Tank Cycling Question

[RussKubes]

Hello,

I've been trying to cycle my tank for about a month and a half to two months now. I'm pretty sure it's done - I just wanted to double check before I make my next steps.

It's a 55 Gallon FOWLR tank. When I first got the tank in the beginning of September, I put "SeaChem Stability" in it per directions.

On 9/26/13 I put 17 lbs of Live Rock from the LFS in it. There was a bit of an algae bloom on the rock, gravel, and glass. The algae started to decrease on its own from the glass and gravel. I started off with about 2 to 3 visible Feather Dusters.

This whole time I was using API Marine test kit. I saw at most 0.25 ppm ammonia, but never Nitrite or Nitrate. I kept salinity at ~1.024 SG (per hydrometer).

It was suggested here that I put in the raw shrimp to give it a go.

On 10/16/13 I added 50 lbs of Dry Rock, and the raw shrimp. I also changed to Salifert test kits and a refractometer.

Since then my Ammonia shot up pretty quickly to 0.5 ppm - but has stayed stable there. Algae is growing more and more - but doesn't appear to be "out of control." (I don't have a CUC in there yet). My Feather Dusters have been multiplying (I have at least 8-10 scattered on the original Live Rock). I also saw a Bristle Worm at one point - haven't seen him in a couple weeks though.

On 10/21 I did get a reading of 0.025 Nitrites, and 0.35 Nitrate according to Salifert. But this is the highest I've seen it. On 10/24 I did a follow up reading, and Nitrite and Nitrate are back to 0. Ammonia still at 0.5.

The shrimp is pretty much gone by now. There's still a piece in there, but it's so light that it moves around the tank on its own (yes, it is definitely dead).

My protein skimmer is constantly skimming out pretty dark skimmate, greenish brown.

My thought is that the cycle is probably done, and the only reason I'm still seeing Ammonia is due to the still decaying shrimp. So if I take the shrimp out, and the ammonia drops to 0 - is it okay to finally add the CUC, then the fishies?

I'm just confused because I expected my Nitrates to climb - I'm not sure why they're staying at 0. I have been doing 10% water change every week.

Any feedback will be greatly appreciated!

Sincerely,
Russ

[reeferstace]

The cycle is never "done". If you have ammonia readings that means that your colonies of Nitrosomonas and Nitrobacter bacteria are not sufficiently large enough to quickly convert ammonia to nitrites to nitrates. The ammonia and nitrite readings on your test need to be 0 before you add any livestock.

Having undetectable ammonia and nitrite in your tank does not mean the cycle is complete. The nitrogen cycle is contantly occurring in our tanks because organisms are constantly metabolizing and generating cellular wastes. It's simply a matter of having sufficient bacteria to quickly convert these nitrogenous wastes to less harmful forms. It does not seem that you are to that point yet. Stop changing water and let things stabilize.

[Meanie]

remove the shrimp. I have the same issue. I left the shrimp in there and the ammonia stayed elevated. I removed the shrimp and with in a week or 2 the ammonia had dropped to 0. The nitrites and nitrates were also near zero. take out the shrimp and test a few more times. I am running pretty close to the same setup as you. I am also using the same test kits. Good luck.

[btmedic04]

your 10% weekly water changes during the cycle has probably slowed the appearance of nitrates in your tank. afterall thats the most simplest of ways to remove nitrate also the algae that you have in there is probably consuming some of it as well. remove whatever is left of the shrimp and watch for your ammonia and nitrites to drop to 0. when that happens, i think it would be safe to add a small clean up crew. just remember to monitor your ammonia, nitrites and nitrates. if things seem good for a week or two, you should be good to slowly add fish to your system.

[tanksfishtank]

It sounds like you are being responsible about your setup. Unfortunately, this hobby requires lots of patients and no amount of money makes up for the time it takes to "properly" cycle a tank. After 15 years, I am finally figuring this out. Keep up the patience and it will pay off! I agree with everyone else, take the shrimp out of the system and levels will decrease to 0 fairly quickly. Also, hold off on the water changes for a while until you get fish that will eventually start producing a natural bio load thus increasing the nitrate level. Good luck!

