Reefs and Photography-with this camera?

[buccard]

I posted this in the photography forum as well, but I thought I might get more traffic here...

I don't know much about photography but my 90 gallon reef tank is making me more and more interested. My wife is also interested in taking some outdoor/nature shots...and possibly more. One of her coworkers has a camera and lenses he is wanting to sell...I have seen the camera, original box and paperwork is all there. It all appears to be clean and in good working order.

Here is what it contains:

Canon EOS 20D camera body
Battery and Charger
Interface cable
video cable
software
256kmemory card

Lenses:
Canon EF-S 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6
Canon 75-300mm 1:4-5.6
Tokina BH-733 AT-X PRO 20-35mm 1:2.8

This camera is definately over my head-I will have a lot to learn about its capabilities...most certainly will need another lense for what I want to use the camera for(macro).

The owner wants $500 for the total package.

Tell me your opinions...good deal? Would I be better off with a newer model?

Is this a good camera to start learning with?

[wrott]

I would get this instead,
http://www.amazon.com/Canon-Digital-...336261&sr=1-21

[GTriever]

That camera will last you many moons, and even with the age on it, it's a much better camera than the XS model.

[virginiadiver69]

agreed...the 20D is a better camera. You could have a camera shop look it over to make sure all is working well. I would especially have the imaging sensor looked at.

[qfrisco]

That's a great camera, but in my opinion, overkill if all you'll be getting it for is tank pics. But if, like you said, your wife could use it as well, it's probably a deal worth jumping on.

In general, for tank pics, look for a camera that supports at least aperture priority (ability to manually set how wide to keep the aperture open) and shutter priority (ability to manually set how long to keep the shutter open). I'm not familiar with all the features of that camera, but as a D-SLR, I'm pretty sure that camera supports these features.

Manual focus is nice, but in my opinion, not nearly as important as the above two. Again, as a D-SLR, I'm pretty sure that camera supports it.

I only say this because there are some pretty capable "point-and-shoots" that support the above features that would give you excellent pics of your tank, but as I said, if you'll be able to use the camera for more things than just tank pics, I'd jump on it. There's definitely lots of upside to the camera, if you're willing to learn to use it.

[Ebisan]

Check out www.dpreview.com for camera reviews.

For the 20D, http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/canoneos20d/

For the XS, http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/canoneos1000d/

[Michael]

if you go down the DSLR route then have a look at beerguys advice

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/sh...readid=1503490

[buccard]

Thanks for all the feedback, this camera seems to fit my needs and those of my wife. Luckily the seller is a good friend and has let us use the camera for the weekend.

We are going to see if it can create good pictures with our limited knowledge, if so the pictures should only get better as we learn more, right?

I will probably want another lense for macro shots.

Thanks for all the links...I may post a couple of shots from this weekend just for fun.

[paraletho]

I just got a Olympus Stylus 1030SW. I know it is basically a point and shoot butn its waterproof to 33 ft (10meters) so you stick it in the tank and no glass distortion or flash reflection. Great macro shots. About $330 I don't know if this is something you would be interested in but I love mine.

[mattman7858]

i just have a canon powershot A720 and i love it. i got the underwater casing for it for my birthday and boy! its amazing, it was most valuable on my trip to the galapagos! imagine looking at corals and tangs and all of a sudden a penguin zips by! haha

[melev]

The Canon 20D is a good camera, but as you stated, you'll have to still buy a macro lens for it. The range of lenses available is nice, and you'd be looking for something between 90mm - 110mm. Mine is a 90mm, but everyone told me to buy the 105mm or 110mm. Make sure the lens is an actual Macro lens that shoots 1:1 and not 1:2. The 1:1 ratio is important.

I think you got a very good price with the camera. The memory card is much too small though, but you can buy those quite cheaply on newegg or amazon or geeks.com - Get one that is 1gig or more.

If it comes with a second battery, even better.

The zoom lens (300mm) isn't used very much, but when you need it, you'll be glad you have it. Like going to the zoo, so you can zoom in on the animal that is 50' away from the fence. Manual focus will be nice because you can focus right though chain link and see the subject beautifully.

It's good that you got to borrow it first, but I would ask if you can hang onto it for a week to 10 days instead of two days. The more you use it, the more you'll know how you feel about it. I got to borrow a D70 for about that long before I bought the one I have now (D70s), and I really didn't know how I felt until I'd really used it for about 10 days.

DPreview says you'll love it too: Look at their 'in conclusion' page - http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/canoneos20d/page28.asp

[buccard]

Thanks for all your feed back, I played with the camera a little and my Wife went out and took some photos. I was happy to see her pics were close ups of flowers. I think she may like some macro shots as well(makes it easier to get her on board with a really nice macro lense!).

These photos are on auto and only cropped and resized for easy posting...no other editing.

I have a lot to learn-at least I can take a decent picture with my limited knowledge(you may think different)







flash was on:






The camera is much larger than what a normal point and shoot runs, but it seems comfortable.

