ATB using waveline DC pumps now? - Page 2

PRDubois · 05/12/2016, 12:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jjvanb

Has anyone purchased a dc powered atb skimmer and had a pump failure yet?

The answer since I took over is NO. I have had one DOA power supply and that is it.

We use the Jeaod DCT pumps not he cheaper DC pumps. Better controller, better material, better pump itself.

I replace about 5 AC pumps or impellers a month.
YES, I still carry and repair the AC pumps

The price did not drop when the Euro came down due to the fact I do not believe it rose when the Euro went up. Shipping costs from Austria are not cheap.

Two months ago I had a customer that wanted a ATB 840v2 with a Sicce pump. I told him I would ship him the skimmer with both pumps and he could just ship me back the pump he did not want in 3 weeks. He shipped me back the Sicce and kept the DCT pump.

PRDubois · 05/12/2016, 01:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr. Brooks

I hope Paul will excuse me for chiming in. The price difference between the two pumps is practically negligible. When I was importing ATB skimmers, there was significant demand for DC pumps. I believe Paul is giving the majority of his customers what they want. In regards to reliability, I actually had way more customer support issues with the askoll pumps than I did with the waveline pumps.

Thanks for the support!

gcarroll · 05/12/2016, 01:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PRDubois

The answer since I took over is NO. I have had one DOA power supply and that is it.

We use the Jeaod DCT pumps not he cheaper DC pumps. Better controller, better material, better pump itself.

I replace about 5 AC pumps or impellers a month.

Lets keep these numbers in perspective and I'm not even going to touch the comment on the quality of the Jecod but the reliability is improved.

Personally I would expect more issues with the AC pumps since there are so many more out there. The sheer volume of sales that Victor and Tom did before PRDubois and Mr Brooks took over was staggering in comparison. All those skimmers were shipped with AC pumps. I would honestly be shocked if there is any more than 5% of ATB skimmers in the US have DC pumps. The skimmers just aren't on the radar like they were before Victor got a real job and went AWOL.

FirstContact · 05/12/2016, 03:06 PM

Not sure that DC pumps have been out long enough for me to pull the trigger on a new skimmer that's running a DC pump. I like the DC pumps and have a Waveline DC12000 for return and manifold and I think it's great, but DC pumps still have a lot of development left and are just going to get better and better. SO, while I want to jump on the DC pump/protein skimmer wagon, I'm just going to wait a while longer and see what that does for R&D. Just read that Sicce is releasing 4 new (Smart) SDC pumps with wireless controller. There will be PSK versions also.

FWIW, the ATB Deluxe External is a product I have been looking at for a while!

PRDubois · 05/12/2016, 03:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FirstContact

Not sure that DC pumps have been out long enough for me to pull the trigger on a new skimmer that's running a DC pump. I like the DC pumps and have a Waveline DC12000 for return and manifold and I think it's great, but DC pumps still have a lot of development left and are just going to get better and better. SO, while I want to jump on the DC pump/protein skimmer wagon, I'm just going to wait a while longer and see what that does for R&D. Just read that Sicce is releasing 4 new (Smart) SDC pumps with wireless controller. There will be PSK versions also.

FWIW, the ATB Deluxe External is a product I have been looking at for a while!

I can still sell with AC pumps and I di have the pumps in stock, but I have not been stocking the skimmers with the AC. A external would need to be ordered, so I can get it with ether pump.

gcarroll · 05/12/2016, 04:15 PM

Taking a chance on a DC skimmer pump is not as big of a deal as going with a DC return pump. If it fails and is down for a couple days, it's no big deal. As much as I hate Jebao pumps, I would not hesitate to try one on a skimmer.

jason2459 · 05/12/2016, 07:04 PM

Agree with that but will still have a spare for the skimmer just as i have 3 mag drives as backup to each other for my return.

jason2459 · 05/12/2016, 07:04 PM

Also, looks like sicce is coming out with a DC pump. That is something ATB should jump on.

jjvanb · 05/13/2016, 04:53 PM

I was thinking today about how many other devices and electronics I have used over the years that are DC powered. There have been many.. small stereos, computer peripherals, game consoles, ect.. I have never been concerned about the durability or longevity of any of them. Perhaps Jebao has managed to put this power source in an undeserved negative light?
I have seen many people post that if they get a year or so out of their dc pump, because the cost is so low they are fine with it.. I can't think of one other mechanical or electrical product, that I have ever purchased or even considered, where I went into the purchase with this mind set.
Hopefully Jebao/Jecod will improve their product so it no longer carries this stigma, if they don't, I do think eventually someone will come out with a price competitive and more durable alternative.

