lighting questions

Janh · 09/17/2011, 11:15 PM

I am going to be shopping around for lighting for a 55 gallon tank and was hoping someone could explain leds to me. Are these a supplement to regular lighting or the only lighting used? For example I was looking at this one. http://www.jlaquatics.com/product/ld...0+Inch%29.html
It says its good for 50 000 hours, what happens after that, is it garbage? I find the different types of lighting very confusing any input would be appreciated.

havnmonkey · 09/17/2011, 11:32 PM

I'm new to the aquarium world... but a bit experienced in the diy LED flashlight world.

I believe most would either use standard lighting or LED. Maybe an low powered LED moonlight would be used with the regular bulbs.

For LED's you can buy a premade fixture, however I'd say that most are under driven -or under powered - and fairly expensive for the kind of light they put out.

Building your own LED fixture is more straightforward, imo, than a DIY flashlight. My plan is a 12 LED (Cree xp-g R5 and xp-e royal blues) that's priced out at about $150. LED's are strung together on a heat sink (usually aluminum) like christmas lights and then connected to a current driver (usually running between 700-1500ma) that then connects to the power source. The LEDs should be kept cool via ventilation. They can easily be set up on a dimming switch.

Are you comfortable building a DIY fixture? If so, I believe it is the cheaper option... If not, I believe the traditional fixtures have the edge on most of the market LED options.

Janh · 09/17/2011, 11:40 PM

I am not comfortable with anything I do myself, and I would be flat out terrified if I had to plug it in. For me premade is a much better option.

So are you saying led is not the way to go for a reef tank, if buying premade?

WetShepherd · 09/18/2011, 12:59 AM

I'm still fairly new to the aquarium lighting world, but I can at least give you a basic idea, and if I'm wrong about anything, someone will be along shortly to tear me apart

You obviously start with different lighting needs depending on what you have in your tank. Almost anything works for fish, you need stronger for basic corals, and you need 'very' strong for tougher corals, anemones etc.

Where do LEDs fit in? I think we're trying to fit them in everywhere. Standard fluorescents are suitable for just fish. You can purchase the equivalent in LEDs fairly cheaply - for example, the fixture you linked would cost in the 120.00 range (non-reef version called bright and double-bright). The next step up in 'traditional' lighting would be the T5 high output / wattage lights. Suitable for easier corals like LPS, but generally still not bright enough for most SPS. A fixture for my 4' tank cost 300.00 vs about 50.00 for standard lights. I believe the fixture you linked at 450.00 (520.00 at my LFS) would be the LED equivalent. Then I think you have metal halides which are the brightest and what people use for the tough corals etc.

What I remain unclear on is if these 'reef' LED systems are closer to the T5HOs, or the metal halides.

Re:50,000 hours, that's over 10 years of use for most of us compared to the year or two we get out of the other bulbs (you don't wait for them to die - they start to dim or spectrum shift so you try to catch them before your corals suffer). It's a cost recovery and quality of life issue.

I briefly considered that Marineland fixture, but it looks like it sits pretty low and doesn't offer much in the way of options for suspension. On the other hand I love the way LEDs look in the water - it's different. Maybe in a year or two

Ron Reefman · 09/18/2011, 06:19 AM

WetShepherd, you have hit it pretty much right on the head!

Janh, what do you plan to keep in your tank? What WetShepherd said is pretty accurate, but there are always exceptions. I know tanks that grow very good sps corals with t5's. But MH's do make it easier (although hotter).

