Skimmer Not Skimming, Photo and Questions

[windyridge]

We bought a protein skimmer yesterday and placed it in a 10g sump. It's an ASM Mini-G. At first the pump didn't work. Husband took it apart, and then it worked. Last night it was quiet, today it's noisier. This skimmer comes with no instructions!! We set it up, and it's making lots of small bubbles as it should. I had it overflow into the cup for a few seconds so that water in there is from that. The tube with the black sponge on it telescopes up and I've tried all different levels. Any photo or videos I have seen show it even lower than where I have it.


2011-05-25_12-14-56_892ASM Mini-G Protein Skimmer by onaridge2000, on Flickr


My questions are:

The bubbles only reach about halfway up in the collection cup, and no skimmate is produced, (see photo) is this normal for a new set up?

The tank is a few months old with no fish in it at the moment, could this be why there are no big dirty bubbles?

What should the sump water level be? I don't understand the relationship to it and the skimmer. Is ours correct?

Can we turn it off from about 11pm to 7am as it is noisy and my son can't sleep? It is in a sump that has a bioball chamber, and we have a HOB and an under gravel filter so there is plenty of filtration and circulation going on. We also plan to house the skimmer in a 15g refugium shortly.

And lastly, has anyone ever attempted to house these things in a sound proof box to cut down on the trickling and humming?

[Crazed]

I have the larger model of this skimmer and yes, they are horribly noisy! A lot of it comes from the airline. You can cut a hole in a pill bottle and shove some cotton in there and then put it on the end of the airhose. That helps a lot with the sucking sound.

I would not recommend turning it off at night. There are some things you can do however. If you move the sponge on the pipe up some more, the water won't trickle as much.

The skimmate coming out of there is very weak, yes, but you're exactly right: your tank is new with no fish in it. You won't be pulling out really horrible crap yet. Also, if you just got the skimmer running yesterday, you need to give it a few more days to break in yet. There are manufacturing oils and other stuff on the inside that impedes proper skimming. It'll take a few days for that to clear up. It might even run quieter too.

So, long story short, don't worry about it right now. You're not going to get really dark skimmate until you get a bigger bioload.

If the pump causes you any more problems, I would return it and get a new one.

Water depth should be 6 to 8 inches. Judging from the picture you posted, the level probably should be higher.

Hope that helps.

[zeeter]

If there's nothing to produce waste then there's nothing to skim, so I'd say based on what you're saying it's probably ok.

The bubbles in the skimmer will reach as high as you have your venturi adjusted.Yours looks ok. And the water in the collection cup isn't exactly clear so you're getting some skimmage from the inverts that you have. Do you have live rock? I didn't notice that on your profile but might have just missed it.

The sump water level should be high enough to at least account for your daily evaporation and low enough so that if you lose power the display tank won't overflow your sump. If your pump jets are below the waterline then they will suck the water down into the sump if the pump goes off. I keep mine about half way submerged so that they add a bit of surface agitation. The sump water level really has no relation to the skimmer, other than the obvious of being deep enough for the skimmer pump.

It's probably ok to turn it off at night.

You have a bio-ball chamber. Is this a reef tank? If so then I would highly recommend that you ditch the bio-balls in favor of live rock. Bio-balls become nitrate factories. Not the end of the world for fish-only but deadly for reefs.

As for sound, I think most people keep the sump underneath the tank with the doors closed so it's just a bit of white noise. That said, a skimmer really doesn't make a lot of noise.

Edit: after reading Crazed's post I guess this brand is loud. What makes it louder than others?

[Crazed]

The water coming out of the pipe has a tendency to splash noisily everywhere, and I don't quite understand why. It usually starts out quietly, but if you touch it the wrong way or the Earth shifts on its axis a bit, it starts putting out a wider cone of water. Additionally, as I mentioned, the airline makes a gargling sound.

[disc1]

I would recommend getting away from the Under Gravel Filter too. Those things aren't too good for a reef tank.

[zeeter]

Originally Posted by disc1

I would recommend getting away from the Under Gravel Filter too. Those things aren't too good for a reef tank.

+1 Didn't even notice that. There's no need for any other filtration than the skimmer and the bio-filtration (bioballs or live rock). Personally I run my overflow through some plastic containers before the sump that have filterfloss and carbon, but that's just me.

Under gravel filters used to be all the rage in SW tanks. Not sure why.

[sjwitt]

Under Gravel Filters were all they had ... was cutting edge at the time but now protein skimmers are. Agree with others, remove bio balls and under gravel filter. Let the skimmer 'break in' and it'll start working better.

