Sump with or without refugium?

Kenreefer · 05/08/2016, 03:45 PM

Putting together a 125g now, water is just below the over flow box. We have 4 small fish n couple of corals lps. All of our rock n fish n sand are from a 40g. Well use the 40 to be our sump n or refugium. We want to add a few more corals n triggerfish. So far we have 150 OR classic n bio balls n piping. One year of 40g SW experience, will I ever have enough experience... so is refugium worth it or just over scienced? We like tank to be 2/3 fish n 1/3 coral oriented.
Thanks Ken

JohnnyHildo · 05/08/2016, 04:00 PM

i would probably use one if my sump had a refugium chamber but it isn't by any means necessary.
just a heads up, i would carefully consider which trigger you plan on adding if at all. i talked myself out of one because my tank was only borderline sufficient size and your coral could become a snack at any time if the fish decides.

Hentz · 05/08/2016, 04:29 PM

Yep I agree. Trigger's and Corals just don't really belong in the same sentence lol.

You don't need a refugium. Great for nutrient export, but there are many other ways to export nutrients. I myself run ZEOvit. Essentially doing the same thing as a refugium would (decreasing nitrates and phosphates), just intensified leaving me with an ultra low nutrient system. This then allows me to feed heavier and adjust the colors of my corals. I had a refugium, worked great... But I LOVE using the ZEOvit method.

davocean · 05/08/2016, 04:34 PM

A 40g has plenty of room and all you need is an extra baffle to sepperate and make fuge chamber, benefits are more than just some nurient export, pods make great food for fish, reverse light cycle helps stabilize PH.
I will always have one.

Skim · 05/08/2016, 04:39 PM

Great Video and if you watch it all, in the end even Julian admits for nutrient export you need a large Fuge. But if you are using a safe house for Critters that is a different story.

https://youtu.be/h39VK-tNK30

Kenreefer · 05/08/2016, 06:34 PM

I would use a refugium in order to help support the fish or corals. I don't think it reduces nitrates enough, not that I'm a expert. Yes I agree a refugium should be big. NOTE I also have a 55g tank I could use as a sump. Due to its high narrow build I was using the 40. With the protein skimmer the amount of room it much less.

davocean · 05/08/2016, 06:44 PM

While my use for a fuge is for what it was actually originally intended for, refuge, a safe place for pods to breed w/out predation, I'm sure I do get some nutrient export, it may not be a lot but it's one of those every little bit helps kinda things.
My sump is a 40g breeder, after sectioning off for return and skimmer/drain area it left me w/ enough open space for a 15x17x12 fuge area, plenty big enough for my needs.
I'm pulling a fair amount of chaeto out every 2-3 weeks and w/ that some nutrients are being pulled as well.
I may add a GFO reactor soon to help nutrient export, but if that is your sole purpose you may look into ATS

Kenreefer · 05/08/2016, 07:16 PM

Currently I don't have enough light for coral as it is. So getting light for a refugium seems a little crazy. I would consider setting up a spare 20g tank as a refugium but it would have to look just as nice as my coral tank. To go through all that work for a ,sorry to some of you, messy tank is just a waste of time n money. I'm watching the video above now. I have also researched aquaponics. The amount of vegetation one 75g cichlid tank could support is wild, like an acre, yap a acre. BTW my grass gets very green very fast on water change day, lol. Ok back to vid. Thanks still looking for possible refugium options

Kenreefer · 05/08/2016, 07:49 PM

Skim, Dave n Hentz, thanks for the help. Still undecided. After watching Macna. Video seems like refugium might be a bit of a distraction for me. The more I read n learn the harder it seems to get.

davocean · 05/08/2016, 08:41 PM

No sweat, do what feels right for you and your needs, and as to light a round dome shop light w/ a grow floodlamp is all that is needed, all I use, not expensive.

