Refugium & Phosphates

singold · 04/08/2009, 09:52 PM

Is it a natural correlation that a refugium will increase the liklihood of higher phosphate levels, given the usage of added lighting necessity to grow the cheato? Not to mention lighting is active during the night, which it is recommended to run in refugium? Therefore tank is exposed to lighting 24/7?

ludiNano · 04/08/2009, 10:12 PM

I believe a refugium is used to lower nitrate, phos with the harvesting of the macro algae.

The algae is obviously takeing up phos in the water if its growing and also binding it in the algae, unable to hinder growth in corals... Which is also why a tank covered in algae can read 0 phos. , because the algae is taking it up fast. Then removed if harvested.

It can leach out nutrients if left to over grow and die off in area's.

And your whole tank is not exposed to 24 hr lighting. The water may be but so is the ocean when you think about it. If your running lighting opposite then each half is geting its proper dark periods. And helps keep ph stable though the night.

drummereef · 04/08/2009, 10:36 PM

Lots of good info in this thread.

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/sh...readid=1349443

Whys · 04/08/2009, 11:07 PM

Trying to reinvent the refugium? I've noticed you've been dissecting the details of refugia theory and practice. Capn_hylinur is the one to talk to about this stuff. He's been trying to put together an ad hoc encyclopedia on refugia.

For what it's worth, I've opted for a liverock dominated slow-fuge with just a dusting of multi-grain-size sand. I've allowed the turf algaes to take over a bit and will eventually place just a little chaeto on top for bio-diversity. It's intended primarily for pod production, liverock cultivation, and turf scrubbing. From time to time I rotate a small rock with one in the display tank to help reseed pods and provide dietary diversity for my algae eaters. It makes for an icky looking fuge, but it seems to be working.

Whys · 04/08/2009, 11:12 PM

Oh, I also run my fuge-light on an opposite 16-hr cycle. There are those who believe algae derives a benefit from a few hours of darkness, but I also believe there is a benefit to a small amount of overlap in photo-cycles as biological processes don't flip like a switch.

singold · 04/08/2009, 11:33 PM

Thanks for the information and thread link. Very informative. "Whys", by no means am I "trying to reinvent the refugium". I just set up a refugium less than a month ago and am trying to understand its complete methodology.

Whys · 04/09/2009, 12:09 AM

That's kind of my point. There is no complete or prefect methodology, per say. "Refugium" is an inadequate catch all term for a wide range of somewhat experimental applications. There are few hard facts, a lot of disagreement, and the book has yet to be written.

Unfortunately, I've noticed a reduced interest in refugia lately. In particular, the slow-flow design is now often overlooked for the simplicity of inline tumbling chaeto. But I find this far too limiting in application and question the overall usefulness of chaeto when compared to DSB and GFO alternatives. I prefer pod production for a supplemental food source and believe when combined with a slow flow, it improves biological filtration of detritus. I use a DSB in the display for nitrate reduction. Some use a DSB in the fuge for that, but I believe it to be much less effective and more prone to problems.

04/08/2009, 09:52 PM	#1
singold Registered Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: Lake Saint Louis, Missouri Posts: 1,827	Refugium & Phosphates Is it a natural correlation that a refugium will increase the liklihood of higher phosphate levels, given the usage of added lighting necessity to grow the cheato? Not to mention lighting is active during the night, which it is recommended to run in refugium? Therefore tank is exposed to lighting 24/7? __________________ "If there is no wind.....row." Current Tank Info: 75gal Reef w/29gal Refugium

04/08/2009, 10:12 PM	#2
ludiNano I'm becoming...Brundlefly Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Bettendorf, Iowas Posts: 1,804	I believe a refugium is used to lower nitrate, phos with the harvesting of the macro algae. The algae is obviously takeing up phos in the water if its growing and also binding it in the algae, unable to hinder growth in corals... Which is also why a tank covered in algae can read 0 phos. , because the algae is taking it up fast. Then removed if harvested. It can leach out nutrients if left to over grow and die off in area's. And your whole tank is not exposed to 24 hr lighting. The water may be but so is the ocean when you think about it. If your running lighting opposite then each half is geting its proper dark periods. And helps keep ph stable though the night. __________________ -The Loungers really contribute to RC.~ Agu -JoshTodd has a very good point. ~ R_Hudson -Fresh air will get the stink off ~ Carrie

04/08/2009, 10:36 PM	#3
drummereef Team RC Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: STL Posts: 14,754	Lots of good info in this thread. http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/sh...readid=1349443 __________________ -Brett 180g Marineland Starfire In-Wall 278 gallon system

04/08/2009, 11:33 PM	#6
singold Registered Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: Lake Saint Louis, Missouri Posts: 1,827	Thanks for the information and thread link. Very informative. "Whys", by no means am I "trying to reinvent the refugium". I just set up a refugium less than a month ago and am trying to understand its complete methodology. __________________ "If there is no wind.....row." Current Tank Info: 75gal Reef w/29gal Refugium

04/08/2009, 11:07 PM	#4
Whys Moved On Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Spokane, WA Posts: 3,263	Trying to reinvent the refugium? I've noticed you've been dissecting the details of refugia theory and practice. Capn_hylinur is the one to talk to about this stuff. He's been trying to put together an ad hoc encyclopedia on refugia. For what it's worth, I've opted for a liverock dominated slow-fuge with just a dusting of multi-grain-size sand. I've allowed the turf algaes to take over a bit and will eventually place just a little chaeto on top for bio-diversity. It's intended primarily for pod production, liverock cultivation, and turf scrubbing. From time to time I rotate a small rock with one in the display tank to help reseed pods and provide dietary diversity for my algae eaters. It makes for an icky looking fuge, but it seems to be working.

04/08/2009, 11:12 PM	#5
Whys Moved On Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Spokane, WA Posts: 3,263	Oh, I also run my fuge-light on an opposite 16-hr cycle. There are those who believe algae derives a benefit from a few hours of darkness, but I also believe there is a benefit to a small amount of overlap in photo-cycles as biological processes don't flip like a switch.

04/09/2009, 12:09 AM	#7
Whys Moved On Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Spokane, WA Posts: 3,263	That's kind of my point. There is no complete or prefect methodology, per say. "Refugium" is an inadequate catch all term for a wide range of somewhat experimental applications. There are few hard facts, a lot of disagreement, and the book has yet to be written. Unfortunately, I've noticed a reduced interest in refugia lately. In particular, the slow-flow design is now often overlooked for the simplicity of inline tumbling chaeto. But I find this far too limiting in application and question the overall usefulness of chaeto when compared to DSB and GFO alternatives. I prefer pod production for a supplemental food source and believe when combined with a slow flow, it improves biological filtration of detritus. I use a DSB in the display for nitrate reduction. Some use a DSB in the fuge for that, but I believe it to be much less effective and more prone to problems.