Bitterns as a Trace Element supplement

[Albert Terego]

Good evening all.

I was involved in an interesting discussion/debate on a South African Reefkeeping forum today and decided to sign up to RC in order to get a wider range of opinions.

A local manufacturer is selling a product that consists of bitterns (something I had never heard of until today - it is the bitter water solution of bromides, magnesium, and calcium salts remaining after sodium chloride is crystallized out of seawater) along with added Vitamin C and amino acids.

This is the blurb on the product - name has been changed to keep the discussion generic.


Many synthetic reef salt blends on the market today contain all the major minerals found in natural seawater, but, lack the vitally important micro nutrients that are are vital for the survival of corals and other marine animals. Without these micro minerals, growth in corals and fish could become stunted and in severe cases it could result in death
PRODUCT XYZ is a natural supplement , specifically developed to replace all micro minerals that have been utilized by corals and other marine animals. Made from 100% pure natural seawater, PRODUCT XYZ contains all minerals that are vital to the survival of corals.

It also contains Vitamin-C and Amino Acids
Elements to name a few:
Lithium, Beryllium, Boron, Carbon, Fluorine, Sodium, Chloride, Magnesium, Aluminum, Sulfur, Chlorine, Potassium, Calcium, Scandium, Titanium, Vanadium, Chromium, Manganese, Lanthanum, Cobalt, Nickel, Copper, Zinc, Gallium, Selenium, Bromine, Rubidium, Strontium, Yttrium, Zirconium, Niobium, Molybdenum, Technetium, Ruthenium, Palladium, Silver, Cadmium, Indium, Cesium, Barium, Praseodymium, Cerium, Iron, Neodymium, Samarium, Europium, Gadolinium, Terbium, Dysprosium, Holmium, Erbium, Thallium, Ytterbium, Lutetium, Tungsten, Rhenium, Iridium, Platinum, Gold, Lead, Bismuth


My questions are

1) Do you think bitterns has a significant role to play as a trace element additive for marine aquaria?

2) Do you think the claims made above are verifiable?

3) What biological role do the "unusual" elements have, if any i.e. dysprosium, terbium, gold, rhenium, iridium, erbium, samarium etc.

4) From a bit of research on Google I have deduced that bitterns is approximately 8-9x concentrated in all chemicals (except sodium chloride) meaning one would have to dose about 13l/100litres to get close to NSW levels (assuming 0ppm starting concentrations in tank). assuming a recommended dosage of 10ml/100l this means that one would only be adding 1/130th of the levels required anyway - would this be significant.

Look forward to your replies, and especially interested if anyone has ever used bitterns before and what the results were.

Thanks,
Al

[bnumair]

i dont dose any suppliments in reef. unless u can test for them u need to dose them. trace elements and amino acids are something that can be replaced via normal water changes and thus dont require additional dosing.

[disc1]

Not to mention the fact that while a great many of those elements are indeed present at some detectable level in natural seawater, they make not a hill of beans to the things living there.

Technetium? Really? You mean like from nuclear and medical waste? That's getting a little too real.

[bertoni]

Other than calcium and magnesium, there's nothing in that mix that I would want to dose. Our tanks get a lot of trace elements from salt products and food. Here's some reading, if you're interested:

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2002-0...ture/index.php
http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2003-0...ture/index.php

There's more, too.

[Albert Terego]

Thanks fro the replies everyone.

The suppliers contention is that synthetic salts lack all the micro-minerals present in NSW and by dosing this bitterns liquor, that we will be replacing them, even if they have no biological function. A few local reefers have apparently experienced some positive benefits, although I am not sure they are quantifiable, and if these positive benefits can be solely attributed to the dosing of the additive.

But thanks, I think you have answered my questions. I have always been quite skeptical of any trace element type of product, but was just wondering if bitterns may have been different.

Thanks.

[disc1]

A lot of those elements would form insoluble carbonates or hydroxides or sulfates when you evaporate the water out. The levels would be so slight that you would never be able to find them on the vessel you evaporated the water in. If you try to add water back in, they won't redissolve.

[dallasg]

Originally Posted by Albert Terego

Thanks fro the replies everyone.

The suppliers contention is that synthetic salts lack all the micro-minerals present in NSW and by dosing this bitterns liquor, that we will be replacing them, even if they have no biological function. A few local reefers have apparently experienced some positive benefits, although I am not sure they are quantifiable, and if these positive benefits can be solely attributed to the dosing of the additive.

But thanks, I think you have answered my questions. I have always been quite skeptical of any trace element type of product, but was just wondering if bitterns may have been different.

Thanks.

All the manufacturer states is that if one becomes lazy and misses a few water changes this will supply elements from the sea. There is no statement that using it does anything more than replace trace elements found in the ocean, even if not 100% efficient, are any? Even zeovit has Salt water all in one

Would these also not also be present in evaporated salt brands naturally?

[bertoni]

All salt products are made in part from evaporated compounds, in the end. They all have a lot of trace elements, probably more than ocean water from most areas.

[HighlandReefer]

Salt mixes are already higher in most of these micro-supplements than we really want. Adding more can cause problems. Like stated above, I would not add more to my tank unless there was a way to test for the minieral and determine it indeed is deficient. Keep in mind we are only talking parts per billion needed for the micro-supplements and the hobby grade test kits can't detect down this low.