Octopus Pro 300.... got a sneak peek! - Page 2

sdietz2469 · 05/17/2008, 11:05 AM

any idea on the rating of these skimmers?
shane

sdietz2469 · 05/18/2008, 08:45 AM

come on guys.... i was hoping someone could get some specs for me....
shane

sdietz2469 · 05/19/2008, 09:18 AM

i take it no one really knows.... i have been reading about the ops-250's and they seem to have lots of problems.... have they cured this with the new ops-300?
shane

hahnmeister · 05/21/2008, 05:41 PM

The pump is based on the ATB pump's specs I believe. Dave at CV couldnt get the 900 motor to work (I can...lol), and the 1500 has some advantages anyways. Anyways, he also doesnt want shenzhen-honya taking the design and reselling it to everyone else under the sun (like the MSX's, which are about to run out, and were actually Dave's design which honya sold to marine solutions), so the skimmers are being made with someone else more trustworthy, and then he doesnt have to buy them by the 20' container either.

The 1500 motorblock can do 2280lph AS A NEEDLEWHEEL with how ATB mods it. It can actually go higher (the motor is rated at 100 watts... its just a matter of how much of that power you want to use).

luke33 · 05/21/2008, 06:37 PM

Jon, thats incorrect info about dave and msx and all that fwiw, but i don't want to go into that on this thread. Feel free to pm or email me about it if you would like.

hahnmeister · 05/22/2008, 01:01 AM

(post PM), it seems both sets of facts that we have heard are true... as in, they dont contradict each other. They are just two different sets of information about the same thing. The word is that the MSX's are not being made anymore.

I mean, the only part you say isnt true is about 'who came up with the MSX design first' and 'that MSX's are going adios'... well...

Otherwise, everything about the 900s vs. the 1500s, and CV not trusting Honya with the design is true, and him not having to order a 20' container of skimmers is true as well.

Heck, I could argue that I came up with that MSX design before any of them...lol. I was going to get Shan at ORCA to make something like it... so similar that when I saw it my jaw hit the floor... but I was planning on recirculating the motor (just like on the external octo pros where the inlet is 't'ed into the pump inlet from above with the pump on its side), and having a compression adapter (drain adapter) on the drainpipe so its telescoping rather than valve controlled... thats about it. Otherwise the 'split-bubbleplate'... dang... I was showing Shan diagrams of it right when the first pics of the MSX came out of how to make the bubble plate open up like that... I couldnt believe it when I saw it. But anyways, back to the point... I think the 'he said she said' could be clarified by simply finding out if what I heard about the MSX's is true... that they arent being made anymore. I seem to bemember seeing some info about that on the boards even a while ago.

kdblove_99 · 05/22/2008, 01:44 AM

what? I have never heard that about them not being made anymore, Why is that?

JRaquatics · 05/22/2008, 09:41 AM

I got the 900 motor to work when I had the prototype. It was inconsistences in the design of the volute that caused most of problems in the Octo 250 pro. The prototype Octo Pro is still running without any problems to this day and pulling 45 scfh at 30-34 watts with no startup or directional issues.

Dave at CV wanted to use sicces back when BM first came out and was recommended not to that there were better more reliable pumps to use for his line of skimmers.

luke33 · 05/22/2008, 10:41 AM

Jon, this rumor has been going on for mnths. Even if honya were to stop selling the msx line to swc, would it really matter? Do you not think theres someone else who could make it over in china? There's 1.5billion people over there, but only one company can make a skimmer : ) Regardless, let them worry about that instead of throwing more rumors in another thread which has nothing to do with the msx line.

hahnmeister · 05/22/2008, 05:14 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by luke33
Jon, this rumor has been going on for mnths. Even if honya were to stop selling the msx line to swc, would it really matter? Do you not think theres someone else who could make it over in china? There's 1.5billion people over there, but only one company can make a skimmer : ) Regardless, let them worry about that instead of throwing more rumors in another thread which has nothing to do with the msx line.

But what pump then? If Dave is the new exclusive dealer for Sicce in the USA... is MSX going to switch to hydors or something?

hahnmeister · 05/22/2008, 05:21 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by JRaquatics
I got the 900 motor to work when I had the prototype. It was inconsistences in the design of the volute that caused most of problems in the Octo 250 pro. The prototype Octo Pro is still running without any problems to this day and pulling 45 scfh at 30-34 watts with no startup or directional issues.

Dave at CV wanted to use sicces back when BM first came out and was recommended not to that there were better more reliable pumps to use for his line of skimmers.

