Deltec or Euroreef Which is better?? - Page 2

DaveG99 · 05/08/2006, 05:08 PM

I think this is like asking....Ford or Chevy

sjm817 · 05/08/2006, 05:09 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DeltecRules
The mce600 is a protein sucking machine, there is no need for a skim box. I didn't have one with a remora pro but it kept my water crystal clear. The deltec is the same way.

What about all the posts in the Deltec forum of the surface slick problems? A surface skimming add on would make it a better product.

DeltecRules · 05/08/2006, 05:14 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by sjm817
What about all the posts in the Deltec forum of the surface slick problems? A surface skimming add on would make it a better product.

How come I am not having this problem then? I know many mce600 users who have run this skimmer without griping about an overflow box, if the skimmer is set up correctly (without user error) then there should be no oil slick. The skimmer is powerful enough not to have an over flow box. Deltec has been making skimmers for 20 years don't you think they would have thought of this if there a performance issue?

sjm817 · 05/08/2006, 05:18 PM

Dont know why you dont have the problem. Others do. What exactly are the users doing wrong? I'm just a firm believer in surface skimming. My AP600 wont keep the slick off the surface of my 90G without the overflow surface skimming either. Same idea.

DeltecRules · 05/08/2006, 05:29 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by sjm817
Dont know why you dont have the problem. Others do. What exactly are the users doing wrong? I'm just a firm believer in surface skimming. My AP600 wont keep the slick off the surface of my 90G without the overflow surface skimming either. Same idea.

I have an overflow too leading to a sump. I also run a maxijet 1200 and a rio 800 establishing enough flow in the tank to avoid any surface skum. The skimmer is powerful enough to suck up the protein before it hits the surface. I skim wet though, maybe the others are skimming dry, (2 o'clock setting) which doesn't suck up the protein as fast as wet skimming. I do agree nothing wrong with deltec making a overflow box ca't hurt the performance, but for some of us oil slick doesn't exist. By the way I am looking into buying a ap600 down the road, how do you like yours?

Charlie Davidson · 05/08/2006, 06:07 PM

more like ---- ford vs FERRARI!!! (btw,euroreef is a very fine skimmer! deltec, is just plain better)

UCanDoIt · 05/08/2006, 06:10 PM

Have you thought about H&S, similar performance to Deltec. Uses the same exact German pumps. Just another alternative. PM sent, check you PM inbox.

sjm817 · 05/08/2006, 06:17 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DeltecRules
I have an overflow too leading to a sump. I also run a maxijet 1200 and a rio 800 establishing enough flow in the tank to avoid any surface skum. The skimmer is powerful enough to suck up the protein before it hits the surface. I skim wet though, maybe the others are skimming dry, (2 o'clock setting) which doesn't suck up the protein as fast as wet skimming. I do agree nothing wrong with deltec making a overflow box ca't hurt the performance, but for some of us oil slick doesn't exist. By the way I am looking into buying a ap600 down the road, how do you like yours?

That makes sense. The overflow is doing the surface skimming. That is probably why you dont have a surface slick.

The AP600 is a nice skimmer. I have it direct fed off the overflow

Fliger · 05/08/2006, 06:19 PM

I don't know anything about the MC line, but I did have problems with the MCE. Its not so much user error, its just not a skimmer that is right for every setup. The Detec Turbo line looks nice. I'd also second UCanDoIt, H&S performs the same and at least here in the US - they are less expensive for the comparable Deltec skimmer. They also have internal models for even less money, and I believe that they are introducing at least one new model at Interzoo. I think one is a HOB style.

MattG · 05/12/2006, 03:07 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DeltecRules
I still can't figure out why people have problems with this skimmer, its the same pump used on the ap600. I know from time to time there might be a defect with the pump, but I would have to say its mostly user error, adding additives to the tank, low salinity, to much tinkering, very low bioload, stuffing the carbon chamber with a huge bag of carbon or other media which would cause back pressure. So saying this mce600 has issues I would say otherwise.

I couldnt agree less with the above comment about user error. I have used two mce600's now and neither produced much of anything for me. Im pretty sure i know how to use a skimmer. Aquariums are what i do to pay the bills right now but hey maybe i just have no clue how to adjust/setup a skimmer.....

And to stick to the topic of the thread i have been MUCH happier with the Euroreefs i have used then the deltec. To be fair though the MCE600 is the only product in the deltec lineup that i have used.

UCanDoIt · 05/12/2006, 04:41 PM

If you look at the Deltec USA forum, the Deltec MCE600 is the only skimmer that has the most questions on how to adjust. It is the only skimmer that members experience some sort of problem and asking how to solve. Of course, not all members experience this, but enough. My experience is the MCE600 is NOT representative of the quality that Deltec produces in all their other skimmers. I'm very bias towards recirculating skimmers, so I love Deltec's external skimmers and they can do NO WRONG. Of course, this is just my bias opinion. BTW, I do own a H&S skimmer too and it is right up there with Deltec.

dirtyreefer · 05/22/2006, 12:26 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by DeltecRules
I have an overflow too leading to a sump.

