How Many Have Air Stone Skimmers? - Page 2

Saltz Creep · 09/08/2005, 08:56 PM

I think most (possibly novice) reefers are unaware that a well-designed counter current air skimmer has SUPERIOR skimming ability even over ASM/Euroreef skimmers. It's only the maintenance (airstones) and space requirements that have caused these skimmers to lose popularity in this hobby over time.

boxfishpooalot · 09/08/2005, 09:39 PM

here is my airstone skimmer(wood and needle wheel) its my first diy thing that worked

CaptiveReef · 09/09/2005, 06:01 AM

dgasmd,

What a skimmer! You are going to need a manifold of at least 6 diffusers to produce enough bubbles for that height and diameter. And a monster air pump.
Send some pics of that monster in action!!!!!

CaptiveReef

CaptiveReef · 09/09/2005, 06:05 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Saltz Creep
I think most (possibly novice) reefers are unaware that a well-designed counter current air skimmer has SUPERIOR skimming ability even over ASM/Euroreef skimmers. It's only the maintenance (airstones) and space requirements that have caused these skimmers to lose popularity in this hobby over time.

I couldn't have said it any better, old school is great!!!!!

CaptiveReef

reefrubble · 09/09/2005, 08:42 AM

I think with the new air pumps,and diffusers these skimmers are going to make a big come back. Ted

aubee91 · 09/09/2005, 08:47 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by dgasmd

I recently had a cusotm CC air stone skimmer made for me with 12" diameter, wet neck, and it is about 7' tall. Have not hooked it up to the system yet, so I can't tell you first hand experience. It also has a wet neck to reduce maintenance even more.

If I may ask a potentially dumb question...what is a wet neck?

jimbo045 · 09/09/2005, 10:05 AM

In the old days I had a 4" PVC type, that I made and it did not work as well as those Venturi ones that most people buy. JD

stash98 · 09/09/2005, 10:23 AM

so ae you guys saying I should use an AES from aquatic eco (the sweetwater diffusers) to replace my limewood one that comes with my sanders skimmer?

they will last a lot longer and are more efficient? would love to know because aqua eco is 20 miles from my house.

Ramble On Rose · 09/09/2005, 10:28 AM

I am running the sweetwater airstones with an airtech 40 pump. I have to say I am not very happy with it. In fact I just got 2 ocean runner pumps to build a I recirculating needlewheel and run that against the airstone skimmer. The airstone works good when it works, but it requires a lot of attention to keep it running smoothly. Maybe someone with more experience could dial it in prefectly, but for a rookie - its not going good.

Saltz Creep · 09/09/2005, 11:57 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by aubee91
If I may ask a potentially dumb question...what is a wet neck?

It's like a redneck except...well, not really.

Actually it's a the use of constantly running water down the inside neck of the skimmer to help keep sludge from accumulating. Supposedly this enhances skimmer performance.

aubee91 · 09/09/2005, 12:41 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Saltz Creep
It's like a redneck except...well, not really.

Actually it's a the use of constantly running water down the inside neck of the skimmer to help keep sludge from accumulating. Supposedly this enhances skimmer performance.

Cool. Thanks, Saltz.

CaptiveReef · 09/10/2005, 07:22 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by stash98
so ae you guys saying I should use an AES from aquatic eco (the sweetwater diffusers) to replace my limewood one that comes with my sanders skimmer?

they will last a lot longer and are more efficient? would love to know because aqua eco is 20 miles from my house.

I would love to live 20 miles from AES, THE SHOPPING I WOULD DO!!!!!!!!!!!!!! They have a great catalog!!!!

CaptiveReef

stash98 · 09/10/2005, 12:35 PM

yea, it rocks..so I am thinking I should go there and buy their sweetwater airstones, even though they aren't limewood..they will do a better job right?

reefrubble · 09/10/2005, 12:50 PM

If it was me ,thats what I would do,but I can't speak for any one but me.

Mr Bojangles · 09/10/2005, 01:00 PM

well the main prob with the CC skimmers is there size and the atention needed for them. The best ones are 6 feet tall and they dont fit under a tank, also you need to tune them weekly sometimes and it can take a month to understand how they work the best, but once you get it up and running you cant beet them

Nanook · 09/13/2005, 09:51 PM

Alberto,

Have you seen these Japanese ceramic airstones yet:

http://www.koicarp.net/air_products/...airstones.html

The 50mmx150mm looks like it would be the one to incorporate. Have you picked out airstones yet, if so, which ones?

Also, do you think an airpump like the linear piston pumps by Sweetwater would power several of these? I am trying to figure this out a little and wanted to know where you stand in the learning curve.

