Requesting Advice on Filtering Project.

Misteor · 12/07/2011, 02:01 PM

Hello there reef central! First post here, or any fish forum for that matter, but i have been to this site seeking information and random tidbits of interesting facts in my spare time. But today i decided that i need the help of some people who can give me advice on an "All In One Filtering System"

The System is quiet simple, take the various forms of filtration and run them through one in closed system. Here i am thinking of making the system out of 1" or possibly 1/2" pvc, though more likely the 1". If you look at the photo below (Photo of the auto cad drawing i have made up) my main concern is the [B]two[B] remote deep sand beds, as i have never really messed with deep sand beds before i am worried about them only having the one hole to come in. The original basis of the one hole is that i plan on making them out of 4" pvc and it would be much easier to do so and from my knowledge they work on diffusion, but i could be wrong.

So take a look and tell me if you can give me any advice! (P.S. i know i should add a skimmer in this but im unsure how i can make one out of pvc that will flow out back into the in closed system. aka i dont want the cap to shoot off.)

der_wille_zur_macht · 12/07/2011, 02:24 PM

Do you have a sump on your system? That provides a suitable place to house your filters without many of the headaches that a closed system like this might have.

Are you looking for advice specifically on how to construct this sort of system, or are you open for input on whether or not this sort of system would be suitable/optimal to achieve a specific set of goals for a specific type of reef tank?

Misteor · 12/07/2011, 02:32 PM

No i do not have a sump in my system, my last marine tank had one and we never got along very well, so i am trying to think of a way to make the closed system. But if the closed system is more trouble then its worth i'm very willing to listen to ideas on how to improve my future experiences with sumps.

And the main thing i am looking for is ideas on the Remote Deep Sand Beds, the other two filtration devices i have used in a system for fresh water and had pretty good results.

But as i have not tried this specific system type with marine (Only done this with fresh) is there any specific flaws to this type of system for a marine tank?

Chris27 · 12/07/2011, 09:54 PM

It may be a better idea to put the pump before the various filters, that way you won't be restricting the pump intake. Using it to push water through the filters is typically a better way of doing business.

uncleof6 · 12/08/2011, 02:34 PM

Dead Spot? Yes.

Stephen Spotte and Martin Moe covered these types of systems very well. In general such systems were adapted from fresh water tanks, and worked with mediocre success for marine systems in conjunction with under gravel plates/mesh assemblies, in a reverse flow configuration for quite some time. They have been relegated to the obsolete pile, except as accessory loops plumbed in and out of a sump, separate from the main flow of the system.

I imagine, with enough finesse, and attention to detail, a reef could be run from such a system, but there are far better ways to skin the cat, that are much less of a headache.

Incidentally, you cannot run a skimmer closed loop, such as you suggest. By nature it has to be open to the air. Spotte, in his books has diagrams of air driven counter current skimmers which are relatively simple to build, and air driven skimmers work just as well as the $1000 dollar acrylic monsters on the market.

A remote sand bed is open to the air, not sealed up like you have it drawn. Big dead spot yes.

What specific issues did you have running a sump? Sumps are in common use, and rarely cause problems in and of themselves.

12/07/2011, 02:01 PM	#1
Misteor Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2011 Posts: 2	Requesting Advice on Filtering Project. Hello there reef central! First post here, or any fish forum for that matter, but i have been to this site seeking information and random tidbits of interesting facts in my spare time. But today i decided that i need the help of some people who can give me advice on an "All In One Filtering System" The System is quiet simple, take the various forms of filtration and run them through one in closed system. Here i am thinking of making the system out of 1" or possibly 1/2" pvc, though more likely the 1". If you look at the photo below (Photo of the auto cad drawing i have made up) my main concern is the [B]two[B] remote deep sand beds, as i have never really messed with deep sand beds before i am worried about them only having the one hole to come in. The original basis of the one hole is that i plan on making them out of 4" pvc and it would be much easier to do so and from my knowledge they work on diffusion, but i could be wrong. So take a look and tell me if you can give me any advice! (P.S. i know i should add a skimmer in this but im unsure how i can make one out of pvc that will flow out back into the in closed system. aka i dont want the cap to shoot off.)

12/07/2011, 02:24 PM	#2
der_wille_zur_macht Team RC Member Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: NY Posts: 17,749	Do you have a sump on your system? That provides a suitable place to house your filters without many of the headaches that a closed system like this might have. Are you looking for advice specifically on how to construct this sort of system, or are you open for input on whether or not this sort of system would be suitable/optimal to achieve a specific set of goals for a specific type of reef tank? __________________ Inconveniencing marine life since 1992 "It is my personal belief that reef aquaria should be thriving communities of biodiversity, representative of their wild counterparts, and not merely collections of pretty specimens growing on tidy clean rock shelves covered in purple coralline algae." (Eric Borneman)

12/07/2011, 09:54 PM	#4
Chris27 Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Virginia Beach, VA Posts: 4,452	It may be a better idea to put the pump before the various filters, that way you won't be restricting the pump intake. Using it to push water through the filters is typically a better way of doing business. __________________ Fill your tank with $5 bills, add gasoline and light it on fire.....only then will you know the real cost of reefing. Current Tank Info: 180 Mixed Reef

12/08/2011, 02:34 PM	#5
uncleof6 Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: AWOL Posts: 12,013	Dead Spot? Yes. Stephen Spotte and Martin Moe covered these types of systems very well. In general such systems were adapted from fresh water tanks, and worked with mediocre success for marine systems in conjunction with under gravel plates/mesh assemblies, in a reverse flow configuration for quite some time. They have been relegated to the obsolete pile, except as accessory loops plumbed in and out of a sump, separate from the main flow of the system. I imagine, with enough finesse, and attention to detail, a reef could be run from such a system, but there are far better ways to skin the cat, that are much less of a headache. Incidentally, you cannot run a skimmer closed loop, such as you suggest. By nature it has to be open to the air. Spotte, in his books has diagrams of air driven counter current skimmers which are relatively simple to build, and air driven skimmers work just as well as the $1000 dollar acrylic monsters on the market. A remote sand bed is open to the air, not sealed up like you have it drawn. Big dead spot yes. What specific issues did you have running a sump? Sumps are in common use, and rarely cause problems in and of themselves. __________________ "Things should be made as simple as possible, but not simpler." (oft attributed to Einstein; most likely paraphrasing by Roger Sessions; compactly articulates the principle of Occam's Razor) Current Tank Info: 325 6' wide Reef

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12/07/2011, 02:32 PM	#3
Misteor Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2011 Posts: 2	No i do not have a sump in my system, my last marine tank had one and we never got along very well, so i am trying to think of a way to make the closed system. But if the closed system is more trouble then its worth i'm very willing to listen to ideas on how to improve my future experiences with sumps. And the main thing i am looking for is ideas on the Remote Deep Sand Beds, the other two filtration devices i have used in a system for fresh water and had pretty good results. But as i have not tried this specific system type with marine (Only done this with fresh) is there any specific flaws to this type of system for a marine tank?