making a manifold

Waddleboy · 12/22/2011, 03:02 PM

I want to use my return pump more efficiently and was thinking of making a manifold out of it. I was wondering if anyone know if any of these ideas will work. Sorry they are in paint and crude but hopefully get the point across

The first one would be the easiest cause i would just be adding a t to my existing plumbing. i just wonder if the water would have the tendency to go up the pipe instead of through the t.

This one would require me to redo it all but it would go to a straight end that is capped and the straight pipe would have t'ed outlets.

I have a mag 12 in my sump and it is turned down a lot so i figured i could up the flow and force water down the added t's. Any thoughts would be helpful. thanks

scarface70706 · 12/22/2011, 03:10 PM

liquid will follow the path of least resistant so it will go into anything that has an opening. what ever you T off make sure you have a valve after the T to have full control over the flow.

doctorgori · 12/22/2011, 03:13 PM

what, you looking to use your return to power some reactors or sumthin?

...I'll expound later, but whatever you do, think it through and use "unions" and good ball valves....and in your design ALWAYS have at least one branch "head free" (no ball valve)...this would be the service branch with the most "natural head pressure"; in most cases you would have a valve on every branch except the upper most one

you use this same concept when using air valves to power tanks...the reason is so you use ALL the available pressure and don't waste any flow

Waddleboy · 12/22/2011, 03:16 PM

i was looking to use it to power a uv unit. I just dont want to add another pump just for this and thought i just make a manifold while i am at it. I am def going to put a ball valve on all the ports except the main one

scarface70706 · 12/22/2011, 03:16 PM

heres what mine looks like and my turn over rate is just fine since the mag 9.5 is well over what my 90 gallon needs. i have one that powers a carbon reactor and another to power a GFO reactor. the third is just plugged as a spare line if i want to add more equipment. good luck with the manifold. from my experience draw it out a few times and with each time alter it to make it perform to your needs. took me about 2 days to plan and make it.

Palting · 12/22/2011, 05:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Waddleboy

i was looking to use it to power a uv unit. I just dont want to add another pump just for this and thought i just make a manifold while i am at it. I am def going to put a ball valve on all the ports except the main one

If you leave one port without a ball valve, what are you going to do if that port takes too much of the flow? Put ball valves on ALL the ports, that way you have absolute control.

Waddleboy · 12/22/2011, 05:31 PM

well the open one is my main return so i have valve directly off the pump so i was going to use that to control the main flow and the manifold is after that valve

Palting · 12/22/2011, 05:46 PM

If I understand you correctly, your flow from the pump goes through a valve, then to the manifold, where all the ports except the one going to the DT have valves. Once you make a manifold system, you don't need that valve there immediately after the pump. You don't need to control the flow before the manifold. Move that valve that' directly off the pump and move it to the main port, and it will still control flow to the DT the same way that ll the other valves will control flow to whatever else they are feeding.

Here's an example using hoses and barb connectors:

Waddleboy · 12/22/2011, 05:54 PM

ya i agree that would be great the only problem with that is that its glued into the exit out of the return so moving it is theoretically impossible without redoing everything. The tank is set up and now i want to add a manifold... silly me. They do say hindsight is key.....

scarface70706 · 12/22/2011, 06:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Waddleboy

ya i agree that would be great the only problem with that is that its glued into the exit out of the return so moving it is theoretically impossible without redoing everything. The tank is set up and now i want to add a manifold... silly me. They do say hindsight is key.....

almost all of my fittings were glued and i managed to add a manifold when the tank was full. if theres a will there is a way; just got to use a little intuition and you will figure it out.

Waddleboy · 12/22/2011, 07:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scarface70706

almost all of my fittings were glued and i managed to add a manifold when the tank was full. if theres a will there is a way; just got to use a little intuition and you will figure it out.

i agree its not impossible, just a lot of work i havent full decided i want to do right now, however that being said tanks are a lot of work, and do it right once than redo it again later....

scarface70706 · 12/22/2011, 07:18 PM

yea i agree with you buddy it is a PIA to go back and re do things but when i did i am 10X happier with my set up. do you have a pic of what you got going on down there? i might be able to help you brain storm.

