Aren't Amphipods/Copepods NOT supposed to eat Zoanthids?

saltman123 · 11/19/2008, 02:55 AM

I always thought people said that amphipods didn't eat zoanthids, and only hung around them. Well, I have to say that I have watched a little team of amphipods actually eating some yellow polyps.

A shell had about 3 or 4 polyps on it, and mysteriously there is only one left. I snapped a picture of the shell a few days ago with a copepod hanging out.

Tonight, I can see them hanging around the last one's base.

Guess another few days will tell the truth if the last polyp is missing.

Anyone ever experience amphipods actually eating zoanthids?

briangg57 · 11/19/2008, 06:44 AM

They say that they eat only dying matter which means something is wrong and your zoo's are dying and the pods are cleaning up. BUT I have to say that I'm not so sure about that because I had some nice eagle eye zoos and every night when I turned out the light, my stomach churned as I watched them eat every one of them. My water parameters were great and everything else in my tank was fine. So like I said, I don't know for sure but I have my doubts that they never eat them just for the heck of it. Good luck with yours, Brian

DevilBoy · 11/19/2008, 07:14 AM

If i remember correctly, just to be sure you may want to get in contact with Flyguyyy but i believe there is some species of pods that do solely eat zoas. I may be wrong but ask around in the zoa forum but i think Fly mentioned one time that there is pods that prey on zoas.

Runfrumu · 11/19/2008, 07:41 AM

I am right there with you. I started a thread like this around a year ago in the Zoanthid forum. A few amphipods were eating my yellow polyps as well. I dunked the rock in fresh water, killed the offending amphipods and the polyps havent been touched since.

I noticed the polyps were disapearing slowly, the would close first then a few days later just be gone, so I took a red light and watched at night and thats when I saw them doing it.

crvz · 11/19/2008, 08:19 AM

I'd be surprised if it's the pods, more likely to be another sort of pest (nudi, spider, etc.). Pictures may help, though, and chance of getting one with the pods in action?

landlord · 11/19/2008, 08:32 AM

They're indeed some type of pod. They have ravaged some of my frags / colonies. I watched them for several days do their thing. They are picky though, only go after certain zoas. Never had them hit on a paly

m0nk · 11/19/2008, 10:13 AM

I've heard of this off and on, never seen it myself unless the zoas where dying already. If anyone has a specific species name/pic that would be awesome.

saltman123 · 11/19/2008, 10:35 AM

Well, the one last healthy polyp doesn't even look like a polyp anymore. I've taken pictures of the polyp with them in the act, and video. And pictures of the aftermath. I will post them when I have time to unload my camera.

Question, what eats amphipods???

m0nk · 11/19/2008, 10:39 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by saltman123
Well, the one last healthy polyp doesn't even look like a polyp anymore. I've taken pictures of the polyp with them in the act, and video. And pictures of the aftermath. I will post them when I have time to unload my camera.

Question, what eats amphipods???

Certain wrasses (6-lines usually will), dragonettes, certain omnivores like clownfish...

saltman123 · 11/19/2008, 11:49 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by m0nk
Certain wrasses (6-lines usually will), dragonettes, certain omnivores like clownfish...

I have 2 clowns and they don't have any interest. 2 Cleaner shrimp too that probably aren't quick enough, but I do see these guys trying to touch the corners of rock and sand in hopes of catching one.

the 6-line sounds good, but I don't know if I can handle the bio-load since one of the clowns is a friends I am holding for a while.

Guess i'll have to try to keep the polyps off the ground. I do see them up on rock sometimes.

I always thought they were harmless and beneficial....guess not.

saltman123 · 11/19/2008, 01:56 PM

Well, here is proof with before and after's.

Before when they were healthy and happy. Keep in mind this was 2 shells full, and I gave one away,
but the one I kept had at least 1/2 the polyps in this picture. This is on 11-5-08

This is a picture of just one or two polyps left, but one was nice and huge still on 11-15-08

This video is of last night as a bunch of amphipods danced around the polyp on 11-18-08

and this is the final result this morning 11-19-08. The polyp is mostly eaten with a tiny bit hanging on

Must Kill the Amphipods!