[melev]

The outdoors images look excellent, and that makes sense because outdoor photography is far easier, ime. You can't really go wrong with auto in most normal situations. However, when you want to do some crazy stuff, like photograph fireworks, or Shamu at the apex of her jump, then you'll need to know some features to capture that special moment.

Click on Fotos on my site for the basics. Now that I have a DSLR myself, I'll be updating both that page and the "What should I purchase" pages.

[buccard]

Tank photos are very difficult...focusing is tough, I had a porcelain crab on a rock up front filter feeding and was disappointed with the shot...looks like I have alot to learn about the features in order to capture the photo I am after...
Alot of these reefkeepers make it look easy!

Here it is all auto setting:

Full shot


Cropped...


I am having fun with the camera...leaning toward buying it.

Thanks for all your opinions, I love this website!

[melev]

The more you zoom in (or crop), the less focused it may be. If you read the super long review page on DPreview that was provided to you, it will explain every single button, including some you've not even discovered yet (I promise you, there are some that have evaded you. ).

A tripod is a smart way to keep it very still. And practicing on stuff like Porcelain Crabs is a good idea.

[buccard]

Originally posted by melev
The more you zoom in (or crop), the less focused it may be. If you read the super long review page on DPreview that was provided to you, it will explain every single button, including some you've not even discovered yet (I promise you, there are some that have evaded you. ).

A tripod is a smart way to keep it very still. And practicing on stuff like Porcelain Crabs is a good idea.

I have alot of reading/learning in my future, dppreview has a ton of information, I've only scratched the surface.

I not only need button descriptions, but the theory behind the function and applications. I look forward to reading your site, your articles have always read well-not like a medical dictionary. Thanks again.

[melev]

Roger, that review will do just that. It may take you 5 hours / 5 days to read the entire DPreview about this camera, but once you've done it, you'll better grasp future reviews of other cameras because they do each review the exact same way. Some of it will be completely over your head right now, but over time it will sink in. The first few pages will cover the basic mechanics.

[divewsharks]

this is one of those times when reading the manual is highly recommended. there is quite a bit that 20D can do. I'm on my 3rd Canon DSLR (currently using a 40D, we'll see if I stay there are move to a 5DII).
As mentioned above you'll want to learn to shoot in TV and AV modes, and unless you have a fast lens (and even with) you'll want to shoot with a tripod, especially with a macro lens. the Sigma 105mm Macro is a very good lens as is the Tamron 90mm Macro, I use the Canon 100mm Macro, and a I will often throw a 500D on it, to go better than 1:1. You can also use extension tubes to obtain macro shots without using a 'macro' lens.
the flash on the 20D (or any onboard flash on any of the Canon DSLRs) is rarely worth using, however when shooting Auto, the camera often wants to use it. You really shouldn't need the flash when shooting in the tank, however for outdoors, an add-on flash like a 420EX/430EX or 580EX or good to have, they can often be picked up used.

[GTriever]

I agree with 'sharks, and am getting jealous. A 5D? WOW! I was thinking of moving to a 50D myself. Definitely a tripod, with remote shutter control for Macro shooting, and that Canon 100mm Macro is a fantastic lens. The remote flash is also a good idea. The manual is a good place to start learning about your camera. The Canon forum at Photography-on-the-net is also a good source of info (though highly opinionated at times).

Warning to buccard: You'll rapidly get hooked on the capabilities of a DSLR system; then you need a wide angle lens, and a portrait lens, and a long range lens, etc., etc. Unfortunately, with SW aquaria and Photography it looks like you've picked two of the most expensive hobbies to get hooked on!

[IslandCrow]

You may want to check out this forum for your camera related questions: http://photography-on-the.net/forum/.

I agree that the 20D is a good camera. I just upgraded my original Digital Rebel. It's a couple generations behind the 20D, but I would probably still own it if it hadn't developed a couple of mechanical problems that eventually got a little annoying. For a macro lens. Here's a very good macro lens if you end up getting one down the road (and I'd highly recommend it): http://www.adorama.com/CA10028AFN.html.

Hopefully the price isn't too intimidating (you could probably also pick it up used). You'll quickly find that in the world of SLR cameras (digital or otherwise), the lens has far more effect on image quality than the camera body.

[melev]

Nice signature line, Mike C.

[buccard]

Originally posted by GTriever

Warning to buccard: You'll rapidly get hooked on the capabilities of a DSLR system; then you need a wide angle lens, and a portrait lens, and a long range lens, etc., etc. Unfortunately, with SW aquaria and Photography it looks like you've picked two of the most expensive hobbies to get hooked on!

And hooked good...too.

Its hard to have something so interesting and dynamic sitting in my living room. Photography seems apart of the natural progression in this hobby.

I appreciate all the leads and information, I will be checking all of them out, and the lense sugestions are helpful too.

[divewsharks]

Originally posted by GTriever

Unfortunately, with SW aquaria and Photography it looks like you've picked two of the most expensive hobbies to get hooked on!

throw in Scuba Diving, and my kids are going to have to get scholarships to goto college...

[GTriever]

+1; my OTHER two "hobbies" (read that as money-pits) are woodworking and firearms. Why can't I have a non-expensive hobby like brain surgery or something?