OK, THE BIG 4, pluses and minuses, let's list them.

[SteveValle]

Originally Posted by pmrossetti

the panorama? yes, nice. and they've thought thru the mounting, yea

but pricey and no programmability

Who says we have to be able to program our LED's? I actually believe that Ecoxotic make very affordable units.

[mooch1982]

I would consider Pacific sun as well:

http://www.progressivereef.com/pacificsun.php

[pmrossetti]

Originally Posted by SteveValle

Who says we have to be able to program our LED's? I actually believe that Ecoxotic make very affordable units.

no one says we have to. i think its great to have all those options fun, remember that? for 7-800 a fixture it should have it. i love the sunrise/sunset, brightness and color customizing, moon cycle, love it.

if the fixture was 3-400 fine just plain light will do.

[gcarroll]

Originally Posted by mooch1982

I would consider Pacific sun as well:

http://www.progressivereef.com/pacificsun.php

Pacific Sun
pluses---?
minuses---?

We certainly are not going to read anything bad on a site that sells or makes the fixture.

[pmrossetti]

Originally Posted by mooch1982

I would consider Pacific sun as well:

http://www.progressivereef.com/pacificsun.php

great light but not much talk here about it.

[rtparty]

Originally Posted by pmrossetti

the panorama? yes, nice. and they've thought thru the mounting, yea

but pricey and no programmability

No programability, yet.

I think the prices are actually pretty good for what you get. With some stunner strips you don't need to dim lights to get a sunrise and sunset effect.

[rtparty]

Originally Posted by gcarroll

Pacific Sun
pluses---?
minuses---?

We certainly are not going to read anything bad on a site that sells or makes the fixture.

I don't know enough to really comment on them but I know enough that I would never buy anything from Pacific Sun.

They have outright lies all over their marketing material. For example, using ATI reflectors on their T5s. I asked ATI about that and Oliver assured me that Pacific Sun was not using their reflectors.

If they lie about that, what else will they lie about?

[pmrossetti]

Originally Posted by rtparty

No programability, yet.

I think the prices are actually pretty good for what you get. With some stunner strips you don't need to dim lights to get a sunrise and sunset effect.

Ryan,

how can you say that, man. 800dollars. its just 6 strips of 12 leds each. thats it man. 800? RADION is less even.

[rtparty]

Originally Posted by pmrossetti

Ryan,

how can you say that, man. 800dollars. its just 6 strips of 12 leds each. thats it man. 800? RADION is less even.

What fixture are you looking at????

The new Panorama PRO fixtures are $399 for the 18" model and $499 for the 24" model.

The 18" fixture has 3 modules included in price and the 24" has 5 of them.

[Luwe2008]

has anyone seen the Vertex with the Red LED add ons?

[pmrossetti]

Originally Posted by rtparty

What fixture are you looking at????

The new Panorama PRO fixtures are $399 for the 18" model and $499 for the 24" model.

The 18" fixture has 3 modules included in price and the 24" has 5 of them.

http://www.marinedepot.com/Ecoxotic_...FILDLK-vi.html

http://www.ecoxotic.com/catalog/prod...s/category/17/

where are the new ones?
are they as strong?

[rtparty]

Originally Posted by pmrossetti

http://www.marinedepot.com/Ecoxotic_...FILDLK-vi.html

http://www.ecoxotic.com/catalog/prod...s/category/17/

where are the new ones?
are they as strong?

That is the original Panorama fixture that they have discontinued. There are still some for sale out there but Ecoxotic isn't making them.

The new fixture was seen at MACNA and was over on that Reef Building site. Can't post a link because RC and RB have a tiff for some unknown reason.

The new modules are up on Ecoxotic's website.

http://www.ecoxotic.com/panorama-pro-module.html

The first modules were 12 watts a piece and the new ones are 19 watts each. They use CREE or Edison LEDs in their systems. They are plenty powerful for corals.