Thanks,

dave

dgasmd · 09/14/2005, 07:31 AM

Dave:

I had seen other stones similar to those you linked, although I am not entirely sure if it is exactly the very same ones. I am planning to get the aquatic ecosystem fine pore ceramic stones below.

AES AS300

According to the tech at AES, each one of those stones can handle up to 1 CFM of air. I am thinking 4 or maybe 5 of them. The air pump I have in mind is a linear air pump from AES too. It is the one below.

SL170

According to the AES guy, that pump should be able to "blow" or push 6 CFM at 2.6 PSI, which is the equivalent to 6' deep. I can always bleed out some air rather than using the one pump below this one that can push 3.5 CFM at the same depth.

Keep in mind that for my system, 1000g SPS only with very light fish load, this skimmer is way overkill. However, if you notice the cylindrical chamber is made of 2 sections, so I can always get one out and see if it does the trick without the extra height. I will most likely just run it as is now as there are some proteins that require unusually long time to be skimmed out. Plus it will help oxygenation witht he longer contact time. My best guess, and that is all it is, is that I could run the same skimmer with ony 3 stones and feed it 600 gph and get just as good results.

More than anything at this point, what I want to know is what realistic difference will the wetneck make to the entire thing. Simpler maintenance is what I have in mind.

kbmdale · 09/14/2005, 07:41 AM

My DIY counter current skimmer is only 3ft tall 4" pipe, uses 3 wood airstones that I rotate changing one a month and gets water from a small 500gph pump I had laying around. The air pumps I am usung come from wal-mart and cost If I remember correctly 13.00 a peice. The rubber parts that wear out on the air pump can be replaced for 1.50, and ussually needs to be done once a year.

So 20.00 worth of pipe, 26.00 for air pump, 5.00 for 3 lees wood air stones, and an old 40.00 pump and I get smelly black gunk to annoy my wife with....Well worth the money

seriously though I have never run anything but a CC skimmer. I originally built the one I run now just for a temp till I could find a nice skimmer I liked. Turns out I already had a nice skimmer and never got another.

Nanook · 09/14/2005, 09:50 PM

I was looking at these pumps:

http://www.aquaticeco.com/index.cfm/.../6579/cid/1769

Also, how often do those airstones need to be cleaned? Do you think they will clog quickly causing the performance of the skimmer to fluctuate too much? I am interested in the airstone skimmer, but a little skeptical still.

Thanks,

Dave

Nanook · 09/14/2005, 09:52 PM

Also, this paragraph from Aquatic Ecosystems Website about the airstones kind of scares me:

SweetwaterÃ‚Â® fine-pore diffusers do require higher pressure (about 5" H2O more) and more frequent cleaning than our regular pore diffusers, so they are not typically recommended for regular aeration. The bubble uniformity is excellent.

dgasmd · 09/15/2005, 04:09 AM

Nanook:

The pump you ahve a link for is good too and would be my first choice if I wanted to run less stones. I believe they told they are a tiny bit loder though than the others.

As far as the stones, their cleaning schedule is supposed to be every 2 years! So, even if you go to half the schedule and you do it once per year or even once every 6 months it is easy as heck. You submerge the stone in a weak acid solution for 30 min. and rinse.

I know mojoreef has them and he has had the skimmer for about a year. He told me he cleaned them at about 6 months to see how much difference it made, and I believe he called it a waste of time as they were clean as a whistle.

bergzy · 09/15/2005, 09:35 AM

dgasmd,

which air pump of the above are you planning on running with your cc? i am planning a pretty large cc as well and would like to size the equipment accordingly.

thanks!

stevedola · 09/15/2005, 11:04 AM

dgasmd and others,
Im very interested in building my own CC skimmer and seeing how it performs next to my reef devil-im sure (after all your comments it will out perform). Do any of you have blue prints to a good CC skimmer? Ive got about 110 total gallons of water and think that 4-5 ft would be a good size for my tank. Do you have to use expensive pumps like linked above or can you use less expensive models?

Avast Marine · 05/29/2006, 10:25 AM

Any updates or finished builds with "new" airstones or pumps?

09/08/2005, 09:39 PM	#27
boxfishpooalot Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: canada, Grande Praire, Ab Posts: 5,824	here is my airstone skimmer(wood and needle wheel) its my first diy thing that worked __________________ Its a good idea to have a refrence sample for alk test kits. 1.1350 grams of baking soda in 1gallon of distilled water=10dkh. Check your alkalinity test kit! Algae is Mother Natures phosphate remover Current Tank Info: 220 galon mixed reef.

09/09/2005, 06:01 AM	#28
CaptiveReef LED FULL SPECTRUM REEFER Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Long Island Posts: 1,148	Skimmers dgasmd, What a skimmer! You are going to need a manifold of at least 6 diffusers to produce enough bubbles for that height and diameter. And a monster air pump. Send some pics of that monster in action!!!!! CaptiveReef __________________ Okay I'm a Reef Fanatic !!!!! Current Tank Info: 120 Reef, DIY 5ft. protein skimmer, LED lighting.

