Heater(s) for RKL

[orion251]

What heater or heaters would be good for use with an RKL? I have a Stealth and a Finnex right now and they are having trouble keeping up with my system. The Stealth is for a 55g tank (200 or 250w?) and the finnex is a 150w. Which heater(s) should I go with for replacements? The tank is a 65g and the sump is a 20g that is about 2/3 full. Lights are T5. I keep my house between 62 and 67F depending on the time of the day (programmable thermostat). Can I get heaters without built in temp controllers? If so, or if not, what do you use and recommend?

Thanks in advance!

[ErikS]

Originally Posted by orion251

What heater or heaters would be good for use with an RKL? I have a Stealth and a Finnex

There are many who've had issues with stealth heaters (myself included) - I'd not use one. I've had luck with Finnex lights but I've not used the heaters, would not trust the controller on the heater. Eheim-jager (formerly Ebo-jager) seems well liked, though they do not recommend full submersion.

Originally Posted by orion251

right now and they are having trouble keeping up with my system. The Stealth is for a 55g tank (200 or 250w?) and the finnex is a 150w.

Given the tank size I would say you have more than enough wattage. I'd wager they're having trouble "keeping up" because of the temp swing. The cheesy controllers in heaters allows for a few degrees of temp swing = they have a tough time recovering. Using a controller the smaller swing should allow them to keep a more constant temp.

Size seems fine to me, I'd run the controller so that "if temp < XYZ (your call) then heat one (larger) on. If temp < XYZ -.5 then heat two on. Should keep the temp inline, less swing.

Originally Posted by orion251

Can I get heaters without built in temp controllers? If so, or if not, what do you use and recommend?

Yes, you can get tube heaters but you can always override (not use) the built in ones, or better use them as a "fail safe".

Setup -

Put the heater in a bucket (sw makeup?), slowly increase the temp adjustment until it's 1 - 2* over your setpoint. For example if you want the tank to be 80* adjust the heater so the temp in the bucket is 81 - 82. Now hook the heater to the controller, the controller will run the heater as needed.....and....in the event the controller fails the heater shouldn't go past it's setpoint.

Using a heater without any controller means if the controller fails the heater will??? (either freeze the tank or boil it depending on the state of the controller when it fails)

[Takitaj]

Get a decent 250w titanium heater without controller (just a cord & plug) and use CH1 or CH4 on your PC4 to control the heater using iTemp. No glass to break, no cheap controllers to stick on and can keep temp within +/- 0.1 deg. Set an alarm on the RKL to sound an alarm, or turn something on or off (what ever, just something to get your attention) and set the temp to like 2 deg lower then the heater set temp. That will give you time to respond in case the heater element fails.

[solitude127]

I use an Eheim jager heater on my RKE and RKL. I like the thought of having a 2nd thermostat as backup. I set my controller to 78 have it turn off at 79. I then have the internal thermostat of the heater set to 80 so just in case the temp probe goes whacky, I won't toast all my live stock. It doesn't protect the other way though.

[ErikS]

Originally Posted by solitude127

I use an Eheim jager heater on my RKE and RKL. I like the thought of having a 2nd thermostat as backup. I set my controller to 78 have it turn off at 79. I then have the internal thermostat of the heater set to 80 so just in case the temp probe goes whacky, I won't toast all my live stock. It doesn't protect the other way though.

Yep, far better than a tube with no controller. RKE temp sensor fails (if there's a weak point in aquarium controllers this seems to be it) and???? Most often they fail low (makes sense as the computer sees "no signal" as the baseline)..........RKE sees the temp as say 72* (whatever it's floor might be) and turns on the heater in a vain attempt to reach the setpoint of 79*. With a failed sensor it will not reach it = one hot tank. If your heater has an internal thermostat it will prevent the overheat.

I don't know the extent of the RKE's programming but in general terms you want to check for out of range temps & operate the heaters accordingly.

1) If temp < 74* then heaters off, you know this is likely to mean the temp sensor has failed & turn off the heaters to avoid an overheat

2) I temp > 88* then heaters on, you can figure if it goes that far out the temp sensor has failed with an "high value". Turn on the heaters & rely on the heaters thermostat to keep it in range.

You can still have issues but by having redundant controls they may not be as catastrophic.

Note - this goes for all controllers, if the input fails the controller fails.

[The Velvet Sea]

I'm using a ViaAqua titanium (which also has a thermostat, and I like having two thermostats) connected to my RKL. It works great!

[Takitaj]

Good point, it certainly can't hurt. But the typical heater failure is with the heater's mechanical thermostat becomming welded together and sticking in the on position. Perhaps that with a second temp sensor, proper alarms and regular sensor replacement is about as failsafe as you can get. Either way I'd go with the titainium ones.

Come to think of it, my temp sensor is like a year old, time to replace it and add the second one to be on the safe side. Cheap insurance policy.

[The Punisher]

Originally Posted by ErikS

Eheim-jager (formerly Ebo-jager) seems well liked, though they do not recommend full submersion.

I just got 2 new Jager heaters and they say they're fully submersible.

[oscar.millan]

Doesn't matter based on the controller, but I like Jager heaters.

[ErikS]

Originally Posted by The Punisher

I just got 2 new Jager heaters and they say they're fully submersible.

I'll take your word on that, I was going off the manual found on Eheim's web site
( http://www.eheim.com/base/eheim/inha...en&list=heizer )

Do not submerge:
Water level must never be over
water level mark 3
on the housing.

Which is a bit annoying - one of mine failed after a lousy decade of use.........I ruled them out as a replacement due to this (even though I ignored this with my old one )

Would seem they need to update their web site.

[The Punisher]

Quote from their website: "•The heater can be fully immersed, is protected against running dry and is suitable for fresh or marine water"

Eheim Jager heater website

I double checked the instructions and they confirmed that they are submersible.

[ErikS]

Originally Posted by The Punisher

I double checked the instructions and they confirmed that they are submersible.

Yep, bastages

I guess we can attribute it to a "Deutsch-lish" translation?

(wouldn't be the first Eheim instruction I've read & thought "WTH"?........okay, let's read that again)

[solitude127]

I think the older ones had the suggestion of not being fully submerse but the newer ones are ok. I still submerged my older ones.

[sslak]

I use a 150w Jager on a 58g/20g sump with my RK2 and it keeps up just fine.

I have a 50w Jager as a backup if the temp drops 0.5 degrees below my first heater's threshold, but it never kicks in.