When angels die - cant keep them alive??? - Page 2

cherubfish pair · 02/05/2012, 09:54 PM

I've got to have this fish too. My high school colors, royal blue and gold!

I've lost three right away during the last five years and won't tempt it again til I get my 120 gallon going. I've never had luck with this LFS. I'll try LA or Blue Zoo this time.

I've also heard bicolors are very sensitive to copper.

Good luck!

cherubfish pair · 02/05/2012, 09:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by csmfish

Well, then it had a heart attack!?

Fish do die of natural causes [old age].

Try to get a fish that is not full grown and you won't have to worry about natural causes.

csmfish · 02/05/2012, 10:06 PM

Ive tried hypo and the names you mentioned and still no go. Copper was my last shot. Was working great until last night. Then I brought it back from keeling over to have the heater, and I am almost sure of it, kill it. I mean, it never laid down, was hovering fine. Swam straight for the heater bottom level then as soon as it got in front of it, it did a death spiral up to the surface roll right in front of it. Then it twitched two times and was dead.

csmfish · 02/05/2012, 10:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cherubfish pair

Fish do die of natural causes [old age].

Try to get a fish that is not full grown and you won't have to worry about natural causes.

This thing had to be young, it was the diameter of a quarter.

cherubfish pair · 02/05/2012, 10:11 PM

You need a grounding probe and maybe a ground fault circuit interrupter. Cheap insurance.

albano · 02/05/2012, 10:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cherubfish pair

Fish do die of natural causes [old age].

Try to get a fish that is not full grown and you won't have to worry about natural causes.

There are fish that don't do well in captivity, regardless of their age! If you can't get it to survive after several attempts, please STOP trying.

If you wonder why 'people' are trying to ban capture of aquarium fish...this is why!

Ostara · 02/05/2012, 10:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by csmfish

This thing had to be young, it was the diameter of a quarter.

I've never even seen a bicolor this small. Have all of them been around that size? Bicolors are pretty popular around here and seem to do quite well once they are eating but the smallest one I have seen was a good 3". Most are around the 4"-4.5" range. I've always heard that most dwarf angels do poorly when collected at those tiny coin sizes, and I've experienced it myself with tiny flame angels that were just too frail.

If/when you get another one, I would definitely get it from LiveAquaria (I've never seen them on Diver's Den, but the fish from the LA facility are also of good quality) and get it at a larger size. Their available sizes seem to be on the small side too, but if you put a comment on the order of the particular size you want (say 3" for example), they'll pick one that size for you if they have one. Good luck!

csmfish · 02/05/2012, 10:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by albano

There are fish that don't do well in captivity, regardless of their age! If you can't get it to survive after several attempts, please STOP trying.

If you wonder why 'people' are trying to ban capture of aquarium fish...this is why!

Maybe, juuuust maybe, the suppliers should be the ones educating us and NOT selling us the fish that will not live? What do you think about that??

flameangel88 · 02/05/2012, 11:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by csmfish

Maybe, juuuust maybe, the suppliers should be the ones educating us and NOT selling us the fish that will not live? What do you think about that??

I feel for you because I always want to keep golden and colin's angels but could not get any healthy ones regardless the source. I think luck plays a big part when it comes to delicate fish. Don't get me wrong we play a big part for their long them survival but we have to have a chance to begin with. As someone mentioned earlier wait for one from a local reefer that had it for a while is the best way to go and that's the route I decided to go with the 2 mentioned above.

As for suppliers educating us and NOT selling us the fish that will not live is not going to happen for as long as there's money to be make just like drugs.

albano · 02/05/2012, 11:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by csmfish

Maybe, juuuust maybe, the suppliers should be the ones educating us and NOT selling us the fish that will not live? What do you think about that??

Maybe, juuuust maybe, the tobacco companies will tell you not to smoke!

Have you heard of 'Google', and 'search" ...you'll find plenty of lists of fish, that are difficult (&/or near impossible) to keep, that are better left in the ocean!

Some people learn from their mistakes, others blame the heater...That's what I think about that!

csmfish · 02/06/2012, 12:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by albano

Maybe, juuuust maybe, the tobacco companies will tell you not to smoke!

Have you heard of 'Google', and 'search" ...you'll find plenty of lists of fish, that are difficult (&/or near impossible) to keep, that are better left in the ocean!