[AKDmax]

Same here, set it up last week, added the shrimp on Wednesday, and seeing 1.0 ammonia. Put a "fresh" shrimp in there and will let it sit until this Wednesday and take it out. After that I'll add my clean up crew and a fish or two, along with a coral. Seems like there are many variations on how to cycle as well as when it is ready for livestock. This forum is an invaluable resource though, thousands of years experience!

[RussKubes]

Hello,

Not sure if this thread is still monitored, but I need some more help.

I took the shrimp out and stopped doing water changes.

My ammonia is still at 0.4 ppm - it doesn't seem like it's dropping, and now I have Cyanobacteria growing on the back of the live rock. It's about 8 inches by 2 inches.

I'm going to cut the lights - I was trying to keep the lights on to get ready to put the CUC in.

Being that ammonia is still high, and cyano is growing, I'm going to hold off on CUC until I figure this out.

Any help will be greatly appreciated!

(I will test Nitrites and Nitrates tonight, but they were still 0 as of Sunday. Also, I don't have a phosphate testing kit - should I get one?)

[reeferstace]

Ammonia will eventually come down just give it more time. You can kill the lights to help with the cyanobacteria. I would wait until ammonia and nitrites are zero before adding a CUC. When they both reach 0 start adding livestock slowly so that you don't overload your system with ammonia. You are on the right track. Sometimes it just takes a little time.

Phosphate test kits are not really reliable for what we need. Phosphate monitors are much more precise.

[KeepNitReel]

Your still seeing ammonia readings after over a month? Wow

[RussKubes]

Thank you guys for the input. After just the day without the lights on, it looks like this went down significantly. It is not as thick of a coating, and the bubbles are confined to just on top of some of the hair algae in this spot. If this continues in a couple days it should be gone completely.

Also, I found the Bristle Worm again that's been in hiding for some time. It looks like he has actually coem out to eat some of the Cyanobacteria. Not sure if this is normal, or how much of an impact this has had.

I'm probably not going to invest into Phosphate monitor unless otherwise advised - I'm not doing corals, just FOWLR.

I will continue to monitor the other parameters in the meantime. I'm hoping to finally see this ammonia drop. It feels it took forever just to get ammonia into the tank, now it doesn't want to go away.

The skimmate from the protein skimmer has gone back to a yellowish/light brown tea color - down from a deep dark brown/dark green color. Plus the quantity per day seems down - so I'm assuming I have less DOC floating around.

[KeepNitReel]

I just don't see how people still start a cycle with raw shrimp. You can't even control the amount of ammonia a shrimp puts out. Pure ammonia will get you any level you need in 5 minutes as oppose to days or even a week or so.

5ppm of pure ammonia and a bottle of Bio spira will have a 28g tank cycled in a week.
My 10g cycled (bare bottom) in 4 days & my 160g (all dry rock) cycled in 13 days.

[Quick_Ben]

I didn't know any better at the time so I went ahead and used some bugs in a bottle (dr. tims) and some liquid pure ammonia. Had dead rock and sand too. Process worked in two weeks which I thought was normal and off I went with a CUC and two tomato clowns. Oddly enough, the nasty clowns are still with me two years later.
I think there are many methods that work to get going in this hobby. I chose something that I probably wouldn't recommend now that I'm a little better educated on this subject. But it works, so I'm thinking its probably not a bad idea to kick start a cycle, with or without LR, by adding extra bugs to get them multiplying well in a new setup. Feed an ammonia source or the stuff itself and wait. The hardest part is the waiting. Then check levels, and wait some more.

[mpeaden2]

Everything you're describing is suppose to happen. That's what a cycle is. your tank should go through the different stages to mature. Just let it happen and be patient. Water changes during cycle is the #1 reason it's taking so long for your tank to reach equilibrium. Lights on during cycle will help speed the process.