Worth the Upgrade?

[justinf67]

I am hooked on this hobby, was already into fresh, but my new salt tank my new obsession... I started a 28g bowfront(not sure, math says 27g) about 4 months ago... I went really slow, bought lots of live rock, added slowly, etc... I then added a sump/fuge with chaeto... I had a maxijet 1200 for flow, and upgraded to a koralia 1050 evo...

Anyway, the short length of my bowfront is killing me. I hate the limits on the aquascaping for me....I want to upgrade, but a 55g the width is too short for me... I want to get a 40 breeder as the width is 18'' and Id have an extra foot of length... One main issue I have is sand blowing around unless I point my evo towards my largest rock, because I bought the sugar sized sand... In the 40g I would be using the reef select stuff wihich is much larger grain...

My main questions about this upgrade are, would it be worth it to upgrade for only about 13 extra gallons worth of water? I currently have a 10g sump, which I would upgrade to a 20g, so water volume in total would jump from 38g(with sump) to 60g(with sump)..The tank is reef, with a few rics, zoa and a new frogspawn...

What would be the process of moving everything over so I dont get a spike? Or a very small one? Thanks

[theatrus]

You do gain a lot more surface area in a 40 breeder. Is a 75g right out in terms of size? It has the 18in depth as well.

If you can plumb the new tank while keeping the old one running, and then transfer the contents as quickly as possible everything should be fine. Keep spare water handy in case something gets upset. If you need to rearrange stuff, keep all of your rockwork and livestock in plastic bins with circulation.

[justinf67]

I would LOVE the 75g, but im limited, as I cant get anything too large, I already run 2 55g, one 38g, and 2 10g tanks for cichlids and my girlfriend is very understanding to a point...A 75g is out of the question, lol...But, the upgrade to a 40g would give me the extra floorspace I really want. I wanted to incorporate an extra 25 lbs of marco dry rock I just got as well...

[lordofthereef]

It sounds to me you have already talked yourself into this being worth it and really that is all that matters is it not?

[Rockys_Pride]

Its always worth it

[rayn]

Just do it

[cveverly]

40 breeder is a great tank if you need to stay on the smaller size. Far better than the bowfront that you have now. Many more aquascape options, better foot print, more lighting options and less likely to leak.

There, did I help?

[nanshaw2001]

Oh yeah....I would! Every upgrade brings new experiences and adventures!!!!

[Mavrk]

My first tank (twenty years ago) was a 55 gallon. Even though it has more water, I now know that the 40 breeder has better dimensions than the 55. Like you said, the floor space is important.

It sounds like 3 feet is your max. If you can find a 50 gallon it will give you a little more height (not the 50 long) and it is easier to justify the upgrade. It is really just a tall 40 breeder (you mentioned blowing sand and the height will help). The 40 breeder is still one of my favorite dimensions though. Throw a 20 long underneath either of these and you have a great combo.

[justinf67]

Well, I am approved for the 40 breeder, and its on sale for 40...Just need to get it when its in stock, lol...I went to try tonight, and they were out. Im def upgrading... I found otu when their next shipment comes in, so wish me luck

Now, as for moving everything, whats the best way? I have to build the stand for the 40, but that shouldnt take more than a few hours.... When stand is built, whats the best way to go about it? I have numerous buckets and a 18g rubbermaid... I would guess that draining out the water into the 18g rubbermaid, and a few buckets. add rock to the rubbermaid, catch the fish and put them in buckets, put my coral in with the live rock.... Tank would be just about empty... I would pull tank off, move old stand, put new stand in place, and 40g tank on top.....

Now, what about the sand? I have carib-sea aragonite sand(sugar) and wont be using it in the next tank, as I am gonna do reefselect this time... Should I add a cup of the sand from the old tank after I add the new sand to the 40g?

I will keep the 10g sump/fuge on the new system for about a week, then switch over the fuge to a new 20g.... that way, Ill space out the shock to the system of the move... The sump/fuge is barebottomed, with some live rock and cheato, so moving it to the 20g should take only a few minutes.... Am I on track with my steps? What about the sand? Should I expect a cycle?

[Mavrk]

What are you doing about an overflow? You could drill the tank first. Your plan for the sand seems fine.

I would be careful with the coral in with the live rock. Make sure they don't get crushed.