I found that the models I saw were relying on the impellers too much to make the air... so they had startup problems, among other things. If you bore the volute out more in diameter, the air goes up and is rather reliable, and the water throughput goes down. I was able to get it to work in the end, even with the radial output and all... but the outlet on the pump needs to be larger than you might expect... about 1".

I think I finally figured out why I hate Sicces so much though. The stock impeller for water allows them to start up the same direction... if they start up in reverse, the impeller will sputter because the resistance on the impeller isnt what is expected... so the motor will sputter unless it spins in the right direction from the start. The impeller itself is the means by which the impeller starts in the same direction every time... as in, the pump is INTENDED to sputter easily to correct itself. So I did some startup tests on the PSK with Mesh by opening up the volute and running it underwater. It starts up in either direction, which when you look at the outlet on the volute... it is supposed to be unidirectional. OOPS! In the process of 'mesh modding' the pumps lose their unidirectional ability and can start in either direction, which both lends to their 'sputtering' and their varied results for output.

Jayson · 05/22/2008, 05:33 PM

Hanh seeing as how you do not reply in the other thread you post on i will put it hear as well.

Hanh I have already told you if you want facts get in touch with me. Stop spreading rumors. First of all Martin does not make the skimmer for MS. I import them. I then sell them to MS and other stores. I just received my bill of lading/ invoice for more Sicce pumps today! There goes that rumor! How many factories in china do you think there are that do acrylic work? How many factories do you think I buy from? As far as the SWC Xtreme skimmers, another shipment is on the way. There goes that rumor!Get in touch with me to get some facts! Thanks

__________________

chrisncarol · 05/22/2008, 06:17 PM

Man, and i thought game development was filled with intrigue .... lol

Their only skimmers............. the world will rotate with or without them

USC-fan · 05/22/2008, 06:37 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Jayson
Hanh seeing as how you do not reply in the other thread you post on i will put it hear as well.

Hanh I have already told you if you want facts get in touch with me. Stop spreading rumors. First of all Martin does not make the skimmer for MS. I import them. I then sell them to MS and other stores. I just received my bill of lading/ invoice for more Sicce pumps today! There goes that rumor! How many factories in china do you think there are that do acrylic work? How many factories do you think I buy from? As far as the SWC Xtreme skimmers, another shipment is on the way. There goes that rumor!Get in touch with me to get some facts! Thanks

__________________

Well that is good news!

clevengergl · 05/22/2008, 06:44 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by chrisncarol
Their only skimmers............. the world will rotate with or without them

Maybe, but a world without skimmers sure would put a damper on your skimmer manufacturing business, Chris!

chrisncarol · 05/22/2008, 06:56 PM

Lol muhahaha, ya know what i mean

chrisncarol · 05/22/2008, 06:58 PM

hahnmeister

The 900's and Sicces can run reliably but around 35scfh on pins that is...............

tang_man_montreal · 05/23/2008, 12:14 PM

Wow, this thread's been going on while I was away...

I went by C&C Marine again today to see how their development is going on this skimmer...

Take a look at this!

Looks like a conservative rating for this skimmer will be about 300gallons. This thing is nuts!

sjm817 · 05/23/2008, 03:03 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by hahnmeister
It starts up in either direction, which when you look at the outlet on the volute... it is supposed to be unidirectional. OOPS!

Please explain. I dont see anything that is uni-directional about the volute.

hahnmeister · 05/23/2008, 03:55 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by sjm817
Please explain. I dont see anything that is uni-directional about the volute.

Well, its not as biased as say, the Lagunas, but if you look at the outlet on the Sicces, its not symetrical. Its made for a counterclockwise spin (inlet facing). So if your meshwheel doesnt spin that way... then what? Thats why I never got as much as some others with one of mine... the way I modded it actually results in the impeller spinning clockwise almost every time.

sjm817 · 05/23/2008, 04:27 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by hahnmeister
Well, its not as biased as say, the Lagunas, but if you look at the outlet on the Sicces, its not symetrical. Its made for a counterclockwise spin (inlet facing). So if your meshwheel doesnt spin that way... then what? Thats why I never got as much as some others with one of mine... the way I modded it actually results in the impeller spinning clockwise almost every time.

I've never noticed this. I'll take a good look at the pump tomorrow and post what I see.

JCTewks · 05/23/2008, 11:37 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by tang_man_montreal
Wow, this thread's been going on while I was away...

I went by C&C Marine again today to see how their development is going on this skimmer...

Take a look at this!

Looks like a conservative rating for this skimmer will be about 300gallons. This thing is nuts!