[Bellagio]

Pacific Sun
pluses--- looks, programming(PC/Andorid/GHL), color,avalaible with lenses or without(Cree LED chips), full programmability including sunrise/sunset, mooncycle, PAR, full spectrum (Hyperion lamp), 16"-34"-50"-66" fixtures(also combo - with T5) ,tank mount, EU company?
minuses--- not US support, only two colours housing(black/white), some fixtures are very expensive(like Pandora), reported few problems in USA(with USA power supply?), actually not avalaible, not upgradable single leds, heavy(but waterproof) power supplys...

About ATI reflectors - I have read about that on German forum - and there was an information that they are buying ATI reflectors(not from ATI directly) - and using in their Pandora lamps.. I cant find there any lie/mistake... Im not sure that ATI know everything - where and who is buying their reflectors... A specially - if it is bought from their reseller - not from their facilities directly..

They are selling many units in EU - And are the only - on their website shows the true spectrum light of their lamps - for different settings ..

So personally I would prefer to be cautious in formulating this type of accusation ..

[rtparty]

Originally Posted by Bellagio

Pacific Sun
pluses--- looks, programming(PC/Andorid/GHL), color,avalaible with lenses or without(Cree LED chips), full programmability including sunrise/sunset, mooncycle, PAR, full spectrum (Hyperion lamp), 16"-34"-50"-66" fixtures(also combo - with T5) ,tank mount, EU company?
minuses--- not US support, only two colours housing(black/white), some fixtures are very expensive(like Pandora), reported few problems in USA(with USA power supply?), actually not avalaible, not upgradable single leds, heavy(but waterproof) power supplys...

About ATI reflectors - I have read about that on German forum - and there was an information that they are buying ATI reflectors(not from ATI directly) - and using in their Pandora lamps.. I cant find there any lie/mistake... Im not sure that ATI know everything - where and who is buying their reflectors... A specially - if it is bought from their reseller - not from their facilities directly..

They are selling many units in EU - And are the only - on their website shows the true spectrum light of their lamps - for different settings ..

So personally I would prefer to be cautious in formulating this type of accusation ..

If it is that simple to get ATI reflectors then why aren't ALL companies getting them from ATI's supplier???

Numbers prove that ATI are the best. Why would any other company put R&D into reflectors if they could just get the best?

I just don't buy it. I have seen WAY too many negative things about Pacific Sun to give them any type of credit.

[Bellagio]

Its simple.
Because when you have R&D team concentrating on LED technology - why trying to open - opened door - and trying to find "much better" reflectors - if this one is good - or very good? This is your strongest point in this discussion?
If they will use their own developed reflectors - you will write that is a crap - and ATI have much better?
Its without sense.
But as I see - my information arent actual - I got information from German reseller that they come in to metal halide/T5 fixture market - with full inteligent controlling also(metal halide and t5 fully dimmed) - so Im sure that their R&D will be able to project reflectors for T5 also..
I understand that you can have your own experiences(its your - or your friend friends?) - but calling someone a liar (and set the public lies in the materials) - is in my honest opinion - abuse..
By the way - you can point to where they publicly lied?
Thank you - and for me it's the end of the topic about the PS.
They shoudnt be a main topic in this thread.

[wayne in norway]

Ryan - have you seen anywhere that Ecoxotic are goign to release a new fixture as the Pro only seems to be a retrofit strip

[rodneyri]

another plus for the vertex is you can add additional color pads (when they come out) to change the spectrum..like mazzar and radion.

and hopefully as LEDs advance we can swap out the existing pads with the newer tech

as my light is hung from wires above the tank the fact its a single pendant was important visually in my house, others are modules which look ugly

[pmrossetti]

Originally Posted by rtparty

That is the original Panorama fixture that they have discontinued. There are still some for sale out there but Ecoxotic isn't making them.

The new fixture was seen at MACNA and was over on that Reef Building site. Can't post a link because RC and RB have a tiff for some unknown reason.

The new modules are up on Ecoxotic's website.

http://www.ecoxotic.com/panorama-pro-module.html

The first modules were 12 watts a piece and the new ones are 19 watts each. They use CREE or Edison LEDs in their systems. They are plenty powerful for corals.

thanks rt, but it was 800 smackers, right? i like the fixture, but don't you think that's out of line for no features?

