Deep Sand Bed for first tank?

dlavallee · 05/09/2015, 10:27 AM

Hi All,

I am just getting started and am currently in the research/planning phase. I am planning on going medium-large from the get-go; about 90-125 gallons with a 55 gallon refugium.

I know there are plenty of discussions out there as to whether DSBs are a good idea or a bad idea. I am not asking that here. What I am asking is, whether or not a DSB is a good idea for a beginning reefer. What I mean by DSB is one deep enough for anaerobic bacteria to accumulate for the purpose of breaking the nitrates up into nitrogen and oxygen, or having a Jaubert plenum within the DSB for the same purpose.

Any and all feedback is much appreciated!

Thanks,

Dave

hobbzz · 05/09/2015, 10:51 AM

A dsb needs to meet two minimum requirements to be effective. Is needs to have at least would square feet of surface area and be a minimum of six inches deep over the entire area. They cause problems down the road and I wouldn't recommend them to anyone unless you were doing it remotely. Carbon dosing is much easier for denitrification.

IanWR · 05/09/2015, 11:03 AM

If you're considering a jaubert plenum you are doing some out of date research. I think this hobby is still advancing relatively quickly, so what was innovative 20 years ago may already be obsolete. I doubt you would find 1 in 100 (maybe 1000?) new set ups using a plenum. I think you would see less than 1 in 50 using a DSB in the display. And some of those are to keep things like garden eels.

CStrickland · 05/09/2015, 12:03 PM

Yup. It's like all the reasons not to do it are just a little stronger when you are new. Id def back up and reconsider, but it's hard to explain why it's a bad idea for a noob without getting into why it's a plain old bad idea. I don't think they are separate questions really.

dlavallee · 05/09/2015, 02:52 PM

Thanks for the suggestions! It certainly looks like we have a consensus here..

Quote:

Originally Posted by hobbzz

Carbon dosing is much easier for denitrification.

I did some quick research, and this does look like a better way for accurate control. Thanks!

Quote:

Originally Posted by IanWR

If you're considering a jaubert plenum you are doing some out of date research.

Actually, it wasn't out of date at the time..

I had remembered that some time back, a friend of mine who owned a LFS swore by the Jaubert as he claimed his nitrates were undetectable in his 480 show tank.. What he didn't mention was the H2S hazard. I visited my LFS today and asked some questions.. The owner/operator of the store said that a DSB was little more than a "ticking time bomb."

Question: in a system where carbon dosing is employed, is there still any usefulness in having a refugium? Also, is there any reason for a noob such as myself not to have a refugium? Perhaps the extra volume, LR, and possibly raising pods for food would be good reasons?

Thanks,

Dave

CStrickland · 05/09/2015, 04:19 PM

A good skimmer is a major bonus for carbon dosing, and for that it's nice to have a sump (another box of water that's plumbed to the tank). Putting plants or extra rock or whatever can go either way, but the more clutter you have down there the harder it is to clean, which means I'd clean less. I just have my sump as a place for equipment to be out of sight. My tanks been up a few months, I don't have anything that eats pods, and my nutrients are under control so I haven't needed to put in anything beyond a filter sock, I've only got like 30# of rock in a 55 too so I woulda thought I'd be needing more, but nah. I'm kinda waiting for my tank to tell me it needs help before I add to it, like it ain't broke so why fix it.

JammyBirch · 05/09/2015, 06:19 PM

For a system that size I'm not sure why nitrates are a concern, the majority just does water changes. Some even have auto water change capability on tanks that size. Less is really more in this hobby, my opinion, seems like the more you manage the more risk you assume. I am a nano guy with sps dominant tank, I do a water change once a month right now, I've really simplified my maintenance schedule by letting my tank tell me when it needs things...like CStrickland said.

05/09/2015, 10:27 AM	#1
dlavallee Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2013 Location: Palm Harbor, Fl., USA Posts: 6	Deep Sand Bed for first tank? Hi All, I am just getting started and am currently in the research/planning phase. I am planning on going medium-large from the get-go; about 90-125 gallons with a 55 gallon refugium. I know there are plenty of discussions out there as to whether DSBs are a good idea or a bad idea. I am not asking that here. What I am asking is, whether or not a DSB is a good idea for a beginning reefer. What I mean by DSB is one deep enough for anaerobic bacteria to accumulate for the purpose of breaking the nitrates up into nitrogen and oxygen, or having a Jaubert plenum within the DSB for the same purpose. Any and all feedback is much appreciated! Thanks, Dave

05/09/2015, 10:51 AM	#2
hobbzz How do I change this? Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Wisconsin Posts: 3,037	A dsb needs to meet two minimum requirements to be effective. Is needs to have at least would square feet of surface area and be a minimum of six inches deep over the entire area. They cause problems down the road and I wouldn't recommend them to anyone unless you were doing it remotely. Carbon dosing is much easier for denitrification. __________________ 150g system. 120g reef, sro3000, Apex, Tunze 6255/6105/6095, T5 w/led supplement, 29g reef, MP10, led only.

05/09/2015, 11:03 AM	#3
IanWR Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2013 Location: SK, Canada Posts: 214	If you're considering a jaubert plenum you are doing some out of date research. I think this hobby is still advancing relatively quickly, so what was innovative 20 years ago may already be obsolete. I doubt you would find 1 in 100 (maybe 1000?) new set ups using a plenum. I think you would see less than 1 in 50 using a DSB in the display. And some of those are to keep things like garden eels. __________________ Ian

05/09/2015, 06:19 PM	#7
JammyBirch Aquaria Engineering Join Date: Mar 2014 Location: Elkland, PA Posts: 1,182	For a system that size I'm not sure why nitrates are a concern, the majority just does water changes. Some even have auto water change capability on tanks that size. Less is really more in this hobby, my opinion, seems like the more you manage the more risk you assume. I am a nano guy with sps dominant tank, I do a water change once a month right now, I've really simplified my maintenance schedule by letting my tank tell me when it needs things...like CStrickland said. __________________ 25g cube, split 10g sump with refugium, Jebao RW4, reefbreeder value Livestock adds: Osc Clowns, Royal Gramma, Pygmy Cherub Angel, Skunk Cleaner Shrimp, Serpent Brittle Star Current Tank Info: 25 gallon cube

05/09/2015, 12:03 PM	#4
CStrickland Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2015 Location: New England, U.S. Posts: 4,595	Yup. It's like all the reasons not to do it are just a little stronger when you are new. Id def back up and reconsider, but it's hard to explain why it's a bad idea for a noob without getting into why it's a plain old bad idea. I don't think they are separate questions really.

05/09/2015, 04:19 PM	#6
CStrickland Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2015 Location: New England, U.S. Posts: 4,595	A good skimmer is a major bonus for carbon dosing, and for that it's nice to have a sump (another box of water that's plumbed to the tank). Putting plants or extra rock or whatever can go either way, but the more clutter you have down there the harder it is to clean, which means I'd clean less. I just have my sump as a place for equipment to be out of sight. My tanks been up a few months, I don't have anything that eats pods, and my nutrients are under control so I haven't needed to put in anything beyond a filter sock, I've only got like 30# of rock in a 55 too so I woulda thought I'd be needing more, but nah. I'm kinda waiting for my tank to tell me it needs help before I add to it, like it ain't broke so why fix it.