QT new arrivals, DT Fallow, Mandarin ICK

[staplesofficewr]

Hey All,

My tank is a 46 Bow front about 18 months old, Lots of Live Rock and Crushed Coral. I have had a solo fish for a while, an ocellaris clown. My plan was to QT him when I got back from Florida Vacation, and treat him with copper for ICK. I KNOW I have ICK in the tank, but I have not seen any sign of it for almost 9 months.

I know the life cycle of ick well, I have done my homework. I have no issues with treating the clown with copper...

Jump ahead to Saturday 8-13-11. Captnick86 is selling his reef off in Augusta, Ga. I purchased most of his coral and all of his fish:

2 Frogspawn Colonies
1 red Montipora approx
1 red/purp zoa colony approx
1 Green Star Polyp colony approx
2 green mushroom colonies
1 small digitata

1 Sailfin Tang approx 3.5"
1 OcellarisClownfish approx 2.5"
1 Mandarin Goby approx 2"
1 Coral Beauty Angelfish approx 2.5"
4 Blue/Green Chromis

Everything has been in QT with the live rock that the coral is attached to. They are in a 15 tall that is setup to overflow into a 10 and then the water is pumped back into the 15. There is an emperor filter (single) on the 15. I am testing ammonia and nitrite twice/day and have not detected anything. Essentially I have 25 gallons of QT.

Last night I move about half the coral into my display thank. I have 3 zoa rocks left in the QT tank that I will move 1/day.

Once all the coral is added, I will have only fish in the QT tank. The filter pad for the power filter was in my sump for 3 days before setting up the QT tank. I also used mostly water from captnick86's tank. Day 1 for the tank being fallow will be reset due to the coral additions. Day 1 will be August 18th.

Now to the fish. I lost one chromis - he was showing a lot of stress from the move. All the other fish greedily take food I offer. At about 4 weeks of fallow and allowing the fish to get big and fat (and as long as ICK doesn't show it's face) I will begin cupramine on all the fish except for the Mandarin.

Is Cupramine OK for the clowns, Chromis, Coral Beauty and Sailfin Tang?

I know the Mandarin is sensitive to Copper. I will be moving him to a 10 gallon solo with a JBJ EFU-25 Reaction 4-Stage Canister Filter & UV Sterilizer.

Will the UV help?

I have fed the Mandarin tigerpods so far and will work on training him for prepared foods starting this weekend. Once I am confidant that the Mandarin will take prepared foods and that he is fat, I will being Hyposalinity for him. I will target feed him with frozen prepared foods, cytoplease(sp?), and some pods from LiveAquaria.

So....How does this all sound? Does this sound like the least stressfully method to abolish ICK in my tank?
Please don't tell me to increase my tank temp or that I cannot get rid of ick ever. Mandarins can get ick.

Any thoughts / suggestions / wishes?

[mess7777]

get rid of the sailfin while you can. It will want more space than a 46g can provide. Once they are in the it becomes much more difficult to get them out.

Of course, if you want to keep it that is your perogative too.

If you want to be ich free you need 8 weeks with no fish in the DT and at least 4 weeks from the last sign of ich on your fish.

[staplesofficewr]

Yea, I wasn't going too, but it was a package deal. I have another tank coming down the road...maybe 9 months.

What do you think about the mandarin? No copper? How do they do on Hypo?

Thanks!

[Reefing Newbie]

So just to be sure I read this right, you have not had ick in your DT or signs of it for 9 months? If so then the DT should be clear of ich. Now to my second question, do any of the fish you recently got that are in QT have signs of ick? If not, do not treat for it. I have been told that copper treatment or others for ick when ich is not present can be stressful on the fish. I advise not to treat for a disease unless you have it. Not an expert on mandarins, but people do not usually QT them. They have a thick slime coat so them getting ick is not highly probable. Just my 2 cents

[staplesofficewr]

Originally Posted by Reefing Newbie

So just to be sure I read this right, you have not had ick in your DT or signs of it for 9 months? If so then the DT should be clear of ich.

My understanding of ICK is that unless the tank goes fallow, then it is always present...the fish just aren't showing signs. The lone clown that was in there was completing the Ick cycle.

None of the fish are exhibiting any signs of ick, but they are also all quite healthy, maybe a bit stressed from the cramped living conditions.

I am tempted to move them into the DT one at a time....but I have to be careful...murphy is my neighbor and he visits often.

[Reefing Newbie]

Yeah it is always present until the tank is fallow for 8 weeks, my bad on that. I forgot about the clown. After the 8 weeks you should be able to start adding the fish one or two at a time, I would go with one unless it is a pair like a pair of clowns to prevent a sex change on the male. Just do not treat for ick unless you have ick is what I was trying to get across. Also the point that as soon as your tank has been fallow for 8 weeks, you should add you mandarin. That is unless your 46 is new, then it would be easier to feed in QT

[Curious George]

I don't believe that you have ich or assume that there is ich in the tank even though it hasn't been fallow for 9 months. If a fish isn't showing signs, then there isn't much reason to believe it has ich after that period of time. It would be like a Dr. giving me an Rx for strep throat even though I didn't have a sore throat.

You have your hands full with your new purchases. Had I been in your situation, I would have passed on the deal because of the size of your tank. The mandarin is more destined to die of starvation rather than disease and the sailfin has to go for it's own well-being.

[Reefing Newbie]

I would have passed as well, I will never buy a packaged deal again. Despite being cheaper to get a complete setup as I did(sig), it does not work very well. I did not want the fish that came with it now I can't catch them! But we live and we learn!

[staplesofficewr]

Hello,
Thanks for all the concern -

I understand the risks of the mandarin and sailfin, however, I am looking for information on treating / preventing ick on the Mandarin. I am not worried about him starving as I am taking steps to prevent that.

How do Mandarins do with copper?

[Palting]

Mandarins as a general rule do not do well in QT. They eat live pods. Copper and hyposalinity treatment kill all invertebrates, including Ich, including pods. I had one in hyposalinity for 4 weeks and got lucky. He survived, but barely. He looked like a tadpole after the 6 weeks (two added weeks to bring the SG down and then up), with a big head and thin body.

The good news is, Mandarins are exceptionally resistant to Ich due to their slime coat. They usually do not need QT for Ich.

EDIT: I see that you are training your mandarin, and spot feeding him. If you succeed, and you still want to QT and treat him, I would do hyposalinity. I know they can tolerate it, since I did it.

[staplesofficewr]

Originally Posted by Palting

I see that you are training your mandarin, and spot feeding him. If you succeed, and you still want to QT and treat him, I would do hyposalinity. I know they can tolerate it, since I did it.

As you can imagine, the Qt is a little low on live food. I asked my wife to try Cyclopeez.... He swam around the bottom eating it up .
What's the best food to try to get him on to get fat and happy before hypo?
Thanks!

[Palting]

My mandarins never took to prepared foods. I did have a lot of pods from seeding both tank and refugium before treatment, and the mandarin was pecking non-stop. You're lucky yours takes cyclopeeze.