Duuuh, no doubt that's the reason why you have no oil slick. I don't know how many posts you've made defending the MCE600 and how you don't get an oil slick (probably hundreds), but this is the first I've heard of you having an overflow to a sump. The majority of people who own an MCE600 buy it b/c they don't have a sump, and therefore are having this problem.

I'm tired of your stupid skimmate pics and blaming others saying it's a user error just because their MCE600 isn't working.

DeltecRules · 05/22/2006, 01:19 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by dirtyreefer
Duuuh, no doubt that's the reason why you have no oil slick. I don't know how many posts you've made defending the MCE600 and how you don't get an oil slick (probably hundreds), but this is the first I've heard of you having an overflow to a sump. The majority of people who own an MCE600 buy it b/c they don't have a sump, and therefore are having this problem.

I'm tired of your stupid skimmate pics and blaming others saying it's a user error just because their MCE600 isn't working.

This skimmer was running on a 35 hexagon without a sump, no overflow, with 40 pounds of live rock, 6 fish and SPS before it went on my 55 gallon with sump. And there were no oil slicks on the 35 gallon hex. The hexagon had no sump and therefor NO OIL SLICK!! And yes I still believe its user error, I read too many people keep on adjusting the skimmer because they had no idea how to adjust it to there bioload. And yes I will keep on flashing pics of my skimate shots and defend the mce600 because it works!!! If you don't like it, tough!!

Scott

jlehrer · 05/22/2006, 08:38 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by DeltecRules
This skimmer was running on a 35 hexagon without a sump, no overflow, with 40 pounds of live rock, 6 fish and SPS before it went on my 55 gallon with sump. And there were no oil slicks on the 35 gallon hex. The hexagon had no sump and therefor NO OIL SLICK!! And yes I still believe its user error, I read too many people keep on adjusting the skimmer because they had no idea how to adjust it to there bioload. And yes I will keep on flashing pics of my skimate shots and defend the mce600 because it works!!! If you don't like it, tough!!

Scott

The oil slick problem is jokingly easy to fix. Proteins accumulate at the air/water interface. They always do. Anthony Calfo had an enormous skimmer production improvement thread about it. If you want to get rid of an oil slick, you need either an overflow, or enough flow at the surface of the aquarium to force the proteins back into the rest of the water, namely with a pump angled a littled toward the surface. Many hobbyists don't have enough flow at the surface and thus have an oil slick. Is that the hobbyists fault? Perhaps yes. But some hobbyists avoid that because if you put a pump so close to the surface, you risk the vortex effect and sucking in tons of bubbles, that not only distract from the tank, but almost make annoying amounts of noise and can irritate some corals.

But this is also blatantly, stupidly obvious to anyone building an HOB skimmer. Should Deltec have included a small, adjustable surface skimmer box for the 500 bucks they're charging for their product? God damn yes. Heck, even if it was a 20 dollar add-on. its just basic. Even Doug said Wolfgang might be working on one soon after enough people got angry about it.

Calling every MCE600 problem a user error is also equally ridiculous. Check the forums here, check the forums at ultimatereef, some people are having problems. God knows I did.

I took the skimmer, I washed it in dilute vinegar, I hooked it up according to the instructions, I put it on the side of the tank, made sure the collection cup was high, and turned it on. I had microbubbles. I waited a month. I still had microbubbles. I posted about it in the deltec forum. I was told it must be something in the water and to do lots of water changes. I did them. Btw, before that all I'd ever added to my water was instant ocean salt at 1.026 (checked with a lab-calibrated refractometer). Alk, Calcium and magnesium were all perfect, thanks to my reactor (salifert-checked). I still had tons of microbubbles. I only feed hikari mysis shrimp and cyclopeez, but changed food types. I still had microbubbles. I called Doug. Doug told me to reduce water changes to once a month this time! I did so. I had also tried the air tap at every different position. I still had them. I even tried running it with ozone. The rocks in this tank had been 'cooked' for three months, so there wasn't anything bizarre leeching from the rocks.

Remember, there is practically nothing to adjust in this skimmer other than the air tap and collection cup height. There really isn't.

So deltecrules, what was my user error, hmmm? You seem to have all the answers, go ahead, tell me.

I finally got so frustrated I tore down the tank and added an overflow and sump. My deltec MCE600 is now hanging off my sump. My sump is only 5x flow with 4 baffles and a mag 250 return pump, so the microbubbles have enough time to dissipate. I don't have an oil slick because of the overflow. But then, I didn't before. The Deltec still hasnt pulled out anything more than my old ASM g2 did, or even any more than my coralife superskimmer 125. It works, but man, 500 bucks for, well, essentially the same performance I had before and more microbubbles... I don't really consider it an upgrade anymore.