As to led. The good ones are quite expensive to buy (cheaper to run) and they work well. The cheaper ones are just that, cheap. To answer your question first, leds last a long time, but we just don't have enough experience with them yet. At some point leds will start to burn out and you have to decide if you want to try and replace them or when enough have gone out, replace the whole thing. And by then (10-15 years at 50,000hr/10hrs a day) something new will be 'all the rage' (plasma). I have an led fixture that was given away at a MCNA convention last year and it was their brand new, best led light. It sits over my frag tank, very close to the water and the corals are on a rack just under the water. It will keep my sps frags alive, but they do NOT grow and they all lose their color. Zoos and lps do better, but remember the light is right on the coral. I'd never buy one and don't trust the manufacturer now that I've used theirs. On the other hand, I have a friend who just switched from 3ea, 250w MH to an expensive led system ($2200). We tested it with my PAR meter and it could put out about 15% higher PAR than the MH and the leds can be 'tuned' because there are white and blue leds and each can be dimmed seperately. Very cool, but very expensive. My take on leds is, the best ones are good enough now, but VERY expensive, and I think prices will come down a lot in time. For now I use MH and I'm very happy, but someday, a few years from now, I'll probably end up with leds.

Janh · 09/18/2011, 10:27 AM

So if I understand correctly then, the lights I linked to are a basic led, probably equivalent to a bottom of the line t5. Is this correct?

I am still pretty new to the hobby. I will be doing a reef, with beginner soft corals for now and down the road who knows. I am tearing down my 36 gallon and putting it all into the 55 gallon, so I will need new lighting for this. On the 36 I have PC lighting, which works well for what I have in my tank now, however there is not a lot in there. A few mushrooms, zoas, either a kenya or colt coral, and a hammer coral. My understanding is that sps are very difficult and best left to those with experience so they will be way down the road for me, but I may venture into lps.

I want to buy a lighting fixture that will allow me a few different options without having to replace it in 6 months. I was also looking at this light. http://www.marinedepot.com/48_inch_C...U01081-vi.html

Of the two links I provided which would be the better lighting system?

09/17/2011, 11:15 PM	#1
Janh Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: BC Posts: 109	lighting questions I am going to be shopping around for lighting for a 55 gallon tank and was hoping someone could explain leds to me. Are these a supplement to regular lighting or the only lighting used? For example I was looking at this one. http://www.jlaquatics.com/product/ld...0+Inch%29.html It says its good for 50 000 hours, what happens after that, is it garbage? I find the different types of lighting very confusing any input would be appreciated.

09/18/2011, 12:59 AM	#4
WetShepherd Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Ottawa, Canada Posts: 522 Blog Entries: 5	I'm still fairly new to the aquarium lighting world, but I can at least give you a basic idea, and if I'm wrong about anything, someone will be along shortly to tear me apart You obviously start with different lighting needs depending on what you have in your tank. Almost anything works for fish, you need stronger for basic corals, and you need 'very' strong for tougher corals, anemones etc. Where do LEDs fit in? I think we're trying to fit them in everywhere. Standard fluorescents are suitable for just fish. You can purchase the equivalent in LEDs fairly cheaply - for example, the fixture you linked would cost in the 120.00 range (non-reef version called bright and double-bright). The next step up in 'traditional' lighting would be the T5 high output / wattage lights. Suitable for easier corals like LPS, but generally still not bright enough for most SPS. A fixture for my 4' tank cost 300.00 vs about 50.00 for standard lights. I believe the fixture you linked at 450.00 (520.00 at my LFS) would be the LED equivalent. Then I think you have metal halides which are the brightest and what people use for the tough corals etc. What I remain unclear on is if these 'reef' LED systems are closer to the T5HOs, or the metal halides. Re:50,000 hours, that's over 10 years of use for most of us compared to the year or two we get out of the other bulbs (you don't wait for them to die - they start to dim or spectrum shift so you try to catch them before your corals suffer). It's a cost recovery and quality of life issue. I briefly considered that Marineland fixture, but it looks like it sits pretty low and doesn't offer much in the way of options for suspension. On the other hand I love the way LEDs look in the water - it's different. Maybe in a year or two __________________ (see blog for pics) 55g Tank (48" x 13" x 21") /c 60lbs LR & 60lbs Sand 2 MP10w 1 Koralia 425 PH, 3 Reef Brite LED Bars, 15g Sump Tunze DOC Skimmer 9002 and 2 150w Eheim Jager Heater @ 78.5 degrees Last edited by WetShepherd; 09/18/2011 at 01:10 AM.