09/09/2005, 08:42 AM	#30
reefrubble Premium Member Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Fort Myers , Fl. Posts: 5,718	I think with the new air pumps,and diffusers these skimmers are going to make a big come back. Ted __________________ Ted Proud member of SHARK (Spring Hill Area Reef Keepers ) Proud member of TBRC (Tampa Bay Reef Club ) Save the reefs , Grow your own Current Tank Info: Marineland 300 DD Tank Custom metal stand , and canopy DIY LED lighting I-Tech Super Beast skimmer . I do not have a tank at this time . I sold the 300 Gal. system

09/10/2005, 12:50 PM	#39
reefrubble Premium Member Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Fort Myers , Fl. Posts: 5,718	If it was me ,thats what I would do,but I can't speak for any one but me. __________________ Ted Proud member of SHARK (Spring Hill Area Reef Keepers ) Proud member of TBRC (Tampa Bay Reef Club ) Save the reefs , Grow your own Current Tank Info: Marineland 300 DD Tank Custom metal stand , and canopy DIY LED lighting I-Tech Super Beast skimmer . I do not have a tank at this time . I sold the 300 Gal. system

09/13/2005, 09:51 PM	#41
Nanook Ancient Eskimo Legend Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Saint Louis, MO Posts: 41,852 Blog Entries: 11	Alberto, Have you seen these Japanese ceramic airstones yet: http://www.koicarp.net/air_products/...airstones.html The 50mmx150mm looks like it would be the one to incorporate. Have you picked out airstones yet, if so, which ones? Also, do you think an airpump like the linear piston pumps by Sweetwater would power several of these? I am trying to figure this out a little and wanted to know where you stand in the learning curve. Thanks, dave __________________ The wind blew, the chit flew, and then they came two by two. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Current Tank Info: 375g Tanganyikan Tank & 470g mixed reef

09/08/2005, 08:56 PM	#26
Saltz Creep Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Hickville, FL Posts: 3,728	I think most (possibly novice) reefers are unaware that a well-designed counter current air skimmer has SUPERIOR skimming ability even over ASM/Euroreef skimmers. It's only the maintenance (airstones) and space requirements that have caused these skimmers to lose popularity in this hobby over time.

09/09/2005, 10:05 AM	#32
jimbo045 Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Aiea, HI. Posts: 1,788	In the old days I had a 4" PVC type, that I made and it did not work as well as those Venturi ones that most people buy. JD

09/09/2005, 10:23 AM	#33
stash98 Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 230	so ae you guys saying I should use an AES from aquatic eco (the sweetwater diffusers) to replace my limewood one that comes with my sanders skimmer? they will last a lot longer and are more efficient? would love to know because aqua eco is 20 miles from my house.

09/09/2005, 10:28 AM	#34
Ramble On Rose Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Chicago area Posts: 1,461	I am running the sweetwater airstones with an airtech 40 pump. I have to say I am not very happy with it. In fact I just got 2 ocean runner pumps to build a I recirculating needlewheel and run that against the airstone skimmer. The airstone works good when it works, but it requires a lot of attention to keep it running smoothly. Maybe someone with more experience could dial it in prefectly, but for a rookie - its not going good.

09/10/2005, 12:35 PM	#38
stash98 Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 230	yea, it rocks..so I am thinking I should go there and buy their sweetwater airstones, even though they aren't limewood..they will do a better job right?

09/10/2005, 01:00 PM	#40
Mr Bojangles Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Brevard county, Fl Posts: 914	well the main prob with the CC skimmers is there size and the atention needed for them. The best ones are 6 feet tall and they dont fit under a tank, also you need to tune them weekly sometimes and it can take a month to understand how they work the best, but once you get it up and running you cant beet them

09/14/2005, 07:31 AM	#42
dgasmd Registered Member Join Date: Dec 1999 Location: US Posts: 3,402	Dave: I had seen other stones similar to those you linked, although I am not entirely sure if it is exactly the very same ones. I am planning to get the aquatic ecosystem fine pore ceramic stones below. AES AS300 According to the tech at AES, each one of those stones can handle up to 1 CFM of air. I am thinking 4 or maybe 5 of them. The air pump I have in mind is a linear air pump from AES too. It is the one below. SL170 According to the AES guy, that pump should be able to "blow" or push 6 CFM at 2.6 PSI, which is the equivalent to 6' deep. I can always bleed out some air rather than using the one pump below this one that can push 3.5 CFM at the same depth. Keep in mind that for my system, 1000g SPS only with very light fish load, this skimmer is way overkill. However, if you notice the cylindrical chamber is made of 2 sections, so I can always get one out and see if it does the trick without the extra height. I will most likely just run it as is now as there are some proteins that require unusually long time to be skimmed out. Plus it will help oxygenation witht he longer contact time. My best guess, and that is all it is, is that I could run the same skimmer with ony 3 stones and feed it 600 gph and get just as good results. More than anything at this point, what I want to know is what realistic difference will the wetneck make to the entire thing. Simpler maintenance is what I have in mind. __________________ Arguing with ignorant people is an exercise in futility. They will bring you down to their level and once there they will beat you with their overwhelming experience. Current Tank Info: Currently out of the hobby, but considering a Comeback V 2.1!

