To sand or not to sand

hugabone · 07/07/2006, 05:46 PM

I was considering doing a new setup with a dsb of about 4". It will be a reef tank but I read it has to be maintained properly. I heard a dsb is very beneficial but a pain at the same time. What is involved in maintaining a dsb? Should I go almost BB?

bertoni · 07/07/2006, 06:24 PM

A thin layer of sand, maybe 1", is easier to set up and cheaper, as well. There are also lots of animals that shouldn't go into a tank with a deep sand bed. There's a thread on substrate choices that I wrote a while back that discusses the issues:

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/sh...hreadid=803688

AZDesertRat · 07/07/2006, 06:48 PM

It comes down to personal preference. What do you like and want. I have had both sucessfully and now have only DSBs. I hate the bare bottom look (in a tank that is) and consider a shallow bed a detritus trap. The best maintenance for a DSB is leave it alone and let the bacteria do their thing. Don't add fish and critters that dig huge holes or eat all the pods and worms like sand sifting stars and some larger conchs. My present 100G is 2.5 years old now and no problems.

hugabone · 07/07/2006, 06:53 PM

Thanks, I might go with a shallow sand base.

thor32766 · 07/07/2006, 08:11 PM

yeah preference is just what it is. i have about a 3inch sand bed on my 220

sherm71tank · 07/07/2006, 08:32 PM

And I would advise against a sand bed. I had nothing but problems with mine ( hair algae ) . I went BB About a year ago and no hair algae. If you are planning on keeping animals that need the sand or just want the look then that answers the question but maintenance is so much easier without the sand and my tank has been much more stable as a BB.

AZDesertRat · 07/07/2006, 08:47 PM

What maintence is required with a DSB? Mine hasn't needed any attention in 2.5 years. In a 55 you might be right as there is marginal surface area to have a beneficial DSB. The larger the surface area the better they function, so the larger the tank the easier they are to keep. Don't disturb it, overfeed it or add detrimental critters and its no problems or maintenance at all. I hated having to vacuum my barebottom reef out all the time and it looked unsightly if I didn't.

sherm71tank · 07/07/2006, 08:55 PM

I had hair algae problems that would not go away no matter how many water changes I did. I was running a becket skimmer way over rated for my tank and stopped feeding my animals for the most part. I'm not saying a DSB can't be done and I'm not here to bash them. You had better do your homework on them before hand though. I don't have to vacuum my tank as there is ample flow. There is more than one way to skin a cat. I support the BB method. To me it is just much easier.

PelagicMagic · 07/07/2006, 09:06 PM

I am with AZDesertRat, DSB are best left alone. They create a natural look for your reef . Just remember that the BB DSB debate is based on personal preference. If you are having Hair algae problems it has nothing to do with your sand bed. Are you making your own RO/DI water? If so you should use a TDS meter to check your filters. I had the same problem a few months ago. The only problem with a DSB is that you might have problems with in 5-6 years because the sand bed will start leaching junk back into the tank such as nitrates and phosphates which will require a total sand bed replacement. I use a 4" deep DSB and its doing great, I only use Carribsea seeded with a few lbs of livesand. Having a DSB also requires less LR to fill your tank

PelagicMagic · 07/07/2006, 09:08 PM

you can also go BB and have a DSB in your sump- Best of both worlds

sherm71tank · 07/07/2006, 09:16 PM

Yeah I used RO/DI water. It took my DSB less than 5-6 years to saturate and start leaking. More like 3 years. Anyhow I like the BB method better to each his own. Good luck with wich ever method you choose.

PelagicMagic · 07/07/2006, 09:36 PM

did you test the water coming out of your ro/di with a TDS meter everytime you made water? I was doing a few WC without testing and I had a hair algae outbreak. I couldnt figure it out until I got a TDS meter. It turned out that the bucket I was mixing water in needed a cleaning. I was getting around 46 on the TDS pen and 0 out of the RO/DI. I started cleaning out my container and never had a problem with hair algae again

sherm71tank · 07/07/2006, 10:41 PM

No I didn't and still don't test it except maybe every 3 batches. The water going in was fine then and is still fine now. I just didn't do well with the sand bed.

R33f3r · 07/08/2006, 07:17 AM

The ha can easily from the saturated po4 that is embedded in the rocks. It can take months to years for it to be removed. I like the bb look with starboard myself. I ran many successful sandbeds for years but I find the bb to be less trouble in the longrun. Just be sure to cook your rock before you go bb!

07/07/2006, 05:46 PM	#1
hugabone Premium Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: MD Posts: 68	To sand or not to sand I was considering doing a new setup with a dsb of about 4". It will be a reef tank but I read it has to be maintained properly. I heard a dsb is very beneficial but a pain at the same time. What is involved in maintaining a dsb? Should I go almost BB?