Runfrumu · 11/19/2008, 01:57 PM

I actually watched mine attack the yellow polyps as well. They were surrounded by 10 different types of Zoa's but didnt touch any other one. The yellow polyps would close the first day after being attack then slowly shrivel up for the the next few days and dissapear. After I dipped the rock they were on and saw all the pod's fall off, and I never lost another one. The coepods in question looked just like all the other ones in the tank but there were 2 or 3 on that rock with the Zoa's that just went to town on the yellow polyps.

saltman123 · 11/19/2008, 02:01 PM

I wonder if they prefer the yellow polyp, and not others?

I never see them during the day, but at night it is like wild fire how they come out and hang around these yellow's.

I don't have many other polyps right now other than 1 nuclear green polyp, and then ricordea, frogspawn, hammer head torch coral, kenia, kenya tree's, and shrooms. I have a rock of new polyps going into my tank soon so I guess i'll find out if they eat those too.

briangg57 · 11/19/2008, 03:05 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by saltman123
Well, the one last healthy polyp doesn't even look like a polyp anymore. I've taken pictures of the polyp with them in the act, and video. And pictures of the aftermath. I will post them when I have time to unload my camera.

Question, what eats amphipods???

The trouble is that the pods are nocturnal.

briangg57 · 11/19/2008, 03:08 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by saltman123
I wonder if they prefer the yellow polyp, and not others?

Those are exactly what were eating my eagle eye zoo's

saltman123 · 11/19/2008, 04:26 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by briangg57
Those are exactly what were eating my eagle eye zoo's

Eagle Eye's too?
I have a big batch of Eagle Eyes and Super Greens going in soon. Hopefully they don't eat them. I'll have to keep a watch.

Jay03GT · 11/19/2008, 05:22 PM

google zoa eating spider and see if they look similar.

JeffD · 11/19/2008, 07:15 PM

to echo what a few already said about the zoas being sick to begin with. I recently bought a bunch of zoa frags that had all but one been fragged weeks before i put them in my tank. The one frag of orange zoas that i bought and had fragged while i was there for p\u did not make it.

They opened up fine as all the others after about 1 hour when first intro'd to my tank and they looked awesome for about 4-5 days. Slowly one by one the polyps closed and molded over just like the ones in the pics in this thread. I lost the last one 2 days ago. I had 5 polyps total at the start. As each one packed it in, the little pods etc were busy around the molded over polyp.

My thoughts are a fresh cut zoa frag, super-glued to a piece of rock, thrown in a bag, getting dumped into a tank with different lighting/temp/water params is "sometimes" too much for them to handle. I'm not saying that tons of others have not done just this or worse and have them survive but it many cases, its slow death for the zoas.

I'll be calling the fellow i got them from originally and ask him to frag another 5-6 heads\polyps but this time I'll have them stay there for about a week before p\u. Let them "recover" so to speak in their same environment for a bit.

just my 2 cents!

heyfredyourhat · 11/19/2008, 09:42 PM

I have mainly zoas in my tank and I witnessed pods "eating" my zoas on many occasions in the past(maybe they were in fact eating the dead ones). So I bought a mandarin in hopes to lessen the pod population, worked amazing. Hadn't lost a zoa since he was introduced(4-5 months im thinking) Well I pulled the mandarin out 2 weeks ago to rid ich in my tank, and in that time I have lost 3 separate frags of about 5 polyps per....So tell me if they still eat the dead/dying zoas, coz it sure looks like they have a liking for my expensive zoas!!

saltman123 · 11/19/2008, 10:08 PM

I will say that these zoas were definitely NOT sick, and were thriving. I only had them in my tank for a few weeks, but from the pictures you can see they were happy and healthy.

