return pump suggestions

schoch79 · 03/02/2013, 07:13 AM

Hi everyone. I am setting up a 20 long mixed reef. I currently have a mag5 as the return pump. The vertical rise from pump to outlet is about 4 feet. In my opinion not only is the pump too loud for my taste but the flow is way too much. After using the head loss calculator and going by the 3-5 times sump flow through suggestions I've seen online it appears I would only need a mag2. However after looking around at other people's use of mag2's almost everyone seems to use them for reactors and the such. Am I seriously undershooting myself here with a mag2 return? I also plan to use 2 koralia's on a wavemaker for flow so the total flow won't be too much its just the amount coming from the return that concerns me. Also a mag3 just seems like too much for my use as well. I think it was calculated at about 250gph on my setup and the mag2 at only about 120 or so. Just looking for advice on whether or not a mag2 is actually feasible. Thanks.

whiteshark · 03/02/2013, 07:31 AM

How is the return plumbed? Is there a ball valve in there to control flow?

I can't comment on how much noise reduction you'd get by going down to a Mag2. It might be just as loud, but I've never used one. If you want quiet you might look into an Eheim. If you just want to reduce the flow I'd put a ball valve on the return to dial in the right amount of flow. IMO it's better to have a pump that's slightly overpowered and control it with a valve than one that is potentially underpowered.

schoch79 · 03/02/2013, 10:12 PM

To be exact the line comes out of the pump goes about 6-12 inches to the left and up about 3-4 feet to the display tank with 3 90's and one ball valve. I considered just controlling it with the valve but I also hear that the back pressure of dialing it down so much is bad for the pump. Also of course like I said the reduced noise would be a big plus...assuming it would make a difference between two mag pumps. I read lots of reviews of quiet mags but almost as many of loud ones. My biggest problem with the eheim is that it doesnt have the threaded outlet like the mag does which would mean me trying to rig it up securely hopefully without doing major changes to my current plumbing.

schoch79 · 03/02/2013, 10:22 PM

Should I decide to try the mag 2 or at worst/best the 3 do you think it would actually be an ok fit for my tank? The 2 according to the calculator still gives about 115 gph while the 3 should give about 240 gph. The 5, again according to the calculator, now gives me about 270 gph. That may not really seem like that much but its about 13.5 times turnover and in my little tank it really pushes pretty hard. Then again I dont have any coral in there atm and maybe I'm just over exaggerating due to the look of the water movement on the surface of the water. That and if I still want to achieve the wavemaker look, and I do, that would mean, with one powerhead alternating at a time, somewhere in the range of about 41 times the flow at any given moment since each powerhead is rated at 550 gph plus the return (27.5 gph for one PH only + 13.5 for return). That seems like overkill to me. I'm planning mostly softies by the way with some lps and sps tossed in there too. Sorry for the rant also guys.

whiteshark · 03/02/2013, 11:48 PM

Its understandable. The noise is a problem and I'd be annoyed with my mag if it wasnt in its own dedicated room. I had the same issue with considering the eheim as well. You have a mag5. Get a mag2, hook it up and see how you like it. I suspect it might leave a bit to be desired flow wise but maybe not, especially with the phs. Down the road if you decide you want more flow hook the 5 back up. Or maybe by then you'll find a better option.

schoch79 · 03/03/2013, 05:17 AM

Yeah I appreciate the answer. I just hate to spend another $60-70 and have to only get a different one again lol. My main concern is the flow just seems so low because I'm so used to high numbers. I mean this mag2 would have less out of the box flow than my powerhead lol. But none the less the 5 is clearly too much flow for me.

whiteshark · 03/03/2013, 05:33 AM

Well the 3 would be a good compromise then if you're worried about the 2 being a little low. I don't think the back pressure on the 3 would be too great. Actually, because I was in the same boat, I actually put a PCV T above my pump but before the ball valve. The T has one line that continues up to a ball valve and to the tank, and another line that goes to another ball valve then back into my sump. The thought was that it would be used if the pump was too powerful and I wanted to slow the return flow without putting a lot of back pressure on the pump. Turns out I don't really need it, but it did work when I tested it:

The red ball valve goes to the tank. The black one allows water back to the first section of the sump as a pressure release.

schoch79 · 03/03/2013, 07:19 AM

Gotcha. Yeah didnt even think about that. Such an easy fix to a problem I was obviously overthinking. Thanks.

03/02/2013, 07:13 AM	#1
schoch79 Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: hegins,pa Posts: 1,071	return pump suggestions Hi everyone. I am setting up a 20 long mixed reef. I currently have a mag5 as the return pump. The vertical rise from pump to outlet is about 4 feet. In my opinion not only is the pump too loud for my taste but the flow is way too much. After using the head loss calculator and going by the 3-5 times sump flow through suggestions I've seen online it appears I would only need a mag2. However after looking around at other people's use of mag2's almost everyone seems to use them for reactors and the such. Am I seriously undershooting myself here with a mag2 return? I also plan to use 2 koralia's on a wavemaker for flow so the total flow won't be too much its just the amount coming from the return that concerns me. Also a mag3 just seems like too much for my use as well. I think it was calculated at about 250gph on my setup and the mag2 at only about 120 or so. Just looking for advice on whether or not a mag2 is actually feasible. Thanks. __________________ We'd better get back, 'cause it'll be dark soon, and they mostly come at night... mostly.

