Auto Top Off Dilemma

[naynesh]

So I now acquired an auto top off, nothing fancy but still averagely priced

The unit has 3 sensors - 2 for the tank (one to detect low water and one for emergency overflow) and 1 for the reservoir (pump dry run cut off)

My dilemma or problem is as follows:

I placed the RO water pipe in the display tank, reason for this is that the display tank gives accurate drop in water. The sump sometimes fluctuates so I’ve gone for placing the sensor in the display tank.

My problem is that if water stops pumping from sump to display tank, the ATU (auto to up) will continue to pump RO water in the display tank. Eventually depleting the RO reservoir and flooding the sump and surrounding area.

I will still have same problem If I placed the sensor in the sump and have the RO line wired to the sump then if there’s a block in the down pipe to the sump, the return pump will keep pumping water to display meaning the ATU will kick in continually and flooding the display tank.

So what do other people do to overcome this?

Appreciate your help.

[mcgyvr]

The display tank (with a sump/overflow) should NEVER...NEVER change based on evaporation..
If it does your system is messed up and needs to be fixed..
Plain and simple..
The only thing to overcome is why your system is broke

Put the sensor back into the return pump section of the sump and correct whatever issues are causing your system to work improperly..

[jacksonpt]

1. the water level in your display shouldn't change with evaporation. It should only change if it's being drained (intentionally or otherwise).
2. if your drain line plugs, your sump will run dry and/or your display will overflow. those seem like bigger concerns than an ATO-cause flood.
3. one of the safety measures some people use is a relatively small ATO container - don't keep so much water on hand that disaster could strike if a sensor stick or pump malfunctions.

[naynesh]

mcgyvr - Mcgyvr – Thanks, ok maybe a flaw in my system but its been like this for years and years. Yes I can put the senor back in the sump where return pump is..

But still have the problem if, return pipe is blocked, then its only going to keep filling the display tank with RO?


jacksonpt - Thanks, sump has 3 baffles, overflow from display, refugium (cheato) and the return pump to display tank. without the ATU the system my tank will never flood. cause the last baffle of water is only small and wont flood display.. and return pipe from the disaplay is high up so only small amount of water will hit the sump capable of handling the water.

i thought about adding an additional emaergency overflow to display tank and feed it off outside or empty container...

just wondered what everyone else does?

[mcgyvr]

Originally Posted by naynesh

But still have the problem if, return pipe is blocked, then its only going to keep filling the display tank with RO?

Sensor goes in the return pump section of the sump..
So does the RO tube..

Use the ATO properly and there is nothing to overcome..

[naynesh]

Originally Posted by mcgyvr

Sensor goes in the return pump section of the sump..
So does the RO tube..

Use the ATO properly and there is nothing to overcome..

ok have ATO setup as prescribed... still have the issue with display tank overfilling if return pipe is blocked? the ATU will keep topping the last chamber and return pump pumping the water to display... ?

[jacksonpt]

Originally Posted by mcgyvr

Sensor goes in the return pump section of the sump..
So does the RO tube..

Use the ATO properly and there is nothing to overcome..

Agreed.

[jacksonpt]

Originally Posted by naynesh

ok have ATO setup as prescribed... still have the issue with display tank overfilling if return pipe is blocked? the ATU will keep topping the last chamber and return pump pumping the water to display... ?

Why? You said the return section is small. If the drain line plugs, the return will pump only the water in the return section, plus whatever water the ATO pumps. Keep a small amount of ATO water on hand and it's not an issue. Use an outlet time so the ATO can only run at certain times of the day or for limited periods of time.

Bigger picture, figure out ways to deal with a plugged drain line.

[naynesh]

Originally Posted by jacksonpt

Why? You said the return section is small. If the drain line plugs, the return will pump only the water in the return section, plus whatever water the ATO pumps. Keep a small amount of ATO water on hand and it's not an issue. Use an outlet time so the ATO can only run at certain times of the day or for limited periods of time.

Bigger picture, figure out ways to deal with a plugged drain line.

yes return section is small... the ato will continue to fill this section from the reservoir. Im talking about 100 litre reservoir.

Your right, maybe should only keep reservoir small..

[mcgyvr]

One extra layer of protection in an ATO system is to ensure that even if the entire ATO reservoir drains it doesn't cause the tank to overflow..
It also can't cause too large of a salinity swing..

Downside is you need to refill it more often.
A sensor in the ATO tank can be beneficial to refill it automatically.. BUT..he system needs to have enough intelligence to limit the amount of water or times it gets refilled over a set period of time...

[tkeracer619]

Please post pictures of how you have the drain setup. The drain should never clog!

[naynesh]

Originally Posted by tkeracer619

Please post pictures of how you have the drain setup. The drain should never clog!

Here's a picture attached, (not recent so excuse the cleanness)
one down pipe to the sump with strainer, the other pipe to the left is the return and goes along to the other end of the tank.

think we drifting away from the question...

yes, very unlikely it will get clogged, i was hypothetically speaking..

just trying to eliminate any disasters when adding a ATU,,, if down pipe was to get blocked, the return pump will continue pumping water, the ATU sensor will keep stating no water in the last chamber and keep adding RO... so nothing to eliminate this scenario

[homer1475]

A decent ATO will alert you when it fills more then its regular filling.



The Tunze ATO if running for inordinate times will stop filling and send out an audible alert saying so. It will not continue to fill until it is restarted.



Again also is to limit the amount of water in your ATO reservoir so this cannot happen. I keep 5 gallons for my top off, I can easily pump the entire volume into my tank and the only thing it will do is to raise my sump volume. I can get by on my 90 for a week with 5 gallons of top off.



Plan your system around mishaps happening, not trying to prevent every way they can happen. Because lets face it, Murphy's law is definitely in effect with reef tanks.

[LQT]

Just troubleshooting here... Can we get a photo of your overflow box / plumbing? Do you have a prefilter sponge over one of the drains or something? Unless you have stuck snail or obstruction, I’m thinking that maybe you have a clogged prefilter sponge preventing the overflow from draining properly, hence causing the DT water level to rise.

[lapin]

I have a remote fuge that has only 1 drain pipe. ( ya I know) If it clogs it could overflow and my ATO would pump water until it runs dry. To overcome the way I had to plumb this, I added a sensor that tells my controller to turn off the flow if it gets too high. The water flows thru a normally open solenoid. When too high it shuts the water off.
Not that this will help you but its an idea.