Water Temp Control

DG29 · 05/15/2013, 10:12 PM

Ok guys a couple questions:

I have a 30 gallon reef tank, 25lbs live rock, live sand, no sump, hang on Remora Skimmer, Fluval Canister Filter, heater, two pumps, LED lighting, etc.

Regarding Temperature Control- I recently got a digital thermometer and noticed a large swing in temp from morning to evening. I try to keep temps around 74-76 and am successful in that unless my house temp gets over 75. My temp will climb to almost 80 from 74ish if the house gets around 75. trying to avoid purchasing a chiller. I'm wondering why the tank temp gets so high when the house is only 75?

1. Do I need to worry about this swing in temp from 74 to 80 and back to 74 by morning? From all I read, the answer is yes

2. The LEDs do not put off a lot of heat so I'm wondering if adding fans that blow across water will help with temp control.

Any help is appreciated.

matty0206 · 05/15/2013, 10:27 PM

I was having almost the exact same issue until I purchased a Ranco temp controller and stopped relying on the internal thermostat in the heater. My temps have been solid since. Come to find out my heater was going off and on at random and apparently the thermostat in the heater doesn't work at all.
In my experience corals and fish get used to temp swings and it doesn't seem to bother most but yours are pretty big swings.

TimeConsumer · 05/16/2013, 02:12 AM

I would recommend a temperature controller like a Ranco, Apex, or Reefkeeper. It will protect you from heater malfunctions boiling your tank. It also will allow you to have a heater turn on/off at a certain temp as well as the fans. In my tank my heater is set to 81 degrees but my controller shuts it off at 80.1. My fans turn on at 80.5. degrees. My tank swings between 80-81 degrees throughout the day with an ambient temperature of 74.

I'm just curious, what animals are you keeping at 74-76 degrees?

toky916 · 05/16/2013, 02:31 AM

74 seems low from what I've read 78-82 is normal for a reef.
I keep my tank at 78.3 heater and swings 78.3-79.5 and seems fine

Ron Reefman · 05/16/2013, 07:03 AM

Daily swings from 74 to 80 are a bit excessive and I'd rather see much smaller swings, but IMHO I don't think that is a big problem for most hearty marine animals (fish or corals & other inverts). You may find some more 'fussy' animals and corals harder or impossible to keep.

A good fan will help by increasing evaporation and cooling the water. A sump would also slow the up and down movement by having more water volume to heat or cool. Extremes can still be reached if warm or cool periods persist, but the rate of change will be slowed.

DG29 · 05/16/2013, 08:25 AM

I have books, volume 1-3 called The Reef Aquarium and it states 74-76 is ideal temperature range and anything over 80 is not good. I bought the books because I was told they are the bible for reef keeping. I'll adjust up to 78 and see if I have better luck. Sounds like a temp controller is a must and some fans on the water will help. Thanks for all the advice.

klwheat · 05/16/2013, 08:33 AM

May I ask why you keep it so low? It probably won't hurt them, but I would suggest aiming for 78-80. That way, if the temp does go up, you won't get as much swing the other way.

Edit: sorry...u answered while I was typing...lol

sirreal63 · 05/16/2013, 08:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DG29

I have books, volume 1-3 called The Reef Aquarium and it states 74-76 is ideal temperature range and anything over 80 is not good. I bought the books because I was told they are the bible for reef keeping. I'll adjust up to 78 and see if I have better luck. Sounds like a temp controller is a must and some fans on the water will help. Thanks for all the advice.

Be careful of what you read in books, sometimes the information is misleading. We are fortunate to have a couple of people who are members here who actually study this topic.
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/sh...1&postcount=11

Quote:

Originally Posted by MCsaxmaster

I'd humbly suggest that reading this series which I recently wrote for Reefs Magazine could be useful. It's a four part series entitled "The Great Temperature Debate":

http://www.reefsmagazine.com/forum/r...hris-jury.html

http://www.reefsmagazine.com/forum/r...e-part-ii.html

http://www.reefsmagazine.com/forum/r...-part-iii.html

http://www.reefsmagazine.com/forum/r...e-part-iv.html

The very short version is that most (i.e., not all, only most) coral reefs have historically experienced temperatures in the neighborhood of ~78-84 F and have spent relatively little time outside this range. Some reefs are hotter than typical and regularly spend time in the 84-87 F range (and even higher in the Persian gulf) and some reefs are cooler and regularly drop down to the upper 60's, or even lower. However, the extremes are poorly tolerated by most corals. Corals from all reefs can thrive at temperatures in the neighborhood of 77-82 F, and most are flexible enough that they can tolerate a few degrees higher or lower for a bit. You can see much more detailed discussion in the series.

Back to the original question: if it were my tank, I'd use a fan on it as suggested. I think a temp of 83 F is fine and pretty much all our critters will thrive at that temperature, but I wouldn't want to intentially let it get much higher. Some corals will tolerate many degrees warmer without problems, whereas those form cooler reefs won't. Putting a fan on should allow better temperature control.