Some people learn from their mistakes, others blame the heater...That's what I think about that!

Ha ha ha, I was waiting for you to say that. Actually I was wondering "who" would say that. Thats the same but different.

How many shrimp you eat at dinner? Ever have a McDonalds fillet o fish? How many eggs you eat? Funny how you can call me on my so called "ilogic" when you do the SAME! Just like you and your eggs, which I dont eat, I know I am doing it for a fairly good cause, so, it is justifiable. If I was buying them to see how long they lived in my toilet, that may be another story.

CRC88 · 02/06/2012, 09:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by csmfish

Maybe, juuuust maybe, the suppliers should be the ones educating us and NOT selling us the fish that will not live? What do you think about that??

The reason they keep selling fish that won't live is because there's people out there who will buy FIVE of them, trying to keep them alive. OF COURSE they're going to keep selling them if people buy them. Simple laws of supply and demand and they're in it to profit.

My thoughts: Angels don't do well in copper. Simple as that. I know because I killed a Flame Angel by treating for Ich with copper.

I also wouldn't do 100% water changes....ever. Even in a QT. It causes un-necessary swings in water parameters that could be stressing your fish. As a max, only do 50% in your QT.

You're obviously frustrated - otherwise you wouldn't have come here - so maybe just wait a while on the Bi-Color. Something clearly just isn't working with that fish and your setup. I'd recommend giving it 3-6 months and try again. Maybe buy a Chromis or Damsel and keep it in your QT until then to give the system some time to balance. Then try again with the angel. I still want a Flame Angel - I'm just going to wait a few months before I try again. Good luck.

cherubfish pair · 02/06/2012, 09:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cherubfish pair

Fish do die of natural causes [old age].

Try to get a fish that is not full grown and you won't have to worry about natural causes.

Quote:

Originally Posted by albano

There are fish that don't do well in captivity, regardless of their age! If you can't get it to survive after several attempts, please STOP trying.

If you wonder why 'people' are trying to ban capture of aquarium fish...this is why!

You missed my point. My point is if you get a full grown fish, there's no telling how old the fish is, so getting one that'll keel over from natural causes is more likely to happen.

Paying heed to this advice will help fish to do well in captivity. This is not an excuse if a fish dies.

albano · 02/06/2012, 10:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cherubfish pair

You missed my point. My point is if you get a full grown fish, there's no telling how old the fish is, so getting one that'll keel over from natural causes is more likely to happen.

Paying heed to this advice will help fish to do well in captivity.

I didn't miss your point, I dismissed your point!...
I'm talking about 'hard to keep' fish...
please provide the link to your information that younger (hard to keep) fish will do better in captivity!
FWIW...the bi colors that are being discussed here, are NOT dying of 'natural causes' or old age!

02/05/2012, 09:54 PM	#26
cherubfish pair Registered Member Join Date: May 2004 Location: Libby, Montana Posts: 7,061 Blog Entries: 1	I've got to have this fish too. My high school colors, royal blue and gold! I've lost three right away during the last five years and won't tempt it again til I get my 120 gallon going. I've never had luck with this LFS. I'll try LA or Blue Zoo this time. I've also heard bicolors are very sensitive to copper. Good luck! __________________ pairo chero Thanks for looking at my build thread and subscribe to it if you already haven't yet! Current Tank Info: thirty rimless

02/05/2012, 10:11 PM	#30
cherubfish pair Registered Member Join Date: May 2004 Location: Libby, Montana Posts: 7,061 Blog Entries: 1	You need a grounding probe and maybe a ground fault circuit interrupter. Cheap insurance. __________________ pairo chero Thanks for looking at my build thread and subscribe to it if you already haven't yet! Current Tank Info: thirty rimless

02/05/2012, 10:06 PM	#28
csmfish Moved On Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: VA Posts: 1,055	Ive tried hypo and the names you mentioned and still no go. Copper was my last shot. Was working great until last night. Then I brought it back from keeling over to have the heater, and I am almost sure of it, kill it. I mean, it never laid down, was hovering fine. Swam straight for the heater bottom level then as soon as it got in front of it, it did a death spiral up to the surface roll right in front of it. Then it twitched two times and was dead.