Those amphipods are bad news, no excuses guys!

ludnix · 11/19/2008, 10:23 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by saltman123
I will say that these zoas were definitely NOT sick, and were thriving. I only had them in my tank for a few weeks, but from the pictures you can see they were happy and healthy.

Those amphipods are bad news, no excuses guys!

I don't know, you haven't really proved it was them, amphipods hang out in my zoos all night and look exactly like what yours are doing but I'm not seeing them disappear.

Just because the polyps didn't look sick doesn't mean they weren't.

IFbettas · 11/19/2008, 10:48 PM

That really sucks! You might want to get a wrasse like a sixline or a halichoeres genus wrasse to control the pod population.

saltman123 · 11/19/2008, 10:51 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by ludnix
I don't know, you haven't really proved it was them, amphipods hang out in my zoos all night and look exactly like what yours are doing but I'm not seeing them disappear.

Just because the polyps didn't look sick doesn't mean they weren't.

I never imagined these guys would ever do it either, but I saw it with my own eyes. Tiny bits missing of the polyp. Since I posted this earlier today, and my lights being off for a few hours now, that polpy nub is just about gone, and the amphipods aren't near the shell where the polyps used to be anymore. When the lights went out I saw them run right back to that last polyp.

These polyps looked great before, so unless they were sick but were opening 100% every day I think the amphipods ate them because they wanted too, not because they were sick. Even with the amphipods eating the polyps around the remaining were fully open every day. If they were sick I would think they would close.

I'm sure this is one of those things that can go back and forth on if they are good or bad. I've now seen it with my own eyes, and in my book Amphipods are NOT to be trusted. My vote is a negative for these guys.

I am hoping they just have a sweet tooth for yellow's because if they eat my other zoo's I have coming i'll have to get a six-line or borrow a mandarin from someone for a few days

jk

flyyyguy · 11/19/2008, 11:46 PM

I, like many at one point would doubt the people saying they were eating healthy zoas, and figured they just didnt know any better.

Then you witness it for yourself.

They tend to really love PE type(zoanthus gigantus) polyps of any flavor, but I have had signifigant problems with them with many polyps to the point of even nuking my tank with a heavy dose of interceptor to try to kill the majority of them, that and wrasses.

Wrasses are the key to keep them in check as they are pretty burly bugs and even interceptor wont kill them all.

I also believe the coral munchers are different than the regular ones we have seen for so long. Otherwise how could we see these things for years not cause any issues whatsoever, and then they all of a sudden go rogue on us?? Not likely, but I surely dont have the ability to distinguish them apart visually.

One more reason to kill everything but the coral before you put new arrivals in your tank

One thing I can tell you for sure is that this guy pictured to the right most definitely will munch on healthy polyps (so will the guy on the left of course )

hoosierpat · 11/20/2008, 01:50 AM

Those are regular amphipods. And technically, your yellow polyps are not at all zoas. They are in a state of limbo as far as their taxonomical classification but the aren't zoanthoa, palythoa, or protopalythoa at all, that is agreed upon. It doesn't mean that the amphipods aren't eating them. I just thought I would throw that out there.

11/19/2008, 02:55 AM	#1
saltman123 Registered Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: CT Posts: 1,048	Aren't Amphipods/Copepods NOT supposed to eat Zoanthids? I always thought people said that amphipods didn't eat zoanthids, and only hung around them. Well, I have to say that I have watched a little team of amphipods actually eating some yellow polyps. A shell had about 3 or 4 polyps on it, and mysteriously there is only one left. I snapped a picture of the shell a few days ago with a copepod hanging out. Tonight, I can see them hanging around the last one's base. Guess another few days will tell the truth if the last polyp is missing. Anyone ever experience amphipods actually eating zoanthids? __________________ 12 Gallon Aquapod. 4 Gallon Pico-Coming Soon Current Tank Info: 12 Gallon Aquapod