If you sump is bare bottom, then I don't see a reason to wait on the move to the bigger sump.

Place an airstone or a powerhead in with the rock to keep things aerated.

You might get a small cycle because of die off from the rock and from the missing bacteria in the sand. However, I imagine it will be very minor. If you are worried, then use one of the other tanks to hold your fish and add them back slowly.

edit: just wanted to add that you should rinse the new sand out first.
2nd edit: you might consider a mixture of sugar and special grade sand

[justinf67]

I have a gravity fed overflow that drains to the sump. I dont know if my lfs drills tanks, I guess I could call though. Ive never had a problem with the gravity ones, why is it such an advantage?

Thanks for the warning on rinsing the sand, I knew that one though Why would I do a mixture of the 2 sands?

[Mavrk]

Originally Posted by justinf67

I have a gravity fed overflow that drains to the sump. I dont know if my lfs drills tanks, I guess I could call though. Ive never had a problem with the gravity ones, why is it such an advantage?

Thanks for the warning on rinsing the sand, I knew that one though Why would I do a mixture of the 2 sands?

The main advantage of drilling is that you are less likely to create a flood. If you have a quality HOB overflow, then you shouldn't have problems, but drilling is always the first choice. It sounds like you are getting the Petco deal, so that tank can be drilled anywhere (even the bottom is not tempered). You can drill it yourself hole cutter from glass-holes.com. You gain options for your overflow this way. You can do a coast-to-coast, get one of their overflow kits, or you could drill the bottom instead.

What brand of overflow do you have?

The advantage of the two sands is that you get the benefits of the smaller grain (finer grains dissolve easier, have more biotic activity, etc) but the protection of the more coarse sand to keep it from blowing around. I would do a layer of the sugar fine, and then a layer of the special grade on top. But it really is up to you as using just the special grade will be fine. Either way, make sure you use new sand (plus a cup or so of the old stuff) and have nassarius snails to stir it up. They are the best thing ever.

You probably know about the snails just like I figured you knew about rinsing the sand. I just didn't want you to forget a step with all that is going to be happening during the move.

By the way, I am going to be setting up my 40 breeder soon. It will share a sump with my 90g. I am building the stand based on the DIY forum build but using 1x4 instead of 2x4 (with the necessary mathematical changes to their formula). I am debating about the lights because I have two different plans for the tank that have very different lighting needs.

[theatrus]

Originally Posted by Mavrk

The advantage of the two sands is that you get the benefits of the smaller grain (finer grains dissolve easier, have more biotic activity, etc) but the protection of the more coarse sand to keep it from blowing around. I would do a layer of the sugar fine, and then a layer of the special grade on top. But it really is up to you as using just the special grade will be fine.

In my experience, this causes the larger grains to end up at the bottom and the fine stuff blowing into dunes in the tank. Its an interesting look, but doesn't stay mixed long.

[justinf67]

I just typed up a long response, which didnt go through...yuck. Long story short, Petco didnt have any breeders on their truck, got the manager to order me one if I put thr money down on it... Early next week I should have it, which gives me some time to build the stand if I can function well enough, I have a bad sinus infection that wont go away...

[Mavrk]

Originally Posted by theatrus

In my experience, this causes the larger grains to end up at the bottom and the fine stuff blowing into dunes in the tank. Its an interesting look, but doesn't stay mixed long.

I have the opposite experience. The fine stuff ends up at the bottom. Just like shaking a cereal box. All the big pieces end up on top. If you start with the smaller sand on bottom, then it usually works out fine. But if you are running a really high flow tank, then it might not be worth the chance.

[gweston]

40B has great dimensions. I have a 29 gal display with a 125 long in the works. I picked up a 40B the other week at the $40 sale.. just to have. No idea what I'll do with it (yet).

I'd -highly- suggest that you drill for an overflow at least. I am thinking to drill a 1" hole for an overflow on one end, and a 3/4" hole for a return on the other. The hang on overflows, while they work, do risk flooding. I am using one on my 29g right now. I check the overflow tube at least once a day. Sometimes twice. I have two tubes in place. If one loses siphon, the second one has enough draw to keep the tank from overflowing. Honestly.. it is a pain.

But.. the tank was intended to be temporary. I am building a custom drilled overflow for the 125. It'll entail some work as it is a do-it-yourself, but I am willing to spend some time on it.