Return pumps/CL ?'s

bkoz · 08/28/2007, 05:17 PM

Hi all, as you can see im a newb here so bare with me. Im puting together a 29 gal with sump and need some advice with the build, the returns, pumps and closed loop in particular.

Im going to drill the tank for a closed loop and 2 internal 1" (vertical) overflows.

Question 1
Why wouldnt I want to use two pumps in my sump return (return will be in center of skimmer and fuge) and use one of the pumps with a scwd for the closed loop?

Question 2
Im not using any substrate in my DT. Would it be benificial to have 2 of the returns a couple of inches above the bottom of the tank behind my reef to keep debris from gathering where I cant see or get too?

I'll start there but im sure i'll have a bunch of other ?'s and with post some pics as I get going. Any input or advice would be great, thanks!!!!

AZDesertRat · 08/28/2007, 06:12 PM

A closed loop by definition does not draw water from the sump or any external source. It takes water directly from the tank, through a pump and back into the tank never exposed to atmosphere, its a closed system. It can sit down in a sump for cooling or noise dampening but it will be plumbed directly to the display on both the suction and discharge sides.

You want to keep the returns close to the surface so if and when the power goes off either by accident or if you shut it off, it does not siphon the whole tank down into the sump and all over your floor. Never never ever depend on a check valve or drilled holes to prevent a flood as both will fail even with regular maintenance, which we all seem to forget anyway. Keep the returns just under the surface, pointed whatever way you want for current like with LocLine, and alway maintain sufficient room in your sump to contain a worst case backflow/backsiphonage. My tank drops 1 inch when the power goes off and that equates to 4.6 gallons so I maintain about 8 gallons worth of room in my sump even when it is at its fullest.

bkoz · 08/28/2007, 07:35 PM

Thanks for the info.

I will just go ahead and mount the pump under the tank and drill another hole for the supply to the closed loop.

Too bad they dont make a check valve of some sort for marine applications, guess it would have to be made of titanium or high quality stainless? Oh well, i'll make sure to mount them up high.

My sump is going to be a 29g as well so im sure there will be enough room in case of a power outage.

You work in waste water treatement? Im in the prosess of getting my lisense. I am taking a class now (in a half hour actually) and i'll be taking the exam for my license in Feb. Hopefully I wont have too hard a time on the exam.

Thanks again for the info. More ?'s to fallow gotta get to class.

AZDesertRat · 08/28/2007, 07:41 PM

Right On !!! I love to see people getting into the profession. Its been good to me for well over 30 years now. I carry licenses at the highest level in AZ (Grade 4) in water treatment, wastewater teratment, water distribution and wastewater collections all four. Its a great trade. Good Luck!

08/28/2007, 05:17 PM	#1
bkoz Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Anderson, CA Posts: 163	Return pumps/CL ?'s Hi all, as you can see im a newb here so bare with me. Im puting together a 29 gal with sump and need some advice with the build, the returns, pumps and closed loop in particular. Im going to drill the tank for a closed loop and 2 internal 1" (vertical) overflows. Question 1 Why wouldnt I want to use two pumps in my sump return (return will be in center of skimmer and fuge) and use one of the pumps with a scwd for the closed loop? Question 2 Im not using any substrate in my DT. Would it be benificial to have 2 of the returns a couple of inches above the bottom of the tank behind my reef to keep debris from gathering where I cant see or get too? I'll start there but im sure i'll have a bunch of other ?'s and with post some pics as I get going. Any input or advice would be great, thanks!!!!

08/28/2007, 06:12 PM	#2
AZDesertRat Moved On Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: NW Phoenix Posts: 16,621	A closed loop by definition does not draw water from the sump or any external source. It takes water directly from the tank, through a pump and back into the tank never exposed to atmosphere, its a closed system. It can sit down in a sump for cooling or noise dampening but it will be plumbed directly to the display on both the suction and discharge sides. You want to keep the returns close to the surface so if and when the power goes off either by accident or if you shut it off, it does not siphon the whole tank down into the sump and all over your floor. Never never ever depend on a check valve or drilled holes to prevent a flood as both will fail even with regular maintenance, which we all seem to forget anyway. Keep the returns just under the surface, pointed whatever way you want for current like with LocLine, and alway maintain sufficient room in your sump to contain a worst case backflow/backsiphonage. My tank drops 1 inch when the power goes off and that equates to 4.6 gallons so I maintain about 8 gallons worth of room in my sump even when it is at its fullest.

08/28/2007, 07:35 PM	#3
bkoz Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Anderson, CA Posts: 163	Thanks for the info. I will just go ahead and mount the pump under the tank and drill another hole for the supply to the closed loop. Too bad they dont make a check valve of some sort for marine applications, guess it would have to be made of titanium or high quality stainless? Oh well, i'll make sure to mount them up high. My sump is going to be a 29g as well so im sure there will be enough room in case of a power outage. You work in waste water treatement? Im in the prosess of getting my lisense. I am taking a class now (in a half hour actually) and i'll be taking the exam for my license in Feb. Hopefully I wont have too hard a time on the exam. Thanks again for the info. More ?'s to fallow gotta get to class.

08/28/2007, 07:41 PM	#4
AZDesertRat Moved On Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: NW Phoenix Posts: 16,621	Right On !!! I love to see people getting into the profession. Its been good to me for well over 30 years now. I carry licenses at the highest level in AZ (Grade 4) in water treatment, wastewater teratment, water distribution and wastewater collections all four. Its a great trade. Good Luck!