bio wheel

ricksconnected · 08/14/2009, 09:46 PM

i know this has been brought up several times.
im trying to explain to a friend why bio wheels are such a bad idea, and how they dump nitrates back into your aquarium.
can somebody please give me a somewhat detailed explanation on this so i can explain it better to him.

thegrun · 08/14/2009, 09:56 PM

Bio wheels do a good job of converting ammonia to nitrites and nitrites to nitrates (both aerobic processes). They cannot however break down nitrates, which is an anaerobic process. The tiny pores in live rock provide a anaerobic environment where nitrates can be broken down. So a bio wheel will produce more nitrates than live rock.

ricksconnected · 08/14/2009, 10:04 PM

ok so why do they do such a good job in freshwater tanks?
or do they?

cloak · 08/15/2009, 12:44 AM

I'm pretty sure I can run a successfull reef tank with a biowheel. That's just me though. It ain't rocket science when it comes down to it.

"Breakin the law, breakin the law."

BurntOutReefer · 08/15/2009, 12:48 AM

clean every month and they are quite effective

wickedfish · 08/15/2009, 12:59 AM

In my opinion. Bio-wheels are more for fresh water and also fowlr s.w tanks. It does a good job cleaning the water. Keeps the water clear. Its does raise your nitrates because it traps it. When i first started i had a fowlr s.w tank. I used the bio wheels here and there and run it for an hour. It use to clear the water nice. But i would only use it for that reason from time to time. From what i know, but opinion defers, since i have 2 reef setups i dont use the bio wheels at all. Takes nutrients our for the corals' etc and chemicals i put in. I just run a sump, skimmer and fuge.

BurntOutReefer · 08/15/2009, 01:03 AM

"Takes nutrients our for the corals' etc and chemicals i put in. "..........????
I dont understand this....can you explain pls...how does it take mag and caluim, iodine, etc out...
The main (and IMO) only reason people dont use biowheels is because they dont follow correct husbandry and allow the biowheels to do what they are designed for.....and that is to create Nitrates....and thus"killing" ammo and nitrites

BurntOutReefer · 08/15/2009, 01:06 AM

and what cloak said

billdogg · 08/15/2009, 05:05 AM

Bio Wheels are just that - BIOLOGICAL filters. They DO NOT remove any Ca+, Iodine, Mg+, etc. The problem with them is that they are so efficient at converting Ammonia to nitrite/nitrate, that it can lead to a buildup of nitrate in your system unless regular water changes are done.

That being said - my 60g cube has been in continuous operation since 1992. I use a penguin emperor (dual) biowheel filter and a canister filter (filled with carbon + LR) along with the LR in the tank as my filtration. I run 3 x 24" VHO for lighting, and have a glass cover to keep the jumpers in. (got tired of feeding the cat, LOL) I keep a mixture of softies and a bunch of smaller happy fish without issues. I do a 30% or so water change about every 4 - 6 weeks. If I remember, I rinse the biowheels in clean tank water, and change the carbon in the canister. I also change the GFO in a TLF reactor at that time. I do not supplement anything that water changes does not replace. I have not tested the water recently - I don't really bother - I can pretty much tell by looking at it if something is out of whack.

HTH

cloak · 08/15/2009, 05:08 AM

A biowheel is no diffferent than the interface, where water meets air, all around the tank.

MrHarvard · 08/15/2009, 06:43 AM

I personally dont wouldnt use a biowheel on a saltwater tank but, I know plenty of people who do. As long as you clean it frequently (like every time you do a water change) they do work. They are actually starting to make saltwater biowheels now and putting them on smaller cube style tanks. So basically if you clean them often and dont let them turn into a nitrate factory you can use them and have success. IMO if you have enough live rock for filtration you dont even need the biowheel. Like I said JMO....

wickedfish · 08/15/2009, 11:37 AM

My, bad i was told it took out nutrients for the corals etc in the tanks. Either way , i havent used one in years, because i dont need, too. I still have my emporer sitting around somewhere in the garage. But yes, but from my brief understanding there best for freshwater and Fowlr, not reef. Why, im doing my research as as i type, hehe.

aquaman05 · 08/15/2009, 05:09 PM

I have been using my for years on my tank and with not any problems.
But the only reason i am is because it was the eclipse system and it had it on there already. Maybe i should clean the biowheel but i heard you dont touch them(maybe just fresh water)
This is a fowlr system

cloak · 08/15/2009, 05:12 PM

Wave action on the glass.

08/14/2009, 09:46 PM	#1
ricksconnected Registered Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: ga Posts: 201	bio wheel i know this has been brought up several times. im trying to explain to a friend why bio wheels are such a bad idea, and how they dump nitrates back into your aquarium. can somebody please give me a somewhat detailed explanation on this so i can explain it better to him.