[windyridge]

Crazed, how big should the hole in the pill bottle be? Can you be a little more descriptive of the set up please? Won't the cotton block the opening? I covered the whole for a sec with my finger and it certainly makes it a lot quieter (and raised the level too of course). I am very excited about this option to make the pump noise quieter. I got the splashing sound down by adjusting the sponge. I wonder if I bought another sponge ($5 on Ebay), cut it in half to fit what's left exposed of the pipe and made the entire pipe covered in sponge if that would quiet the trickling further, and then also raise the sump water level a little more to 8 inches. Does this sponge have any use other than to allow a quieter trickle of water down the tube?

Disc1, Why is an undergravel bad? It's what we had at the time, I guess we can always turn it off?

Zeeter it's a reef tank and they are the really old bioballs when they weren't called bioballs. They are plastic balls that are about 18 years old, should we just remove them? We have about 25 pounds of live rock in the tank. My sump water depth is 7 3/4 inches.

So there is a difference in opinion of shutting it off at night. What are the pros and cons of shutting it off exactly?

Thanks for all the help, it really helps to get your guidance.

[windyridge]

Ok when I was writing my reply some of you were writing too. It's not feasible to remove the undergravel filter, we'd have to take the whole tank apart. Can we just turn it off?

[zeeter]

I'm not too familiar with undergravel filters. If it contains any media at all then you cannot turn it off. Like any filter, if you leave filter media without flow it will build up toxins. Again,though, I'm not too familiar with undergravel so this may not be an issue.

If you have live rock then I would ditch the bioballs. However, if they are 18 years old and have been used for 18 years then you might not want to just get rid of them. Maybe find another use for them. It's hard to find 18 years worth of good biological filtration bacteria. Maybe use them for a quarantine tank. I saw where one guy took the media out of a marineland penguin powerfilter and put bioballs in there. That's kind of a novel idea.

If you remove the bio balls make sure you have plenty of flow over the live rock as without flow it's just rock.

[windyridge]

Zeeter the bioballs themselves are old but they only just got put into the tank. They had been clean and unused all that time. There is no media per se except for the gravel itself. So I guess it's redundant with all the other filtration going on, I just want to be sure that turning off the pump won't cause a problem I haven't foreseen.

[zeeter]

You can probably just turn it off, then. If you have gravel get a couple of tiger conchs to sift it. Nassy snails can't sift gravel but tigers can. This way you won't have to vacuum it so often.

[windyridge]

We have one snail that does go under the gravel, all you see is his antenna sticking up and every once in awhile he comes out. Not sure what it's called. Our LFS told us to take out the under gravel filter as a few others here did but the idea of taking down the tank is daunting. If we add a few of these conchs you mention, surly that turnover will stop any collection of noxious chemicals however what I read about them says they need sand to do well. So far we've had a nary a reading for ammonia or nitrates and at one point we did have fish in there too.

[disc1]

No need to take it out, just turn it off. Pulling all that water through the detritus in the gravel and then pumping it back into the tank can cause nitrate problems. Other problems too.

[rocking]

you need to remove Under gravel filters !
there not good in a reef tank at all

[windyridge]

Please expound on why Ug filters are not good for reef tanks. So far I have never had any nitrates, or ammonia in the tank. We have plenty of oxygenation and filtration going on so I guess I am looking for more info on this. We have definitely decided we are not going to break down the tank when all parameters are stable. The questions is do we just turn it off or leave it going?

The skimmer works great now BTW, the cup is full of slimy gunk. We are setting up a refugium this weekend. The only thing I do not like about the skimmer is the pump is really loud.

[jinks]

To silence the pump take a piece of pvc 1/2 or 3/4 should work. Cut it to maybe 3-4 inches. take 2 end caps and drill a hole in the center of each just big enough for the air hose to fit in. put the end caps on the piece of pvc. Put the tube from the pump in till its about 1 inch from the other side. now take another pieces of airline hose and push it in the other hole till its an inch from the other side. you can glue them in to keep them in place but the pvc should be okay without glue. its a crude drawing but should give you an idea.

I would just turn the under gravel off. The worry would be that something could build up in your gravel and then when disturbed be sucked up into the filter and pumped into your tank. Its like how they tell you not to mess with a sand bed because you'll release whats trapped in it. Its the same thing only this has suction working with it. On top of that its not needed with the rock so why risk it.

[windyridge]

A pump muffler! Will try this tomorrow. I appreciate the drawing. And thanks for the advice on the UGF. I will turn it off.