Ron Reefman · 05/09/2016, 08:02 AM

I run 2 systems and they each have 2 DT's and a big sump/refugium. But my feeling is, if you can't do a big refugium then it probably isn't going to do enough nutrient export.

Do what you think makes sense for you. You can always find a way to plumb in a refugium at a later time. Maybe even make it a display refugium?

Kenreefer · 05/09/2016, 10:06 AM

DT? I have a spare 20g n a 55g that needs to be resealed. What type of lighting would be required. I could just have one overflow go to each sump. With a safety overflow on the refugium sump go back to the main sump. Any ideas?

puckett26 · 05/09/2016, 02:30 PM

I ran my sump with out a fuge for a while but then I wanted a mandarin. I put one in solely for that reason. If it wasn't for my Mandarin I wouldn't have one, its just something else to monitor.

Kenreefer · 05/09/2016, 09:27 PM

Can anyone post pictures and list contents of algae etc... of a display refugium. Most of the ones I Google up are not that nice looking. Thanks Ken

05/08/2016, 03:45 PM	#1
Kenreefer Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2016 Location: NJ Posts: 77	Sump with or without refugium? Putting together a 125g now, water is just below the over flow box. We have 4 small fish n couple of corals lps. All of our rock n fish n sand are from a 40g. Well use the 40 to be our sump n or refugium. We want to add a few more corals n triggerfish. So far we have 150 OR classic n bio balls n piping. One year of 40g SW experience, will I ever have enough experience... so is refugium worth it or just over scienced? We like tank to be 2/3 fish n 1/3 coral oriented. Thanks Ken

05/08/2016, 04:00 PM	#2
JohnnyHildo Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2016 Posts: 669	i would probably use one if my sump had a refugium chamber but it isn't by any means necessary. just a heads up, i would carefully consider which trigger you plan on adding if at all. i talked myself out of one because my tank was only borderline sufficient size and your coral could become a snack at any time if the fish decides. __________________ 120G Standard - 40G Sump. Apex - DOS - ATI Current Tank Info: Acros - Zoas - Palys

05/08/2016, 04:29 PM	#3
Hentz Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2013 Location: Las Vegas, Nevada Posts: 2,016	Yep I agree. Trigger's and Corals just don't really belong in the same sentence lol. You don't need a refugium. Great for nutrient export, but there are many other ways to export nutrients. I myself run ZEOvit. Essentially doing the same thing as a refugium would (decreasing nitrates and phosphates), just intensified leaving me with an ultra low nutrient system. This then allows me to feed heavier and adjust the colors of my corals. I had a refugium, worked great... But I *LOVE* using the ZEOvit method. __________________ A Reef in the Desert: 120 Gallon (4x2x2) - MP40 x2 - Gyre 130 - ATI Sunpower - Simplicity Pump/Skimmer - Controlled by Apex

05/08/2016, 04:34 PM	#4
davocean Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: San Diego, CA Posts: 14,655	A 40g has plenty of room and all you need is an extra baffle to sepperate and make fuge chamber, benefits are more than just some nurient export, pods make great food for fish, reverse light cycle helps stabilize PH. I will always have one. __________________ There's a fine line between owning your tank and your tank owning you! Current Tank Info: SCA 120g RR Starfire, Tunze silence 1073.02 return, 40g sump w/ fuge, SWC Extreme 160 cone skimmer,Geismann reflexx 4xT5, 2x Panorama Pro LED strips, Vortech MP40QD

05/08/2016, 06:44 PM	#7
davocean Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: San Diego, CA Posts: 14,655	While my use for a fuge is for what it was actually originally intended for, refuge, a safe place for pods to breed w/out predation, I'm sure I do get some nutrient export, it may not be a lot but it's one of those every little bit helps kinda things. My sump is a 40g breeder, after sectioning off for return and skimmer/drain area it left me w/ enough open space for a 15x17x12 fuge area, plenty big enough for my needs. I'm pulling a fair amount of chaeto out every 2-3 weeks and w/ that some nutrients are being pulled as well. I may add a GFO reactor soon to help nutrient export, but if that is your sole purpose you may look into ATS __________________ There's a fine line between owning your tank and your tank owning you! Current Tank Info: SCA 120g RR Starfire, Tunze silence 1073.02 return, 40g sump w/ fuge, SWC Extreme 160 cone skimmer,Geismann reflexx 4xT5, 2x Panorama Pro LED strips, Vortech MP40QD