08/15/2009, 05:05 AM	#9
billdogg Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Grove City, Ohio Posts: 10,806	Bio Wheels are just that - BIOLOGICAL filters. They DO NOT remove any Ca+, Iodine, Mg+, etc. The problem with them is that they are so efficient at converting Ammonia to nitrite/nitrate, that it can lead to a buildup of nitrate in your system unless regular water changes are done. That being said - my 60g cube has been in continuous operation since 1992. I use a penguin emperor (dual) biowheel filter and a canister filter (filled with carbon + LR) along with the LR in the tank as my filtration. I run 3 x 24" VHO for lighting, and have a glass cover to keep the jumpers in. (got tired of feeding the cat, LOL) I keep a mixture of softies and a bunch of smaller happy fish without issues. I do a 30% or so water change about every 4 - 6 weeks. If I remember, I rinse the biowheels in clean tank water, and change the carbon in the canister. I also change the GFO in a TLF reactor at that time. I do not supplement anything that water changes does not replace. I have not tested the water recently - I don't really bother - I can pretty much tell by looking at it if something is out of whack. HTH __________________ I'll try to be nice if you try to be smarter! I can't help that I grow older, but you can't make me grow up! Current Tank Info: 120 mixed reef with 40b sump, RO 150 skimmer, AI Sol Blue x 2, and a 60g Frag Tank with 100g rubbermaid sump. 2 x Kessil A360w lights, BM curve 5 skimmer

08/15/2009, 06:43 AM	#11
MrHarvard "ship it" Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Tampa/Westchase Posts: 2,951	I personally dont wouldnt use a biowheel on a saltwater tank but, I know plenty of people who do. As long as you clean it frequently (like every time you do a water change) they do work. They are actually starting to make saltwater biowheels now and putting them on smaller cube style tanks. So basically if you clean them often and dont let them turn into a nitrate factory you can use them and have success. IMO if you have enough live rock for filtration you dont even need the biowheel. Like I said JMO.... __________________ "You gon learn today!" Current Tank Info: SPS Dominant 29g BB Rimless Bio Cube lit by 2x AI Primes, IM desktop Reactor, Tunze ATO, Tunze. 9001 skimmer ........ 40g Breeder with 20g long sump/refugium. ATI 4 bulb T5s....Mixed reef stock heavy on SPS.

08/14/2009, 09:56 PM	#2
thegrun Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Garden Grove, Ca Posts: 17,023	Bio wheels do a good job of converting ammonia to nitrites and nitrites to nitrates (both aerobic processes). They cannot however break down nitrates, which is an anaerobic process. The tiny pores in live rock provide a anaerobic environment where nitrates can be broken down. So a bio wheel will produce more nitrates than live rock.

08/14/2009, 10:04 PM	#3
ricksconnected Registered Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: ga Posts: 201	ok so why do they do such a good job in freshwater tanks? or do they?

08/15/2009, 12:44 AM	#4
cloak Moved On Join Date: Jul 2000 Location: Stockton, CA Posts: 14,854	I'm pretty sure I can run a successfull reef tank with a biowheel. That's just me though. It ain't rocket science when it comes down to it. "Breakin the law, breakin the law."

08/15/2009, 12:48 AM	#5
BurntOutReefer Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Granada Hills Posts: 4,376	clean every month and they are quite effective

08/15/2009, 12:59 AM	#6
wickedfish Moved On Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Southbay Posts: 2,167	In my opinion. Bio-wheels are more for fresh water and also fowlr s.w tanks. It does a good job cleaning the water. Keeps the water clear. Its does raise your nitrates because it traps it. When i first started i had a fowlr s.w tank. I used the bio wheels here and there and run it for an hour. It use to clear the water nice. But i would only use it for that reason from time to time. From what i know, but opinion defers, since i have 2 reef setups i dont use the bio wheels at all. Takes nutrients our for the corals' etc and chemicals i put in. I just run a sump, skimmer and fuge.

08/15/2009, 01:03 AM	#7
BurntOutReefer Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Granada Hills Posts: 4,376	"Takes nutrients our for the corals' etc and chemicals i put in. "..........???? I dont understand this....can you explain pls...how does it take mag and caluim, iodine, etc out... The main (and IMO) only reason people dont use biowheels is because they dont follow correct husbandry and allow the biowheels to do what they are designed for.....and that is to create Nitrates....and thus"killing" ammo and nitrites

08/15/2009, 01:06 AM	#8
BurntOutReefer Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Granada Hills Posts: 4,376	and what cloak said

08/15/2009, 05:08 AM	#10
cloak Moved On Join Date: Jul 2000 Location: Stockton, CA Posts: 14,854	A biowheel is no diffferent than the interface, where water meets air, all around the tank.

08/15/2009, 11:37 AM	#12
wickedfish Moved On Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Southbay Posts: 2,167	My, bad i was told it took out nutrients for the corals etc in the tanks. Either way , i havent used one in years, because i dont need, too. I still have my emporer sitting around somewhere in the garage. But yes, but from my brief understanding there best for freshwater and Fowlr, not reef. Why, im doing my research as as i type, hehe.

08/15/2009, 05:09 PM	#13
aquaman05 Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: indiana Posts: 722	I have been using my for years on my tank and with not any problems. But the only reason i am is because it was the eclipse system and it had it on there already. Maybe i should clean the biowheel but i heard you dont touch them(maybe just fresh water) This is a fowlr system

08/15/2009, 05:12 PM	#14
cloak Moved On Join Date: Jul 2000 Location: Stockton, CA Posts: 14,854	Wave action on the glass.