Return section level/durso pipe

Canuck007 · 02/03/2014, 07:29 PM

Hi

I just set up a 92 corner tank. It has a 1" durso pipe for the overflow.

I have a 20 gal sump with a mag 9.5 return pump that's tee off to the chiller and fuge section.

I noticed the level of the return section fluctuates about 1-2 inches in height. I noticed every 1 minute or so it will drain more into the sump (I can hear the flow increase) and then the level goes up in the return section and as the pump returns it, the level goes down. The level never seems to stay constant from 1 minute to the next.

Not sure what's going on or is this normal?

Thanks

living_waters · 02/03/2014, 09:58 PM

Sounds like your return is pumping more at certain times then others not normal.

Reefmedic79 · 02/03/2014, 10:09 PM

To me, it sounds like your pump is putting more water into the tank than the overflow can handle consistently.

Do you have ball/gate valves before or after the "T" from the return pump?

If you do, try turning down the amount of flow going into the tank to see if it helps.

Canuck007 · 02/03/2014, 10:24 PM

Thanks for the replies. My ball valve is before the tee. I think it should be after it but with the limited space and plumbing already done, I couldn't switch it now.

I did try turning the valve a bit to reduce the flow back, but it seemed to cause alot of gurgling sounds on the durso pipe and the flow back to the tank was weak.

Reefmedic79 · 02/03/2014, 10:34 PM

At very least the valve should be after the tee, as much of a pain as it may be, I suggest re-plumbing it. I would also suggest putting a valve on the chiller/fuge side of the tee as well.

That way any resistance caused by the valve will just get diverted to the chiller/fuge.

Does the top of the Durso have a small air hole in it?

gaberosenfield · 02/03/2014, 10:42 PM

Are you sure you set up your durso correctly? It sounds like you have a siphon going, emptying the overflow box, and then sucking air and breaking, letting the water rise in the overflow box again, and then restarting the siphon.

Canuck007 · 02/03/2014, 10:54 PM

Ok I'll see if I can reconfigure the plumbing and put the valve after the tee. I do have a valve going to the chiller and a valve going to the fuge.

I didn't set the durso up myself. I bought the tank that way 2nd hand. It does have a little valve on the elbow at the top. I adjusted that to reduce the gurgling sounds.

How do you break the siphon? Does it have anything to do with the outlets from the return?

Or do I need to add more water? When I do the power failure test I still have about 5 inches from the water to the top of the sump. But the water is pretty close to the top of the display tank so I wouldn't be able to add much.

Reefmedic79 · 02/03/2014, 11:02 PM

Even if you add it to the display it will still not be visible in the DT only the sump as your Durso Level will determine the water level of the display.

I would open the valve on top of the durso wide open, and slowly close it until just before it starts gurgling.

Redman88 · 02/03/2014, 11:05 PM

check your chiller, is your return section lower while the chiller is running?

Canuck007 · 02/03/2014, 11:11 PM

Reefmedic, you are absolutely right about the level of the water in the DT.

I will open up the valve and try as you suggest.

Actually the chiller is not even running yet. It's just hooked up and water is just passing through it. So really no effect on the system.

gaberosenfield · 02/03/2014, 11:37 PM

As reefmedic said, opening the air valve at the top of the durso will break the siphon. The strength of the return pump should not have any effect on a properly set up durso, so long as the pump isn't pumping more than can drain through the durso (which you would notice because water would either be coming up over the air valve on the durso and then draining loudly back down or water would be overflowing out of your DT).

Canuck007 · 02/04/2014, 10:44 AM

Opened up the air valve more and seems to have stabalized a bit more. Still some minor fluctuations in the return but I'm not seeing the sudden rise up and down and increase in draining every other minute.

I have my ball valve from my return mag pump before the tee. I think I'm going to leave it for now since I do have valves going to the chiller and fuge to control flow. I would literally have to take the whole thing apart and buy all new plumbing etc...

02/03/2014, 07:29 PM	#1
Canuck007 Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 198	Return section level/durso pipe Hi I just set up a 92 corner tank. It has a 1" durso pipe for the overflow. I have a 20 gal sump with a mag 9.5 return pump that's tee off to the chiller and fuge section. I noticed the level of the return section fluctuates about 1-2 inches in height. I noticed every 1 minute or so it will drain more into the sump (I can hear the flow increase) and then the level goes up in the return section and as the pump returns it, the level goes down. The level never seems to stay constant from 1 minute to the next. Not sure what's going on or is this normal? Thanks

02/03/2014, 10:09 PM	#3
Reefmedic79 Life and Reef Saver Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Tavares, Florida Posts: 6,202	To me, it sounds like your pump is putting more water into the tank than the overflow can handle consistently. Do you have ball/gate valves before or after the "T" from the return pump? If you do, try turning down the amount of flow going into the tank to see if it helps. __________________ ><((((º>`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸.·´¯`·...¸><((((º>¸. ·´¯`·.¸. , . .·´¯`·.. ><((((º>`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸.·´¯`·...¸><((((º> How much deeper would the ocean be if it didn't have sponges? P. Sherman 42 Wallaby Way Sid Current Tank Info: 40 Breeder, 20L Sump, 10G Fuge, JBJ A.T.O, 4" Reef Octopus, DIY Stand & Canopy, RapidLED Dimmable 36 Kit on 3 6" MakersLED Heatsink, MP10es