As a side note, greenbean is hecka smart and has given oodles of great advice; I'm a Ph.D. candidate in oceanography here at UH, working on coral eco-physiology; I live about 3/4 of a mile from the nearest reef and work adjacent to one; the temperature there averaged about 82 F today, which is a degree or two F lower than normal for this time of year (and 6-8 F warmer than is normal for 6 months from now, but then our reefs are on the cool side here in HI).

cj

downbeach · 05/16/2013, 08:51 AM

I have the Delbeek and Sprung books also, and they recommend a temp between 74 and 76 F. Although there are other experts we rely on who offer a wider range that would be acceptable. Here's a couple articles:

http://web.archive.org/web/200302181.../1/default.asp

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2004-05/rhf/

Consideration should be made as to what you are going to keep, i.e. Catalina Gobies would not do well in higher temps. Whatever you choose, it's a good idea to have some kind of controller for your heater/fan/chiller, and keep your temp as stable as possible.

05/15/2013, 10:12 PM	#1
DG29 Registered Member Join Date: May 2013 Posts: 5	Water Temp Control Ok guys a couple questions: I have a 30 gallon reef tank, 25lbs live rock, live sand, no sump, hang on Remora Skimmer, Fluval Canister Filter, heater, two pumps, LED lighting, etc. Regarding Temperature Control- I recently got a digital thermometer and noticed a large swing in temp from morning to evening. I try to keep temps around 74-76 and am successful in that unless my house temp gets over 75. My temp will climb to almost 80 from 74ish if the house gets around 75. trying to avoid purchasing a chiller. I'm wondering why the tank temp gets so high when the house is only 75? 1. Do I need to worry about this swing in temp from 74 to 80 and back to 74 by morning? From all I read, the answer is yes 2. The LEDs do not put off a lot of heat so I'm wondering if adding fans that blow across water will help with temp control. Any help is appreciated.

05/16/2013, 02:12 AM	#3
TimeConsumer Registered Member Join Date: May 2011 Location: New Orleans, La Posts: 1,919	I would recommend a temperature controller like a Ranco, Apex, or Reefkeeper. It will protect you from heater malfunctions boiling your tank. It also will allow you to have a heater turn on/off at a certain temp as well as the fans. In my tank my heater is set to 81 degrees but my controller shuts it off at 80.1. My fans turn on at 80.5. degrees. My tank swings between 80-81 degrees throughout the day with an ambient temperature of 74. I'm just curious, what animals are you keeping at 74-76 degrees? __________________ Steve - Retired from reefing, for now. Last edited by TimeConsumer; 05/16/2013 at 03:00 AM.

05/16/2013, 07:03 AM	#5
Ron Reefman Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Cape Coral, FL Posts: 10,431	Daily swings from 74 to 80 are a bit excessive and I'd rather see much smaller swings, but IMHO I don't think that is a big problem for most hearty marine animals (fish or corals & other inverts). You may find some more 'fussy' animals and corals harder or impossible to keep. A good fan will help by increasing evaporation and cooling the water. A sump would also slow the up and down movement by having more water volume to heat or cool. Extremes can still be reached if warm or cool periods persist, but the rate of change will be slowed. __________________ The good thing about science is that it's true whether or not you believe in it. (Neil deGrasse Tyson) Visit my build thread http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2593017

05/16/2013, 08:33 AM	#7
klwheat Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2011 Posts: 676	May I ask why you keep it so low? It probably won't hurt them, but I would suggest aiming for 78-80. That way, if the temp does go up, you won't get as much swing the other way. Edit: sorry...u answered while I was typing...lol __________________ 180 Gallon Mixed reef President/Co-founder Running4Trisomy A Butterfly's Touch

05/15/2013, 10:27 PM	#2
matty0206 Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Vancouver Wa. Posts: 578	I was having almost the exact same issue until I purchased a Ranco temp controller and stopped relying on the internal thermostat in the heater. My temps have been solid since. Come to find out my heater was going off and on at random and apparently the thermostat in the heater doesn't work at all. In my experience corals and fish get used to temp swings and it doesn't seem to bother most but yours are pretty big swings.

05/16/2013, 02:31 AM	#4
toky916 Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Sacramento Posts: 1,794	74 seems low from what I've read 78-82 is normal for a reef. I keep my tank at 78.3 heater and swings 78.3-79.5 and seems fine

05/16/2013, 08:25 AM	#6
DG29 Registered Member Join Date: May 2013 Posts: 5	I have books, volume 1-3 called The Reef Aquarium and it states 74-76 is ideal temperature range and anything over 80 is not good. I bought the books because I was told they are the bible for reef keeping. I'll adjust up to 78 and see if I have better luck. Sounds like a temp controller is a must and some fans on the water will help. Thanks for all the advice.

05/16/2013, 08:51 AM	#9
downbeach Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Smyrna, Delaware Posts: 3,767	I have the Delbeek and Sprung books also, and they recommend a temp between 74 and 76 F. Although there are other experts we rely on who offer a wider range that would be acceptable. Here's a couple articles: http://web.archive.org/web/200302181.../1/default.asp http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2004-05/rhf/ Consideration should be made as to what you are going to keep, i.e. Catalina Gobies would not do well in higher temps. Whatever you choose, it's a good idea to have some kind of controller for your heater/fan/chiller, and keep your temp as stable as possible.