03/02/2013, 07:31 AM	#2
whiteshark Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Bethlehem, PA Posts: 3,024	How is the return plumbed? Is there a ball valve in there to control flow? I can't comment on how much noise reduction you'd get by going down to a Mag2. It might be just as loud, but I've never used one. If you want quiet you might look into an Eheim. If you just want to reduce the flow I'd put a ball valve on the return to dial in the right amount of flow. IMO it's better to have a pump that's slightly overpowered and control it with a valve than one that is potentially underpowered. __________________ Deep Blue 60 gallon cube: Setup in progress.

03/02/2013, 10:12 PM	#3
schoch79 Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: hegins,pa Posts: 1,071	To be exact the line comes out of the pump goes about 6-12 inches to the left and up about 3-4 feet to the display tank with 3 90's and one ball valve. I considered just controlling it with the valve but I also hear that the back pressure of dialing it down so much is bad for the pump. Also of course like I said the reduced noise would be a big plus...assuming it would make a difference between two mag pumps. I read lots of reviews of quiet mags but almost as many of loud ones. My biggest problem with the eheim is that it doesnt have the threaded outlet like the mag does which would mean me trying to rig it up securely hopefully without doing major changes to my current plumbing. __________________ We'd better get back, 'cause it'll be dark soon, and they mostly come at night... mostly.

03/02/2013, 10:22 PM	#4
schoch79 Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: hegins,pa Posts: 1,071	Should I decide to try the mag 2 or at worst/best the 3 do you think it would actually be an ok fit for my tank? The 2 according to the calculator still gives about 115 gph while the 3 should give about 240 gph. The 5, again according to the calculator, now gives me about 270 gph. That may not really seem like that much but its about 13.5 times turnover and in my little tank it really pushes pretty hard. Then again I dont have any coral in there atm and maybe I'm just over exaggerating due to the look of the water movement on the surface of the water. That and if I still want to achieve the wavemaker look, and I do, that would mean, with one powerhead alternating at a time, somewhere in the range of about 41 times the flow at any given moment since each powerhead is rated at 550 gph plus the return (27.5 gph for one PH only + 13.5 for return). That seems like overkill to me. I'm planning mostly softies by the way with some lps and sps tossed in there too. Sorry for the rant also guys. __________________ We'd better get back, 'cause it'll be dark soon, and they mostly come at night... mostly.

03/02/2013, 11:48 PM	#5
whiteshark Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Bethlehem, PA Posts: 3,024	Its understandable. The noise is a problem and I'd be annoyed with my mag if it wasnt in its own dedicated room. I had the same issue with considering the eheim as well. You have a mag5. Get a mag2, hook it up and see how you like it. I suspect it might leave a bit to be desired flow wise but maybe not, especially with the phs. Down the road if you decide you want more flow hook the 5 back up. Or maybe by then you'll find a better option. __________________ Deep Blue 60 gallon cube: Setup in progress.

03/03/2013, 05:17 AM	#6
schoch79 Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: hegins,pa Posts: 1,071	Yeah I appreciate the answer. I just hate to spend another $60-70 and have to only get a different one again lol. My main concern is the flow just seems so low because I'm so used to high numbers. I mean this mag2 would have less out of the box flow than my powerhead lol. But none the less the 5 is clearly too much flow for me. __________________ We'd better get back, 'cause it'll be dark soon, and they mostly come at night... mostly.

03/03/2013, 05:33 AM	#7
whiteshark Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Bethlehem, PA Posts: 3,024	Well the 3 would be a good compromise then if you're worried about the 2 being a little low. I don't think the back pressure on the 3 would be too great. Actually, because I was in the same boat, I actually put a PCV T above my pump but before the ball valve. The T has one line that continues up to a ball valve and to the tank, and another line that goes to another ball valve then back into my sump. The thought was that it would be used if the pump was too powerful and I wanted to slow the return flow without putting a lot of back pressure on the pump. Turns out I don't really need it, but it did work when I tested it: The red ball valve goes to the tank. The black one allows water back to the first section of the sump as a pressure release. __________________ Deep Blue 60 gallon cube: Setup in progress.

03/03/2013, 07:19 AM	#8
schoch79 Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: hegins,pa Posts: 1,071	Gotcha. Yeah didnt even think about that. Such an easy fix to a problem I was obviously overthinking. Thanks. __________________ We'd better get back, 'cause it'll be dark soon, and they mostly come at night... mostly.