PRDubois · 05/13/2016, 08:25 PM

I think most of the hate comes from the fact they came out with a variable control wavemaker that did not cost $300+each. They were also put on the market before they were tested well. There were lots of group buys when they first came out. Lots of the group buys and the ones sold on ebay were the first runs that had issues. They did have controller issues when they first came out. The power head motors had some issues with the bearings in the beginning also. Ones sold on EBAY and in the group buys did not have warranty because they were not sold by dealers. People selling them were just trying to make a buck. The big names did a lot of negative posting on the boards saying they were cheep.

jason2459 · 05/13/2016, 09:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PRDubois

I think most of the hate comes from the fact they came out with a variable control wavemaker that did not cost $300+each. They were also put on the market before they were tested well. There were lots of group buys when they first came out. Lots of the group buys and the ones sold on ebay were the first runs that had issues. They did have controller issues when they first came out. The power head motors had some issues with the bearings in the beginning also. Ones sold on EBAY and in the group buys did not have warranty because they were not sold by dealers. People selling them were just trying to make a buck. The big names did a lot of negative posting on the boards saying they were cheep.

Really? You're going to defend or ignore Jebao's business practice?

jason2459 · 05/13/2016, 09:09 PM

And like I said in the skimmer thread I'm not totally anti Jebao. Heck I'm going to be trying one out on my new skimmer. Really two out as the waveline uses the jebao block as well.

But ATB is supposed to be a step above the rest. Higher quality skimmer. Better engineered and better balanced skimmer. I've always respected ATB and their designs.

This new direction with the Jebao not so much. If I thought of the ATB as much as I thought of a bubble magus then I wouldn't give a rats behind. Heck even seaside aquatics improves the bubble magus by swapping out the crappy pump.

ATB 840v2 IMO is the best balanced cone skimmer out there. Get a pump that equals it.

PRDubois · 05/13/2016, 09:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jason2459

Really? You're going to defend or ignore Jebao's business practice?

Not defending, just answering why I thought they got a bad name. Initial wavemakers and return pumps I bought from Fishstreet were great and still work great two years later. The wavemakers I got thru a local group buy did not last 6 months. They were cheaper, but I got screwed with no warranty because some one who was not a retailer was selling them.

PRDubois · 05/13/2016, 10:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jason2459

And like I said in the skimmer thread I'm not totally anti Jebao. Heck I'm going to be trying one out on my new skimmer. Really two out as the waveline uses the jebao block as well.

But ATB is supposed to be a step above the rest. Higher quality skimmer. Better engineered and better balanced skimmer. I've always respected ATB and their designs.

This new direction with the Jebao not so much. If I thought of the ATB as much as I thought of a bubble magus then I wouldn't give a rats behind. Heck even seaside aquatics improves the bubble magus by swapping out the crappy pump.

ATB 840v2 IMO is the best balanced cone skimmer out there. Get a pump that equals it.

And FYI - I never stopped selling AC pumps. I still stock and sell them. Still repair them and sell replacement parts. If someone wants a skimmer with a AC pump they can get it. I prefer a DC pump.

jjvanb · 05/14/2016, 03:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PRDubois

Not defending, just answering why I thought they got a bad name. Initial wavemakers and return pumps I bought from Fishstreet were great and still work great two years later. The wavemakers I got thru a local group buy did not last 6 months. They were cheaper, but I got screwed with no warranty because some one who was not a retailer was selling them.

Are you saying the stuff you bought in the group buy was made differently? Or just that it didn't have a retailers warranty..?

PRDubois · 05/14/2016, 10:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jjvanb

Are you saying the stuff you bought in the group buy was made differently? Or just that it didn't have a retailers warranty..?

Yes, The original ones I bought from Fishstreet were sold with the new better bushing for the impeller. They also offered a better power supply.