Waddleboy · 12/22/2011, 07:48 PM

i hope you can follow this. The first picture is from the sump to the last all the way up. Its the smaller 1" pipe. I guess you gotta play follow the pipes? I guess ill cut at the top off by the pump and redo that whole line to the union? let me know if that makes sense. The manifold would be between the elbow and the union on the back of the tank

Steve175 · 12/22/2011, 09:52 PM

Leave your current valve where it is: will make it easier to close to service your pump. Each of the lines out of the manifold need a ball valve as well: the flow through each will depend (relatively) on how much that valve is closed. Once you dial in how much to close the valve to the UV for optimal flow and in the return line for optimal flow then you don't want to lose that setting when you need to service the pump. Advice: add at least one extra port from the manifold to be able to later add a piece of equipment (calcium reactor, GFO reactor, etc.) later without replumbing again: all you need is another T attached to a (closed) ball valve; if you're nervous, can even plumb in a piece of pipe to the unattached valve with a glued cap so that your kid can't open the valve and later cut the pipe to plumb new equipment in. PVC is 3D legos for adults: Enjoy!!!

doctorgori · 12/23/2011, 01:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Palting

If you leave one port without a ball valve, what are you going to do if that port takes too much of the flow? Put ball valves on ALL the ports, that way you have absolute control.

(unless by saying absolute control = flexibility)
(and/or adding clarity to what I'm saying)

in every imaginable design (fluid dynamics) there will always be at least one path with the most back pressure (head); that path doesn't need a valve per se

...in a parallel design (all ports have the same gravitational head pressure) finding the "max-head" port is problematic, but not so much when the final return is the uppermost/final tank return, usually, for max efficiency you leave that port open (or whatever port has the most head)

.... I've done a few manifolds in my time, you don't have to have a valve on every port (air, water, whatever)... tweeking every valve leaves open the probability that you create unnecessary back pressure...(and no emergency relief) ..... not saying you shouldn't put a valve on every port per se, but certainly if you do, one valve should always be open

evsalty · 12/23/2011, 02:21 AM

Here is an older tank of mine. I used gate valves to dial in flow and ball valves to open and close individual lines. Unions are thruout the plumbing as well so that i could turn off a line and service it without turning off the return pump. You can't see the other gate valves but they were there.

johnike · 12/23/2011, 07:03 AM

I just made this

For this

And ten of these should be here today

Rybren · 12/23/2011, 07:26 AM

Now that's what I call a man's manifold.

John, good luck with those valves. Not to be a downer, but I have two of them and they both leaked like a sieve.

Dustin1300 · 12/23/2011, 08:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rybren

Now that's what I call a man's manifold.

John, good luck with those valves. Not to be a downer, but I have two of them and they both leaked like a sieve.

Ouch! Lets hope he has better luck....

rogster · 12/23/2011, 08:54 AM

How does final picture look like ?

Waddleboy · 12/23/2011, 11:41 PM

Just wanted to say thanks for everyone helping. i have two pictures of it done but I didnt take one of it all together

here they are
modified connection to add manifold

actual manifold portion

scarface70706 · 12/24/2011, 12:01 AM

^^^ there ya go! good job. looks just like mine but one of my valve's glue set a little faster then i wanted and my spare valve is a little off set from the others lol but its ok it works and no leaks.

12/22/2011, 03:02 PM	#1
Waddleboy Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: NJ Posts: 766	making a manifold I want to use my return pump more efficiently and was thinking of making a manifold out of it. I was wondering if anyone know if any of these ideas will work. Sorry they are in paint and crude but hopefully get the point across The first one would be the easiest cause i would just be adding a t to my existing plumbing. i just wonder if the water would have the tendency to go up the pipe instead of through the t. This one would require me to redo it all but it would go to a straight end that is capped and the straight pipe would have t'ed outlets. I have a mag 12 in my sump and it is turned down a lot so i figured i could up the flow and force water down the added t's. Any thoughts would be helpful. thanks

12/22/2011, 05:46 PM	#8
Palting Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: Ohio Posts: 6,912	If I understand you correctly, your flow from the pump goes through a valve, then to the manifold, where all the ports except the one going to the DT have valves. Once you make a manifold system, you don't need that valve there immediately after the pump. You don't need to control the flow before the manifold. Move that valve that' directly off the pump and move it to the main port, and it will still control flow to the DT the same way that ll the other valves will control flow to whatever else they are feeding. Here's an example using hoses and barb connectors: __________________ Anything I post is just an opinion. One of many in this hobby. Believe and follow at your own risk of rapid and complete annihilation of all life in your tank :) Current Tank Info: Incept 3/2010, 150 RR, 50g sump, 20g fuge, 150w 15K MH x3, T5 actinics x8, moonlight LED x6, 1400gph return, Koralia 1400 x4, 300 g skimmer, 4 tangs, 2 mandarins, 2 perc, 6 line, 3 cardinals, 2 firefish, SPS, LPS, zoas, palys, shrooms, clam