07/07/2006, 06:24 PM	#2
bertoni RC Mod Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Mountain View, CA, USA Posts: 88,616	A thin layer of sand, maybe 1", is easier to set up and cheaper, as well. There are also lots of animals that shouldn't go into a tank with a deep sand bed. There's a thread on substrate choices that I wrote a while back that discusses the issues: http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/sh...hreadid=803688 __________________ Jonathan Bertoni

07/07/2006, 08:11 PM	#5
thor32766 Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Chuluota, FL Posts: 6,072	yeah preference is just what it is. i have about a 3inch sand bed on my 220 __________________ "Live your life so no one has to lie about who you were at your funeral" click on my red house to see my tang compound! Current Tank Info: 29 gallon in Wall!

07/08/2006, 07:17 AM	#14
R33f3r Anemones Anonymous Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: 29.763N:95.363W Posts: 3,114	The ha can easily from the saturated po4 that is embedded in the rocks. It can take months to years for it to be removed. I like the bb look with starboard myself. I ran many successful sandbeds for years but I find the bb to be less trouble in the longrun. Just be sure to cook your rock before you go bb! __________________ Member of the starboard cult.

07/07/2006, 06:48 PM	#3
AZDesertRat Moved On Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: NW Phoenix Posts: 16,621	It comes down to personal preference. What do you like and want. I have had both sucessfully and now have only DSBs. I hate the bare bottom look (in a tank that is) and consider a shallow bed a detritus trap. The best maintenance for a DSB is leave it alone and let the bacteria do their thing. Don't add fish and critters that dig huge holes or eat all the pods and worms like sand sifting stars and some larger conchs. My present 100G is 2.5 years old now and no problems.

07/07/2006, 06:53 PM	#4
hugabone Premium Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: MD Posts: 68	Thanks, I might go with a shallow sand base.

07/07/2006, 08:32 PM	#6
sherm71tank Premium Member Join Date: Nov 2003 Posts: 3,670	And I would advise against a sand bed. I had nothing but problems with mine ( hair algae ) . I went BB About a year ago and no hair algae. If you are planning on keeping animals that need the sand or just want the look then that answers the question but maintenance is so much easier without the sand and my tank has been much more stable as a BB.

07/07/2006, 08:47 PM	#7
AZDesertRat Moved On Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: NW Phoenix Posts: 16,621	What maintence is required with a DSB? Mine hasn't needed any attention in 2.5 years. In a 55 you might be right as there is marginal surface area to have a beneficial DSB. The larger the surface area the better they function, so the larger the tank the easier they are to keep. Don't disturb it, overfeed it or add detrimental critters and its no problems or maintenance at all. I hated having to vacuum my barebottom reef out all the time and it looked unsightly if I didn't.

07/07/2006, 08:55 PM	#8
sherm71tank Premium Member Join Date: Nov 2003 Posts: 3,670	I had hair algae problems that would not go away no matter how many water changes I did. I was running a becket skimmer way over rated for my tank and stopped feeding my animals for the most part. I'm not saying a DSB can't be done and I'm not here to bash them. You had better do your homework on them before hand though. I don't have to vacuum my tank as there is ample flow. There is more than one way to skin a cat. I support the BB method. To me it is just much easier.

07/07/2006, 09:06 PM	#9
PelagicMagic Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 1,671	I am with AZDesertRat, DSB are best left alone. They create a natural look for your reef . Just remember that the BB DSB debate is based on personal preference. If you are having Hair algae problems it has nothing to do with your sand bed. Are you making your own RO/DI water? If so you should use a TDS meter to check your filters. I had the same problem a few months ago. The only problem with a DSB is that you might have problems with in 5-6 years because the sand bed will start leaching junk back into the tank such as nitrates and phosphates which will require a total sand bed replacement. I use a 4" deep DSB and its doing great, I only use Carribsea seeded with a few lbs of livesand. Having a DSB also requires less LR to fill your tank

07/07/2006, 09:08 PM	#10
PelagicMagic Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 1,671	you can also go BB and have a DSB in your sump- Best of both worlds

07/07/2006, 09:16 PM	#11
sherm71tank Premium Member Join Date: Nov 2003 Posts: 3,670	Yeah I used RO/DI water. It took my DSB less than 5-6 years to saturate and start leaking. More like 3 years. Anyhow I like the BB method better to each his own. Good luck with wich ever method you choose.

07/07/2006, 09:36 PM	#12
PelagicMagic Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 1,671	did you test the water coming out of your ro/di with a TDS meter everytime you made water? I was doing a few WC without testing and I had a hair algae outbreak. I couldnt figure it out until I got a TDS meter. It turned out that the bucket I was mixing water in needed a cleaning. I was getting around 46 on the TDS pen and 0 out of the RO/DI. I started cleaning out my container and never had a problem with hair algae again

07/07/2006, 10:41 PM	#13
sherm71tank Premium Member Join Date: Nov 2003 Posts: 3,670	No I didn't and still don't test it except maybe every 3 batches. The water going in was fine then and is still fine now. I just didn't do well with the sand bed.