't even check ammonia or trites anymore. I figure if I see a rise in nitrites then I'll check the others to see what if anything is going on. Most importatnly my livestock looks good. If I see any decline in something I will do more exhaustive testing. My water change schedule is 10% per week with a good cleaning of the mechanical filtration stuff. Once per month I will do a 20%. Seems to work for me and I might even be overdoing it. __________________ Henry Somewhere something incredible is waiting to be known. Current Tank Info: 29g BioCube, AI SOL 12" Super Blue