12/22/2011, 09:52 PM	#14
Steve175 Registered Member Join Date: May 2003 Location: Baltimore, MD Posts: 1,186	Leave your current valve where it is: will make it easier to close to service your pump. Each of the lines out of the manifold need a ball valve as well: the flow through each will depend (relatively) on how much that valve is closed. Once you dial in how much to close the valve to the UV for optimal flow and in the return line for optimal flow then you don't want to lose that setting when you need to service the pump. Advice: add at least one extra port from the manifold to be able to later add a piece of equipment (calcium reactor, GFO reactor, etc.) later without replumbing again: all you need is another T attached to a (closed) ball valve; if you're nervous, can even plumb in a piece of pipe to the unattached valve with a glued cap so that your kid can't open the valve and later cut the pipe to plumb new equipment in. PVC is 3D legos for adults: Enjoy!!! __________________ Steve ---------------------------------- Current Tank Info: 2 separate 250G bowfront rimless ELOS tanks plumbed to 260G sump, 220G refugium, 220G frag, BK DeLuxe 300, 400W MH x4, closed loops, 3/4hp chiller x2, Phos reactor, Kalk reactor, Charcoal reactor, Ca reactor, 60G surge tanks, & a huge elec bill

12/23/2011, 07:26 AM	#18
Rybren Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Ottawa, Canada Posts: 1,642	Now that's what I call a man's manifold. John, good luck with those valves. Not to be a downer, but I have two of them and they both leaked like a sieve. __________________ 120G Mixed Reef, 28G AIO zoa/pipefish tank

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12/22/2011, 03:10 PM	#2
scarface70706 Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2011 Posts: 1,364	liquid will follow the path of least resistant so it will go into anything that has an opening. what ever you T off make sure you have a valve after the T to have full control over the flow.

12/22/2011, 03:13 PM	#3
doctorgori Moved On Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: Simon Bar-Sinistar Posts: 1,097	what, you looking to use your return to power some reactors or sumthin? ...I'll expound later, but whatever you do, think it through and use "unions" and good ball valves....and in your design ALWAYS have at least one branch "head free" (no ball valve)...this would be the service branch with the most "natural head pressure"; in most cases you would have a valve on every branch except the upper most one you use this same concept when using air valves to power tanks...the reason is so you use ALL the available pressure and don't waste any flow

12/22/2011, 03:16 PM	#4
Waddleboy Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: NJ Posts: 766	i was looking to use it to power a uv unit. I just dont want to add another pump just for this and thought i just make a manifold while i am at it. I am def going to put a ball valve on all the ports except the main one

12/22/2011, 05:31 PM	#7
Waddleboy Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: NJ Posts: 766	well the open one is my main return so i have valve directly off the pump so i was going to use that to control the main flow and the manifold is after that valve

12/22/2011, 05:54 PM	#9
Waddleboy Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: NJ Posts: 766	ya i agree that would be great the only problem with that is that its glued into the exit out of the return so moving it is theoretically impossible without redoing everything. The tank is set up and now i want to add a manifold... silly me. They do say hindsight is key.....

12/22/2011, 07:18 PM	#12
scarface70706 Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2011 Posts: 1,364	yea i agree with you buddy it is a PIA to go back and re do things but when i did i am 10X happier with my set up. do you have a pic of what you got going on down there? i might be able to help you brain storm.

12/22/2011, 07:48 PM	#13
Waddleboy Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: NJ Posts: 766	i hope you can follow this. The first picture is from the sump to the last all the way up. Its the smaller 1" pipe. I guess you gotta play follow the pipes? I guess ill cut at the top off by the pump and redo that whole line to the union? let me know if that makes sense. The manifold would be between the elbow and the union on the back of the tank

12/23/2011, 02:21 AM	#16
evsalty hmmmmmm Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: NW Mesa, AZ Posts: 3,531	Here is an older tank of mine. I used gate valves to dial in flow and ball valves to open and close individual lines. Unions are thruout the plumbing as well so that i could turn off a line and service it without turning off the return pump. You can't see the other gate valves but they were there.

12/23/2011, 07:03 AM	#17
johnike Moved On Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Bureau County Illinois Posts: 5,406	I just made this For this And ten of these should be here today

12/23/2011, 08:54 AM	#20
rogster Moved On Join Date: Nov 2011 Posts: 38	How does final picture look like ?

12/23/2011, 11:41 PM	#21
Waddleboy Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: NJ Posts: 766	Just wanted to say thanks for everyone helping. i have two pictures of it done but I didnt take one of it all together here they are modified connection to add manifold actual manifold portion

12/24/2011, 12:01 AM	#22
scarface70706 Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2011 Posts: 1,364	^^^ there ya go! good job. looks just like mine but one of my valve's glue set a little faster then i wanted and my spare valve is a little off set from the others lol but its ok it works and no leaks.