Plumbing help please

earthboy17 · 08/14/2012, 10:49 PM

Hi everyone.

First of all, I'm not sure this is the right place to post this question. If not, my apologies.

That said, I'm looking for some help plumbing my system.
I bought a new overflow and will be redoing my plumbing.

BACKGROUND:
I have two drains, one of which I will T off and send most to the skimmer chamber and some to the refugium (they are on opposite ends of the sump, and both drain to the central return pump chamber). The other drain will be open at the top and will serve as an emergency backup, draining directly to the skimmer chamber.

It seems that a lot of the noise from draining comes from the water dropping and the sound echoing up. Dursos and other techniques can minimize the noise, but rarely ever eliminate it completely.

QUESTION #1:
Do people ever put in a P-trap (or some other type of contraption) so that there is not a direct sound tunnel up and out?
What are the advantages and disadvantages of putting in an immediate trap that would have the water falling only inches rather than feet?

QUESTION #2:
I'm planning on having the pipe drop straight down about 2-3 feet (right above the sump lip), then T-ing it off parallel to the ground, with ball valves on both sides of the T, with most water going to the skimmer chamber (through a sock), and the other part going over to the refugium.
Is there a better, or more common way of doing this?
It seems like I could eventually get it so that the downspout fills up with water, making it quiet (although having a lot of water in the column if the power fails).
Any thoughts?

QUESTION #3:
Are there any other plumbing basics that someone in this hobby should know? Any handy tips you've picked up? Any lessons learned through remorse? Any threads that are basic that I may have missed out on?

I have basic understanding of plumbing for tanks--I've had several without any major problems. But I have no idea if I'm doing it 'right' or not.

Thanks all,
Tom

someone19 · 08/15/2012, 03:59 AM

I can't answer most of the questions, but putting in the trap will create a syphon pulling the water down, much like a toilet flush. This will cause a surge and gurgling.

Ron Reefman · 08/15/2012, 04:44 AM

question #1 Don't do a P trap, it's not needed. Lets just say for sake of discussion, that your bulkhead is for 3/4" pipe. Then make as much pipe as you can above the bulkhead bigger, like 1 1/2" pipe. The flow down the bigger pipe should back up at the smaller pipe and the back up will stop the gurgling sounds. It works like a charm in my tanks.

question #2 Your plan should work just fine. Just make sure you have enough room in the sump if the power goes off.

question #3 You are doing an emergency drain, you're already smarter than all the aquarium manufactures! Plumbing is like skinning a cat, there are lots of ways to do it. If it works for you, it works and who cares what the experts say.

One idea for you is to put a liner (plastic sheeting, pond liner or I used flexible pvc shower pan liner) under the sump and up as far as is practical around the edges of the stand. Mine is 8" deep, but I've got a huge stand and sump. This works great for catching spills and salt creep around the sump. I also had an external pump spring a small leak and it keep the stand and floor dry. I even installed a bulkhead in the liner and ran that drain out thru the wall into the backyard. You hope you'll never need it, but it's cheap insurance.

thegrun · 08/15/2012, 06:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by earthboy17

QUESTION #1:
No to the P Trap
QUESTION #2:
The tee set up is common, but I would use gate valves instead of ball valves for much easier adjustment.

It seems like I could eventually get it so that the downspout fills up with water, making it quiet

This is the best way to quiet down your drain. With gate valves you can dial in your drain flow to fill the down tube and still maintain proper flow. You should only use this method when you have a second emergency drain.
Tom

earthboy17 · 08/15/2012, 04:30 PM

Thanks everyone

BSmitty22 · 08/15/2012, 05:47 PM

if your using two drains, use a ball or gate valve and have the main one be at a full syphon, that whay there will be no nosie. Then have just a slight tickle of the emergency drain. Thats how do mine and i have had no problems. although i dont have mine t-ed off. this is the herbie style by the way.

08/14/2012, 10:49 PM	#1
earthboy17 Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Walnut Creek / Concord, CA Posts: 1,331	Plumbing help please Hi everyone. First of all, I'm not sure this is the right place to post this question. If not, my apologies. That said, I'm looking for some help plumbing my system. I bought a new overflow and will be redoing my plumbing. BACKGROUND: I have two drains, one of which I will T off and send most to the skimmer chamber and some to the refugium (they are on opposite ends of the sump, and both drain to the central return pump chamber). The other drain will be open at the top and will serve as an emergency backup, draining directly to the skimmer chamber. It seems that a lot of the noise from draining comes from the water dropping and the sound echoing up. Dursos and other techniques can minimize the noise, but rarely ever eliminate it completely. QUESTION #1: Do people ever put in a P-trap (or some other type of contraption) so that there is not a direct sound tunnel up and out? What are the advantages and disadvantages of putting in an immediate trap that would have the water falling only inches rather than feet? QUESTION #2: I'm planning on having the pipe drop straight down about 2-3 feet (right above the sump lip), then T-ing it off parallel to the ground, with ball valves on both sides of the T, with most water going to the skimmer chamber (through a sock), and the other part going over to the refugium. Is there a better, or more common way of doing this? It seems like I could eventually get it so that the downspout fills up with water, making it quiet (although having a lot of water in the column if the power fails). Any thoughts? QUESTION #3: Are there any other plumbing basics that someone in this hobby should know? Any handy tips you've picked up? Any lessons learned through remorse? Any threads that are basic that I may have missed out on? I have basic understanding of plumbing for tanks--I've had several without any major problems. But I have no idea if I'm doing it 'right' or not. Thanks all, Tom

08/15/2012, 03:59 AM	#2
someone19 Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: Daytona Beach, Fl Posts: 50	I can't answer most of the questions, but putting in the trap will create a syphon pulling the water down, much like a toilet flush. This will cause a surge and gurgling.

08/15/2012, 04:44 AM	#3
Ron Reefman Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Cape Coral, FL Posts: 10,431	question #1 Don't do a P trap, it's not needed. Lets just say for sake of discussion, that your bulkhead is for 3/4" pipe. Then make as much pipe as you can above the bulkhead bigger, like 1 1/2" pipe. The flow down the bigger pipe should back up at the smaller pipe and the back up will stop the gurgling sounds. It works like a charm in my tanks. question #2 Your plan should work just fine. Just make sure you have enough room in the sump if the power goes off. question #3 You are doing an emergency drain, you're already smarter than all the aquarium manufactures! Plumbing is like skinning a cat, there are lots of ways to do it. If it works for you, it works and who cares what the experts say. One idea for you is to put a liner (plastic sheeting, pond liner or I used flexible pvc shower pan liner) under the sump and up as far as is practical around the edges of the stand. Mine is 8" deep, but I've got a huge stand and sump. This works great for catching spills and salt creep around the sump. I also had an external pump spring a small leak and it keep the stand and floor dry. I even installed a bulkhead in the liner and ran that drain out thru the wall into the backyard. You hope you'll never need it, but it's cheap insurance. __________________ The good thing about science is that it's true whether or not you believe in it. (Neil deGrasse Tyson) Visit my build thread http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2593017

08/15/2012, 04:30 PM	#5
earthboy17 Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Walnut Creek / Concord, CA Posts: 1,331	Thanks everyone

08/15/2012, 05:47 PM	#6
BSmitty22 Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Southern Illinois Posts: 61	if your using two drains, use a ball or gate valve and have the main one be at a full syphon, that whay there will be no nosie. Then have just a slight tickle of the emergency drain. Thats how do mine and i have had no problems. although i dont have mine t-ed off. this is the herbie style by the way.