[rtparty]

Originally Posted by wayne in norway

Ryan - have you seen anywhere that Ecoxotic are goign to release a new fixture as the Pro only seems to be a retrofit strip

Go to http://www.reef_builders.com/2011/09...ture-ecoxotic/


Remove the underscore/space though between reef and builders.

[rtparty]

Originally Posted by Bellagio

Its simple.
Because when you have R&D team concentrating on LED technology - why trying to open - opened door - and trying to find "much better" reflectors - if this one is good - or very good? This is your strongest point in this discussion?
If they will use their own developed reflectors - you will write that is a crap - and ATI have much better?
Its without sense.
But as I see - my information arent actual - I got information from German reseller that they come in to metal halide/T5 fixture market - with full inteligent controlling also(metal halide and t5 fully dimmed) - so Im sure that their R&D will be able to project reflectors for T5 also..
I understand that you can have your own experiences(its your - or your friend friends?) - but calling someone a liar (and set the public lies in the materials) - is in my honest opinion - abuse..
By the way - you can point to where they publicly lied?
Thank you - and for me it's the end of the topic about the PS.
They shoudnt be a main topic in this thread.

Quick answer and we can be done.

Over on a site called R e e f Builders they posted up pictures of a new unit. They claimed right in the Pacific Sun marketing material they were using ATI reflectors for their T5's. The piece of junk reflector they had pictured was not an ATI reflector. I know that for a fact. I called them out on it and then they retracted their marketing material. They told me that they WOULD be using ATI reflectors but the reflector pictured was NOT an ATI. Why lie?

I was then contacted by a large supplier that used to carry Pacific Sun equipment. They will remain nameless. They sent me email after email with pictures of how bad Pacific Sun stuff was put together and all the lies they were fed straight from PS.

So if Pacific Sun has stepped up their game, good for them. I wouldn't ever use anything of their equipment. Especially when they are outside the USA and customer service can be non-existent at times.

Good day Bellagio!

[rtparty]

Originally Posted by pmrossetti

thanks rt, but it was 800 smackers, right? i like the fixture, but don't you think that's out of line for no features?

The original Panorama fixture was, yes. That was also two years ago when "features" weren't even readily available. I remember some companies having basic control options but LED technology was still VERY young and VERY limited for our hobby.

Hence why I never bought their original stuff or any LEDs for that matter.

[pmrossetti]

thanks for the info, rt

[pmrossetti]

thanks for the info, rt

[Bellagio]

Originally Posted by rtparty

Quick answer and we can be done.

Over on a site called R e e f Builders they posted up pictures of a new unit. They claimed right in the Pacific Sun marketing material they were using ATI reflectors for their T5's. The piece of junk reflector they had pictured was not an ATI reflector. I know that for a fact. I called them out on it and then they retracted their marketing material. They told me that they WOULD be using ATI reflectors but the reflector pictured was NOT an ATI. Why lie?

I was then contacted by a large supplier that used to carry Pacific Sun equipment. They will remain nameless. They sent me email after email with pictures of how bad Pacific Sun stuff was put together and all the lies they were fed straight from PS.

So if Pacific Sun has stepped up their game, good for them. I wouldn't ever use anything of their equipment. Especially when they are outside the USA and customer service can be non-existent at times.

Good day Bellagio!

I found that - and I saw all coments under this thread... And as I read - on this RB news was information that this lamp WILL use ATI reflectors when it will be released(on pictures was prototype?) And - this is anouncement made by RB - not PS, isnt true?

About this reseller - I regret that it did not give his name - if everything is true what you wrote.
Especially - when is it true you only known from one side of interest ..
You always rate the people / items without seeing them in person and not knowing the issues that concern - by doing this publicly?
I'm not going to defend anybody - but if indeed it were true what you write - that why there are positive feedback from users of their products - as well as reviews on their aftersale service - also in the U.S.?
Perhaps these people have been paid - and then "tricked" ..
Just use uncle google ...

EOT
Make love - not war.