05/12/2016, 03:06 PM	#29
FirstContact Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Glenn Dale, MD Posts: 1,613	Not sure that DC pumps have been out long enough for me to pull the trigger on a new skimmer that's running a DC pump. I like the DC pumps and have a Waveline DC12000 for return and manifold and I think it's great, but DC pumps still have a lot of development left and are just going to get better and better. SO, while I want to jump on the DC pump/protein skimmer wagon, I'm just going to wait a while longer and see what that does for R&D. Just read that Sicce is releasing 4 new (Smart) SDC pumps with wireless controller. There will be PSK versions also. FWIW, the ATB Deluxe External is a product I have been looking at for a while! __________________ No man is an island entire of itself; any man's death diminishes me, because I am involved in mankind; never send to know for whom the bell tolls; it tolls for thee. John Donne Current Tank Info: 120g Reef 100g Rubbermaid Sump, 20g Refugium; previous tank: 46g Drilled; Self Plumbed, Birds Nest, Anchor, Xenia, Zoas, Yuma Yuma Ricordea, Chalice, Mushrooms, Brain, Acan, Anenome Plate; Clams, Other Inverts, Fish, Live Rock

05/12/2016, 04:15 PM	#31
gcarroll Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Orange, CA Posts: 9,666	Taking a chance on a DC skimmer pump is not as big of a deal as going with a DC return pump. If it fails and is down for a couple days, it's no big deal. As much as I hate Jebao pumps, I would not hesitate to try one on a skimmer. __________________ Greg Carroll I will be at REEF-A-PALOOZA! SPS = Stability Promotes Success Be wary of advice coming from those who will not show you the fruits of their success! Current Tank Info: building: 250g AGE Euro tank, Abyzz A200, Vertex Supra-G filtration, Ecotech Radion Pro LEDs, ...

05/12/2016, 07:04 PM	#32
jason2459 Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Iowa Posts: 9,671	Agree with that but will still have a spare for the skimmer just as i have 3 mag drives as backup to each other for my return. __________________ rebuild and recovery log: No more red house, you'll have to click on my name and visit my homepage! You can check out my parameters at reeftronics dot net website and look for my username. Current Tank Info: 180g mixed reef w/ a beananimal overflow to a dolomite RRUGF. \| 20g long G. Smithii Mantis Tank

05/12/2016, 07:04 PM	#33
jason2459 Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Iowa Posts: 9,671	Also, looks like sicce is coming out with a DC pump. That is something ATB should jump on. __________________ rebuild and recovery log: No more red house, you'll have to click on my name and visit my homepage! You can check out my parameters at reeftronics dot net website and look for my username. Current Tank Info: 180g mixed reef w/ a beananimal overflow to a dolomite RRUGF. \| 20g long G. Smithii Mantis Tank

05/13/2016, 08:25 PM	#35
PRDubois Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Chester, VA Posts: 3,626	I think most of the hate comes from the fact they came out with a variable control wavemaker that did not cost $300+each. They were also put on the market before they were tested well. There were lots of group buys when they first came out. Lots of the group buys and the ones sold on ebay were the first runs that had issues. They did have controller issues when they first came out. The power head motors had some issues with the bearings in the beginning also. Ones sold on EBAY and in the group buys did not have warranty because they were not sold by dealers. People selling them were just trying to make a buck. The big names did a lot of negative posting on the boards saying they were cheep. __________________ http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2534403 Current Tank Info: 225 gal Reef, 60 gal reef & 40b frag tank

05/13/2016, 04:53 PM	#34
jjvanb Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: West Palm Beach, Florida Posts: 159	I was thinking today about how many other devices and electronics I have used over the years that are DC powered. There have been many.. small stereos, computer peripherals, game consoles, ect.. I have never been concerned about the durability or longevity of any of them. Perhaps Jebao has managed to put this power source in an undeserved negative light? I have seen many people post that if they get a year or so out of their dc pump, because the cost is so low they are fine with it.. I can't think of one other mechanical or electrical product, that I have ever purchased or even considered, where I went into the purchase with this mind set. Hopefully Jebao/Jecod will improve their product so it no longer carries this stigma, if they don't, I do think eventually someone will come out with a price competitive and more durable alternative.

05/13/2016, 09:09 PM	#37
jason2459 Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Iowa Posts: 9,671	And like I said in the skimmer thread I'm not totally anti Jebao. Heck I'm going to be trying one out on my new skimmer. Really two out as the waveline uses the jebao block as well. But ATB is supposed to be a step above the rest. Higher quality skimmer. Better engineered and better balanced skimmer. I've always respected ATB and their designs. This new direction with the Jebao not so much. If I thought of the ATB as much as I thought of a bubble magus then I wouldn't give a rats behind. Heck even seaside aquatics improves the bubble magus by swapping out the crappy pump. ATB 840v2 IMO is the best balanced cone skimmer out there. Get a pump that equals it. __________________ rebuild and recovery log: No more red house, you'll have to click on my name and visit my homepage! You can check out my parameters at reeftronics dot net website and look for my username. Current Tank Info: 180g mixed reef w/ a beananimal overflow to a dolomite RRUGF. \| 20g long G. Smithii Mantis Tank