IMO, 60scfh on an 8" body is NOT enough to skim a 300g tank if you are at a med bioload and are expecting your skimmer to keep up with feedings and the associated poop that comes with feeding.

It's nice to see they've surpassed the 50scfh mark with the new pump....that 56 scfh is getting close to the max air with reliable startup out of a 1500 with a NW.

luke33 · 05/23/2008, 11:55 PM

Jeff, i'd agree with you as far as thats the best your going to get with the 1500 as a pinwheel. try mesh and you got 75-80. Only thing i would change is the 8" body. It s to small imo. 60scfh should be 10". Its still a great looking skimmer. Now whats the price......

hahnmeister · 05/24/2008, 12:00 AM

An 8" diameter body can handle 2000lph... its just a matter of how much water is going along with that air. If the air/water ratio is 3:1 or higher, then no, 2000lph is too much. But if the air/water ratio is lower, and turbulence is minimized with a bubble plate, like 2:1, then I dont see a problem... actually I see advantages. Its really not that much more than say... a BK200deluxe.

luke33 · 05/24/2008, 12:10 AM

I'm not saying a 8" body can't handle it, but wouldn't a larger body provide a better dwell time and larger capabilities. As in able to handle a 300g tank. I'm not bashing these skimmers at all, but a larger body would be nice imo.

05/17/2008, 11:05 AM	#26
sdietz2469 stickhead n chalice freak Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Milwaukie, OR 97267 Posts: 529	any idea on the rating of these skimmers? shane __________________ King Of Aquatico Island corals are like crack, but more expensive, and you cant OD on them.... Current Tank Info: 300DD sps dominant, ATB Med ext w/airstar 4-6105s, apex, geo 618 CaRx, PM 620 kalk, 500 gal total water. Check out my build thread http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2116897

05/18/2008, 08:45 AM	#27
sdietz2469 stickhead n chalice freak Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Milwaukie, OR 97267 Posts: 529	come on guys.... i was hoping someone could get some specs for me.... shane __________________ King Of Aquatico Island corals are like crack, but more expensive, and you cant OD on them.... Current Tank Info: 300DD sps dominant, ATB Med ext w/airstar 4-6105s, apex, geo 618 CaRx, PM 620 kalk, 500 gal total water. Check out my build thread http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2116897

05/19/2008, 09:18 AM	#28
sdietz2469 stickhead n chalice freak Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Milwaukie, OR 97267 Posts: 529	i take it no one really knows.... i have been reading about the ops-250's and they seem to have lots of problems.... have they cured this with the new ops-300? shane __________________ King Of Aquatico Island corals are like crack, but more expensive, and you cant OD on them.... Current Tank Info: 300DD sps dominant, ATB Med ext w/airstar 4-6105s, apex, geo 618 CaRx, PM 620 kalk, 500 gal total water. Check out my build thread http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2116897

05/23/2008, 12:14 PM	#43
tang_man_montreal Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Montreal, QC, Canada Posts: 1,265	Wow, this thread's been going on while I was away... I went by C&C Marine again today to see how their development is going on this skimmer... Take a look at this! Looks like a conservative rating for this skimmer will be about 300gallons. This thing is nuts! __________________ Some people are like Slinkies... not really good for anything, but you still can't help but smile when you see one tumble down the stairs. Current Tank Info: Currently tankless. New project in the works.

05/21/2008, 05:41 PM	#29
hahnmeister Moved On Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Brew City, WI Posts: 10,156	The pump is based on the ATB pump's specs I believe. Dave at CV couldnt get the 900 motor to work (I can...lol), and the 1500 has some advantages anyways. Anyways, he also doesnt want shenzhen-honya taking the design and reselling it to everyone else under the sun (like the MSX's, which are about to run out, and were actually Dave's design which honya sold to marine solutions), so the skimmers are being made with someone else more trustworthy, and then he doesnt have to buy them by the 20' container either. The 1500 motorblock can do 2280lph AS A NEEDLEWHEEL with how ATB mods it. It can actually go higher (the motor is rated at 100 watts... its just a matter of how much of that power you want to use).

05/21/2008, 06:37 PM	#30
luke33 Moved On Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Indiana Posts: 8,375	Jon, thats incorrect info about dave and msx and all that fwiw, but i don't want to go into that on this thread. Feel free to pm or email me about it if you would like.