09/18/2011, 06:19 AM	#5
Ron Reefman Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Cape Coral, FL Posts: 10,431	WetShepherd, you have hit it pretty much right on the head! Janh, what do you plan to keep in your tank? What WetShepherd said is pretty accurate, but there are always exceptions. I know tanks that grow very good sps corals with t5's. But MH's do make it easier (although hotter). As to led. The good ones are quite expensive to buy (cheaper to run) and they work well. The cheaper ones are just that, cheap. To answer your question first, leds last a long time, but we just don't have enough experience with them yet. At some point leds will start to burn out and you have to decide if you want to try and replace them or when enough have gone out, replace the whole thing. And by then (10-15 years at 50,000hr/10hrs a day) something new will be 'all the rage' (plasma). I have an led fixture that was given away at a MCNA convention last year and it was their brand new, best led light. It sits over my frag tank, very close to the water and the corals are on a rack just under the water. It will keep my sps frags alive, but they do NOT grow and they all lose their color. Zoos and lps do better, but remember the light is right on the coral. I'd never buy one and don't trust the manufacturer now that I've used theirs. On the other hand, I have a friend who just switched from 3ea, 250w MH to an expensive led system ($2200). We tested it with my PAR meter and it could put out about 15% higher PAR than the MH and the leds can be 'tuned' because there are white and blue leds and each can be dimmed seperately. Very cool, but very expensive. My take on leds is, the best ones are good enough now, but VERY expensive, and I think prices will come down a lot in time. For now I use MH and I'm very happy, but someday, a few years from now, I'll probably end up with leds. __________________ The good thing about science is that it's true whether or not you believe in it. (Neil deGrasse Tyson) Visit my build thread http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2593017

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09/17/2011, 11:32 PM	#2
havnmonkey Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2011 Posts: 49	I'm new to the aquarium world... but a bit experienced in the diy LED flashlight world. I believe most would either use standard lighting or LED. Maybe an low powered LED moonlight would be used with the regular bulbs. For LED's you can buy a premade fixture, however I'd say that most are under driven -or under powered - and fairly expensive for the kind of light they put out. Building your own LED fixture is more straightforward, imo, than a DIY flashlight. My plan is a 12 LED (Cree xp-g R5 and xp-e royal blues) that's priced out at about $150. LED's are strung together on a heat sink (usually aluminum) like christmas lights and then connected to a current driver (usually running between 700-1500ma) that then connects to the power source. The LEDs should be kept cool via ventilation. They can easily be set up on a dimming switch. Are you comfortable building a DIY fixture? If so, I believe it is the cheaper option... If not, I believe the traditional fixtures have the edge on most of the market LED options.

09/17/2011, 11:40 PM	#3
Janh Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: BC Posts: 109	I am not comfortable with anything I do myself, and I would be flat out terrified if I had to plug it in. For me premade is a much better option. So are you saying led is not the way to go for a reef tank, if buying premade?

09/18/2011, 10:27 AM	#6
Janh Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: BC Posts: 109	So if I understand correctly then, the lights I linked to are a basic led, probably equivalent to a bottom of the line t5. Is this correct? I am still pretty new to the hobby. I will be doing a reef, with beginner soft corals for now and down the road who knows. I am tearing down my 36 gallon and putting it all into the 55 gallon, so I will need new lighting for this. On the 36 I have PC lighting, which works well for what I have in my tank now, however there is not a lot in there. A few mushrooms, zoas, either a kenya or colt coral, and a hammer coral. My understanding is that sps are very difficult and best left to those with experience so they will be way down the road for me, but I may venture into lps. I want to buy a lighting fixture that will allow me a few different options without having to replace it in 6 months. I was also looking at this light. http://www.marinedepot.com/48_inch_C...U01081-vi.html Of the two links I provided which would be the better lighting system?