09/14/2005, 07:41 AM	#43
kbmdale Moved On Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: fayetteville, TN Posts: 2,604	My DIY counter current skimmer is only 3ft tall 4" pipe, uses 3 wood airstones that I rotate changing one a month and gets water from a small 500gph pump I had laying around. The air pumps I am usung come from wal-mart and cost If I remember correctly 13.00 a peice. The rubber parts that wear out on the air pump can be replaced for 1.50, and ussually needs to be done once a year. So 20.00 worth of pipe, 26.00 for air pump, 5.00 for 3 lees wood air stones, and an old 40.00 pump and I get smelly black gunk to annoy my wife with....Well worth the money seriously though I have never run anything but a CC skimmer. I originally built the one I run now just for a temp till I could find a nice skimmer I liked. Turns out I already had a nice skimmer and never got another.

09/14/2005, 09:50 PM	#44
Nanook Ancient Eskimo Legend Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Saint Louis, MO Posts: 41,852 Blog Entries: 11	I was looking at these pumps: http://www.aquaticeco.com/index.cfm/.../6579/cid/1769 Also, how often do those airstones need to be cleaned? Do you think they will clog quickly causing the performance of the skimmer to fluctuate too much? I am interested in the airstone skimmer, but a little skeptical still. Thanks, Dave __________________ The wind blew, the chit flew, and then they came two by two. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Current Tank Info: 375g Tanganyikan Tank & 470g mixed reef

09/14/2005, 09:52 PM	#45
Nanook Ancient Eskimo Legend Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Saint Louis, MO Posts: 41,852 Blog Entries: 11	Also, this paragraph from Aquatic Ecosystems Website about the airstones kind of scares me: SweetwaterÃ‚Â® fine-pore diffusers do require higher pressure (about 5" H2O more) and more frequent cleaning than our regular pore diffusers, so they are not typically recommended for regular aeration. The bubble uniformity is excellent. __________________ The wind blew, the chit flew, and then they came two by two. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Current Tank Info: 375g Tanganyikan Tank & 470g mixed reef

09/15/2005, 04:09 AM	#46
dgasmd Registered Member Join Date: Dec 1999 Location: US Posts: 3,402	Nanook: The pump you ahve a link for is good too and would be my first choice if I wanted to run less stones. I believe they told they are a tiny bit loder though than the others. As far as the stones, their cleaning schedule is supposed to be every 2 years! So, even if you go to half the schedule and you do it once per year or even once every 6 months it is easy as heck. You submerge the stone in a weak acid solution for 30 min. and rinse. I know mojoreef has them and he has had the skimmer for about a year. He told me he cleaned them at about 6 months to see how much difference it made, and I believe he called it a waste of time as they were clean as a whistle. __________________ Arguing with ignorant people is an exercise in futility. They will bring you down to their level and once there they will beat you with their overwhelming experience. Current Tank Info: Currently out of the hobby, but considering a Comeback V 2.1!

09/15/2005, 09:35 AM	#47
bergzy Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: OC CA USA Posts: 5,299	dgasmd, which air pump of the above are you planning on running with your cc? i am planning a pretty large cc as well and would like to size the equipment accordingly. thanks! __________________ The urge to save humanity is almost always a false front for the urge to rule it. H.L. Mencken Ben. Current Tank Info: 180g sps, 90g cube clam biotope.

09/15/2005, 11:04 AM	#48
stevedola Master of my domain Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Rhode Island Posts: 3,466	dgasmd and others, Im very interested in building my own CC skimmer and seeing how it performs next to my reef devil-im sure (after all your comments it will out perform). Do any of you have blue prints to a good CC skimmer? Ive got about 110 total gallons of water and think that 4-5 ft would be a good size for my tank. Do you have to use expensive pumps like linked above or can you use less expensive models? __________________ Cool Club Current Tank Info: coming soon...

05/29/2006, 10:25 AM	#49
Avast Marine RC Sponsor Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Northern VA Posts: 2,446	Any updates or finished builds with "new" airstones or pumps? __________________ Dan Don't rush art, you get bad art.