05/22/2008, 01:01 AM	#31
hahnmeister Moved On Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Brew City, WI Posts: 10,156	(post PM), it seems both sets of facts that we have heard are true... as in, they dont contradict each other. They are just two different sets of information about the same thing. The word is that the MSX's are not being made anymore. I mean, the only part you say isnt true is about 'who came up with the MSX design first' and 'that MSX's are going adios'... well... Otherwise, everything about the 900s vs. the 1500s, and CV not trusting Honya with the design is true, and him not having to order a 20' container of skimmers is true as well. Heck, I could argue that I came up with that MSX design before any of them...lol. I was going to get Shan at ORCA to make something like it... so similar that when I saw it my jaw hit the floor... but I was planning on recirculating the motor (just like on the external octo pros where the inlet is 't'ed into the pump inlet from above with the pump on its side), and having a compression adapter (drain adapter) on the drainpipe so its telescoping rather than valve controlled... thats about it. Otherwise the 'split-bubbleplate'... dang... I was showing Shan diagrams of it right when the first pics of the MSX came out of how to make the bubble plate open up like that... I couldnt believe it when I saw it. But anyways, back to the point... I think the 'he said she said' could be clarified by simply finding out if what I heard about the MSX's is true... that they arent being made anymore. I seem to bemember seeing some info about that on the boards even a while ago.

05/22/2008, 01:44 AM	#32
kdblove_99 Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Frederick,CO Posts: 8,683	what? I have never heard that about them not being made anymore, Why is that?

05/22/2008, 09:41 AM	#33
JRaquatics Awaiting Email Confirmation Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: On RC Posts: 3,609	I got the 900 motor to work when I had the prototype. It was inconsistences in the design of the volute that caused most of problems in the Octo 250 pro. The prototype Octo Pro is still running without any problems to this day and pulling 45 scfh at 30-34 watts with no startup or directional issues. Dave at CV wanted to use sicces back when BM first came out and was recommended not to that there were better more reliable pumps to use for his line of skimmers.

05/22/2008, 10:41 AM	#34
luke33 Moved On Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Indiana Posts: 8,375	Jon, this rumor has been going on for mnths. Even if honya were to stop selling the msx line to swc, would it really matter? Do you not think theres someone else who could make it over in china? There's 1.5billion people over there, but only one company can make a skimmer : ) Regardless, let them worry about that instead of throwing more rumors in another thread which has nothing to do with the msx line.

05/22/2008, 05:33 PM	#37
Jayson Moved On Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Canada Posts: 159	Hanh seeing as how you do not reply in the other thread you post on i will put it hear as well. Hanh I have already told you if you want facts get in touch with me. Stop spreading rumors. First of all Martin does not make the skimmer for MS. I import them. I then sell them to MS and other stores. I just received my bill of lading/ invoice for more Sicce pumps today! There goes that rumor! How many factories in china do you think there are that do acrylic work? How many factories do you think I buy from? As far as the SWC Xtreme skimmers, another shipment is on the way. There goes that rumor!Get in touch with me to get some facts! Thanks __________________

05/22/2008, 06:17 PM	#38
chrisncarol Moved On Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Montreal Posts: 91	Man, and i thought game development was filled with intrigue .... lol Their only skimmers............. the world will rotate with or without them

05/22/2008, 06:56 PM	#41
chrisncarol Moved On Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Montreal Posts: 91	Lol muhahaha, ya know what i mean

05/22/2008, 06:58 PM	#42
chrisncarol Moved On Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Montreal Posts: 91	hahnmeister The 900's and Sicces can run reliably but around 35scfh on pins that is...............

05/23/2008, 11:55 PM	#48
luke33 Moved On Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Indiana Posts: 8,375	Jeff, i'd agree with you as far as thats the best your going to get with the 1500 as a pinwheel. try mesh and you got 75-80. Only thing i would change is the 8" body. It s to small imo. 60scfh should be 10". Its still a great looking skimmer. Now whats the price......

05/24/2008, 12:00 AM	#49
hahnmeister Moved On Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Brew City, WI Posts: 10,156	An 8" diameter body can handle 2000lph... its just a matter of how much water is going along with that air. If the air/water ratio is 3:1 or higher, then no, 2000lph is too much. But if the air/water ratio is lower, and turbulence is minimized with a bubble plate, like 2:1, then I dont see a problem... actually I see advantages. Its really not that much more than say... a BK200deluxe.

05/24/2008, 12:10 AM	#50
luke33 Moved On Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Indiana Posts: 8,375	I'm not saying a 8" body can't handle it, but wouldn't a larger body provide a better dwell time and larger capabilities. As in able to handle a 300g tank. I'm not bashing these skimmers at all, but a larger body would be nice imo.