Is the MCe600 the best hang-on? I still say yes. Its better than the bakpak and remora that I used before, because both barely pulled out crap with their default pumps. Is it well built? Hell yes, every seam is solid, and its maintenance is relatively easy. But do some of them have non-user related issues? Bloody hell yes too, and while deltecrules can continue to chant otherwise, many people will tell you differently.

IMHO, the deltec AP series is wonderful. I have heard a total of one complain. The MC series as well. But if you're considering the deltec MCE600, be warned, you may not get the wonderful deltec experience you expect from such a high price. If I had to pick between euro-ref and deltec, I'd still go for the deltec, but only the AP series.

I just wish I hadn't blown over 500 bucks listening to deltecrules now. What a fool I was.

dirtyreefer · 05/22/2006, 10:02 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by DeltecRules
And yes I will keep on flashing pics of my skimate shots and defend the mce600 because it works!!! If you don't like it, tough!!

How gay

Whatever there RemoraRules, or was it DeltecRules, or will it soon to be H&SRules since I see you Posting about puchasing one of these. You go buddy!

unmc2001 · 05/22/2006, 10:56 AM

I put an MC500 on my 58 gallon with 20 gallon sump to replace my remora pro and I couldn't be happier with this skimmer. I like the fact that it has no plumbing required. I also like it over the MCE600 because I can adjust the water level in the skimmer as well as the air intake. I don't think the MCE600 has a water level adjustment on it. This thing is so compact I have plenty of room in my sump for other things.

05/08/2006, 05:18 PM	#29
sjm817 On Yer left! Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Northern VA Posts: 18,777	Dont know why you dont have the problem. Others do. What exactly are the users doing wrong? I'm just a firm believer in surface skimming. My AP600 wont keep the slick off the surface of my 90G without the overflow surface skimming either. Same idea. __________________ - Scott

05/08/2006, 06:07 PM	#31
Charlie Davidson Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Deltaville , Va Posts: 10,977	more like ---- ford vs FERRARI!!! (btw,euroreef is a very fine skimmer! deltec, is just plain better) __________________ Richmond Reef Club Current Tank Info: Doing without for a while :)

05/08/2006, 06:19 PM	#34
Fliger Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Chandler, AZ Posts: 8,642	I don't know anything about the MC line, but I did have problems with the MCE. Its not so much user error, its just not a skimmer that is right for every setup. The Detec Turbo line looks nice. I'd also second UCanDoIt, H&S performs the same and at least here in the US - they are less expensive for the comparable Deltec skimmer. They also have internal models for even less money, and I believe that they are introducing at least one new model at Interzoo. I think one is a HOB style. __________________ Growing old is mandatory, growing up is optional. Closed minds should come with closed mouths. When life hands you lemons, add vodka! Current Tank Info: Current: 210G Elos System, 2x400W + 6x54W Photon w/Aquaconnects, H&S skimmer, Deltec FR509/ROWAphos+Elos Carbon, 6101's and 6201's, Ocean GEOtronic 900 Chiller/Heater, Biotopus II Controller w/SMS. Elos System 70.

05/08/2006, 05:08 PM	#26
DaveG99 Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Forney Texas Posts: 1,597	I think this is like asking....Ford or Chevy

05/08/2006, 06:10 PM	#32
UCanDoIt Moved On Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Bay Area CA Posts: 1,684	Have you thought about H&S, similar performance to Deltec. Uses the same exact German pumps. Just another alternative. PM sent, check you PM inbox.

05/12/2006, 04:41 PM	#36
UCanDoIt Moved On Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Bay Area CA Posts: 1,684	If you look at the Deltec USA forum, the Deltec MCE600 is the only skimmer that has the most questions on how to adjust. It is the only skimmer that members experience some sort of problem and asking how to solve. Of course, not all members experience this, but enough. My experience is the MCE600 is NOT representative of the quality that Deltec produces in all their other skimmers. I'm very bias towards recirculating skimmers, so I love Deltec's external skimmers and they can do NO WRONG. Of course, this is just my bias opinion. BTW, I do own a H&S skimmer too and it is right up there with Deltec.

05/22/2006, 10:56 AM	#41
unmc2001 Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Madison, WI Posts: 301	I put an MC500 on my 58 gallon with 20 gallon sump to replace my remora pro and I couldn't be happier with this skimmer. I like the fact that it has no plumbing required. I also like it over the MCE600 because I can adjust the water level in the skimmer as well as the air intake. I don't think the MCE600 has a water level adjustment on it. This thing is so compact I have plenty of room in my sump for other things.