05/08/2016, 04:39 PM	#5
Skim Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Brantford ON. Canada Posts: 277	Great Video and if you watch it all, in the end even Julian admits for nutrient export you need a large Fuge. But if you are using a safe house for Critters that is a different story. https://youtu.be/h39VK-tNK30

05/08/2016, 06:34 PM	#6
Kenreefer Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2016 Location: NJ Posts: 77	I would use a refugium in order to help support the fish or corals. I don't think it reduces nitrates enough, not that I'm a expert. Yes I agree a refugium should be big. NOTE I also have a 55g tank I could use as a sump. Due to its high narrow build I was using the 40. With the protein skimmer the amount of room it much less.

05/08/2016, 07:16 PM	#8
Kenreefer Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2016 Location: NJ Posts: 77	Currently I don't have enough light for coral as it is. So getting light for a refugium seems a little crazy. I would consider setting up a spare 20g tank as a refugium but it would have to look just as nice as my coral tank. To go through all that work for a ,sorry to some of you, messy tank is just a waste of time n money. I'm watching the video above now. I have also researched aquaponics. The amount of vegetation one 75g cichlid tank could support is wild, like an acre, yap a acre. BTW my grass gets very green very fast on water change day, lol. Ok back to vid. Thanks still looking for possible refugium options

05/08/2016, 07:49 PM	#9
Kenreefer Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2016 Location: NJ Posts: 77	Skim, Dave n Hentz, thanks for the help. Still undecided. After watching Macna. Video seems like refugium might be a bit of a distraction for me. The more I read n learn the harder it seems to get.

05/08/2016, 08:41 PM	#10
davocean Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: San Diego, CA Posts: 14,655	No sweat, do what feels right for you and your needs, and as to light a round dome shop light w/ a grow floodlamp is all that is needed, all I use, not expensive. __________________ There's a fine line between owning your tank and your tank owning you! Current Tank Info: SCA 120g RR Starfire, Tunze silence 1073.02 return, 40g sump w/ fuge, SWC Extreme 160 cone skimmer,Geismann reflexx 4xT5, 2x Panorama Pro LED strips, Vortech MP40QD

05/09/2016, 08:02 AM	#11
Ron Reefman Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Cape Coral, FL Posts: 10,431	I run 2 systems and they each have 2 DT's and a big sump/refugium. But my feeling is, if you can't do a big refugium then it probably isn't going to do enough nutrient export. Do what you think makes sense for you. You can always find a way to plumb in a refugium at a later time. Maybe even make it a display refugium? __________________ The good thing about science is that it's true whether or not you believe in it. (Neil deGrasse Tyson) Visit my build thread http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2593017

05/09/2016, 10:06 AM	#12
Kenreefer Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2016 Location: NJ Posts: 77	DT? I have a spare 20g n a 55g that needs to be resealed. What type of lighting would be required. I could just have one overflow go to each sump. With a safety overflow on the refugium sump go back to the main sump. Any ideas?

05/09/2016, 02:30 PM	#13
puckett26 Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2015 Posts: 142	I ran my sump with out a fuge for a while but then I wanted a mandarin. I put one in solely for that reason. If it wasn't for my Mandarin I wouldn't have one, its just something else to monitor.

05/09/2016, 09:27 PM	#14
Kenreefer Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2016 Location: NJ Posts: 77	Can anyone post pictures and list contents of algae etc... of a display refugium. Most of the ones I Google up are not that nice looking. Thanks Ken