11/19/2008, 06:44 AM	#2
briangg57 Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 634	They say that they eat only dying matter which means something is wrong and your zoo's are dying and the pods are cleaning up. BUT I have to say that I'm not so sure about that because I had some nice eagle eye zoos and every night when I turned out the light, my stomach churned as I watched them eat every one of them. My water parameters were great and everything else in my tank was fine. So like I said, I don't know for sure but I have my doubts that they never eat them just for the heck of it. Good luck with yours, Brian __________________ Ain't like goin down to the pond, cetching bluegills and tommy cats. Current Tank Info: 75 gal.,20 gal. sump with wet-dry, also run carbon,75 to 100lbs live rock. 3&1/2 inch sand bed, 390 Watts PC. lighting and loving it!!!

11/19/2008, 07:41 AM	#4
Runfrumu Hi Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: NC Posts: 1,014	I am right there with you. I started a thread like this around a year ago in the Zoanthid forum. A few amphipods were eating my yellow polyps as well. I dunked the rock in fresh water, killed the offending amphipods and the polyps havent been touched since. I noticed the polyps were disapearing slowly, the would close first then a few days later just be gone, so I took a red light and watched at night and thats when I saw them doing it. __________________ Red Sea Max 130d and 125 gallon mixed reef. Current Tank Info: 125 gallon oceanic tank, Lighthouse Pro XLS, 72" outer orbit fixture, H&S 150-F2000/1 skimmer, H&S 110 Calcium Reactor, Tunze 7096, 2 Tunze 6105's , Tunze Osmolator, Prime 1/4hp drop-in chiller. 5 years running. Red Sea Max, 3 years.

11/19/2008, 08:19 AM	#5
crvz Team RC Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: houstonia Posts: 7,989	I'd be surprised if it's the pods, more likely to be another sort of pest (nudi, spider, etc.). Pictures may help, though, and chance of getting one with the pods in action? __________________ -Chris- You don't win friends with salad. "Look! They're trying to learn for free!" ... "Use your phony guns as clubs!" Current Tank Info: rectangluar? wet?

11/19/2008, 08:32 AM	#6
landlord Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Alexandria, KY Posts: 1,937	They're indeed some type of pod. They have ravaged some of my frags / colonies. I watched them for several days do their thing. They are picky though, only go after certain zoas. Never had them hit on a paly __________________ Forget the Turtle Man, you got the Coral Man Live Action Fragging! Current Tank Info: 90 Gallon SPS Reef (Sump, Fuge, Skimmer, CX reactor, Chemical filtration, Overflow) by Lifereef, 2x400W 20K Radiums on IceCaps, 2x39W T5 "For fun", RK2, 4x Tunze 6055, Aqua Logic 1/3 HP Chiller, DIY RO/DI ATO 2-Part via Litermeter. Lotsa Clownfish

11/19/2008, 07:14 AM	#3
DevilBoy Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Wooster, Ohio Posts: 1,724	If i remember correctly, just to be sure you may want to get in contact with Flyguyyy but i believe there is some species of pods that do solely eat zoas. I may be wrong but ask around in the zoa forum but i think Fly mentioned one time that there is pods that prey on zoas.

11/19/2008, 10:13 AM	#7
m0nk Zen through Reefkeeping Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Camp Hill, Pa Posts: 317	I've heard of this off and on, never seen it myself unless the zoas where dying already. If anyone has a specific species name/pic that would be awesome. __________________ Save the reef, buy aquacultured. Better yet, frag and share! Current Tank Info: 30l

11/19/2008, 10:35 AM	#8
saltman123 Registered Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: CT Posts: 1,048	Well, the one last healthy polyp doesn't even look like a polyp anymore. I've taken pictures of the polyp with them in the act, and video. And pictures of the aftermath. I will post them when I have time to unload my camera. Question, what eats amphipods??? __________________ 12 Gallon Aquapod. 4 Gallon Pico-Coming Soon Current Tank Info: 12 Gallon Aquapod