02/03/2014, 10:34 PM	#5
Reefmedic79 Life and Reef Saver Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Tavares, Florida Posts: 6,202	At very least the valve should be after the tee, as much of a pain as it may be, I suggest re-plumbing it. I would also suggest putting a valve on the chiller/fuge side of the tee as well. That way any resistance caused by the valve will just get diverted to the chiller/fuge. Does the top of the Durso have a small air hole in it? __________________ ><((((º>`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸.·´¯`·...¸><((((º>¸. ·´¯`·.¸. , . .·´¯`·.. ><((((º>`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸.·´¯`·...¸><((((º> How much deeper would the ocean be if it didn't have sponges? P. Sherman 42 Wallaby Way Sid Current Tank Info: 40 Breeder, 20L Sump, 10G Fuge, JBJ A.T.O, 4" Reef Octopus, DIY Stand & Canopy, RapidLED Dimmable 36 Kit on 3 6" MakersLED Heatsink, MP10es

02/03/2014, 11:02 PM	#8
Reefmedic79 Life and Reef Saver Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Tavares, Florida Posts: 6,202	Even if you add it to the display it will still not be visible in the DT only the sump as your Durso Level will determine the water level of the display. I would open the valve on top of the durso wide open, and slowly close it until just before it starts gurgling. __________________ ><((((º>`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸.·´¯`·...¸><((((º>¸. ·´¯`·.¸. , . .·´¯`·.. ><((((º>`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸.·´¯`·...¸><((((º> How much deeper would the ocean be if it didn't have sponges? P. Sherman 42 Wallaby Way Sid Current Tank Info: 40 Breeder, 20L Sump, 10G Fuge, JBJ A.T.O, 4" Reef Octopus, DIY Stand & Canopy, RapidLED Dimmable 36 Kit on 3 6" MakersLED Heatsink, MP10es

02/03/2014, 11:05 PM	#9
Redman88 Registered Member Join Date: May 2013 Location: Artesia, NM Posts: 649	check your chiller, is your return section lower while the chiller is running? __________________ -Robert- 01101000 01100101 01101100 01101100 01101111 00100000 01110111 01101111 01110010 01101100 01100100

02/03/2014, 09:58 PM	#2
living_waters Moved On Join Date: Dec 2013 Location: coral springs fl Posts: 424	Sounds like your return is pumping more at certain times then others not normal.

02/03/2014, 10:24 PM	#4
Canuck007 Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 198	Thanks for the replies. My ball valve is before the tee. I think it should be after it but with the limited space and plumbing already done, I couldn't switch it now. I did try turning the valve a bit to reduce the flow back, but it seemed to cause alot of gurgling sounds on the durso pipe and the flow back to the tank was weak.

02/03/2014, 10:42 PM	#6
gaberosenfield Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Berkeley, CA Posts: 129	Are you sure you set up your durso correctly? It sounds like you have a siphon going, emptying the overflow box, and then sucking air and breaking, letting the water rise in the overflow box again, and then restarting the siphon.

02/03/2014, 10:54 PM	#7
Canuck007 Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 198	Ok I'll see if I can reconfigure the plumbing and put the valve after the tee. I do have a valve going to the chiller and a valve going to the fuge. I didn't set the durso up myself. I bought the tank that way 2nd hand. It does have a little valve on the elbow at the top. I adjusted that to reduce the gurgling sounds. How do you break the siphon? Does it have anything to do with the outlets from the return? Or do I need to add more water? When I do the power failure test I still have about 5 inches from the water to the top of the sump. But the water is pretty close to the top of the display tank so I wouldn't be able to add much.

02/03/2014, 11:11 PM	#10
Canuck007 Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 198	Reefmedic, you are absolutely right about the level of the water in the DT. I will open up the valve and try as you suggest. Actually the chiller is not even running yet. It's just hooked up and water is just passing through it. So really no effect on the system.

02/03/2014, 11:37 PM	#11
gaberosenfield Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Berkeley, CA Posts: 129	As reefmedic said, opening the air valve at the top of the durso will break the siphon. The strength of the return pump should not have any effect on a properly set up durso, so long as the pump isn't pumping more than can drain through the durso (which you would notice because water would either be coming up over the air valve on the durso and then draining loudly back down or water would be overflowing out of your DT).

02/04/2014, 10:44 AM	#12
Canuck007 Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 198	Opened up the air valve more and seems to have stabalized a bit more. Still some minor fluctuations in the return but I'm not seeing the sudden rise up and down and increase in draining every other minute. I have my ball valve from my return mag pump before the tee. I think I'm going to leave it for now since I do have valves going to the chiller and fuge to control flow. I would literally have to take the whole thing apart and buy all new plumbing etc...