11/19/2008, 01:56 PM	#11
saltman123 Registered Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: CT Posts: 1,048	Well, here is proof with before and after's. Before when they were healthy and happy. Keep in mind this was 2 shells full, and I gave one away, but the one I kept had at least 1/2 the polyps in this picture. This is on 11-5-08 This is a picture of just one or two polyps left, but one was nice and huge still on 11-15-08 This video is of last night as a bunch of amphipods danced around the polyp on 11-18-08 and this is the final result this morning 11-19-08. The polyp is mostly eaten with a tiny bit hanging on Must Kill the Amphipods! __________________ 12 Gallon Aquapod. 4 Gallon Pico-Coming Soon Current Tank Info: 12 Gallon Aquapod

11/19/2008, 01:57 PM	#12
Runfrumu Hi Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: NC Posts: 1,014	I actually watched mine attack the yellow polyps as well. They were surrounded by 10 different types of Zoa's but didnt touch any other one. The yellow polyps would close the first day after being attack then slowly shrivel up for the the next few days and dissapear. After I dipped the rock they were on and saw all the pod's fall off, and I never lost another one. The coepods in question looked just like all the other ones in the tank but there were 2 or 3 on that rock with the Zoa's that just went to town on the yellow polyps. __________________ Red Sea Max 130d and 125 gallon mixed reef. Current Tank Info: 125 gallon oceanic tank, Lighthouse Pro XLS, 72" outer orbit fixture, H&S 150-F2000/1 skimmer, H&S 110 Calcium Reactor, Tunze 7096, 2 Tunze 6105's , Tunze Osmolator, Prime 1/4hp drop-in chiller. 5 years running. Red Sea Max, 3 years.

11/19/2008, 02:01 PM	#13
saltman123 Registered Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: CT Posts: 1,048	I wonder if they prefer the yellow polyp, and not others? I never see them during the day, but at night it is like wild fire how they come out and hang around these yellow's. I don't have many other polyps right now other than 1 nuclear green polyp, and then ricordea, frogspawn, hammer head torch coral, kenia, kenya tree's, and shrooms. I have a rock of new polyps going into my tank soon so I guess i'll find out if they eat those too. __________________ 12 Gallon Aquapod. 4 Gallon Pico-Coming Soon Current Tank Info: 12 Gallon Aquapod

11/19/2008, 05:22 PM	#17
Jay03GT Registered Member. Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Lakeland, Fl Posts: 606	google zoa eating spider and see if they look similar.

11/19/2008, 07:15 PM	#18
JeffD Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Canada Posts: 184	to echo what a few already said about the zoas being sick to begin with. I recently bought a bunch of zoa frags that had all but one been fragged weeks before i put them in my tank. The one frag of orange zoas that i bought and had fragged while i was there for p\u did not make it. They opened up fine as all the others after about 1 hour when first intro'd to my tank and they looked awesome for about 4-5 days. Slowly one by one the polyps closed and molded over just like the ones in the pics in this thread. I lost the last one 2 days ago. I had 5 polyps total at the start. As each one packed it in, the little pods etc were busy around the molded over polyp. My thoughts are a fresh cut zoa frag, super-glued to a piece of rock, thrown in a bag, getting dumped into a tank with different lighting/temp/water params is "sometimes" too much for them to handle. I'm not saying that tons of others have not done just this or worse and have them survive but it many cases, its slow death for the zoas. I'll be calling the fellow i got them from originally and ask him to frag another 5-6 heads\polyps but this time I'll have them stay there for about a week before p\u. Let them "recover" so to speak in their same environment for a bit. just my 2 cents!

11/19/2008, 09:42 PM	#19
heyfredyourhat Premium Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: BC Canada Posts: 963	I have mainly zoas in my tank and I witnessed pods "eating" my zoas on many occasions in the past(maybe they were in fact eating the dead ones). So I bought a mandarin in hopes to lessen the pod population, worked amazing. Hadn't lost a zoa since he was introduced(4-5 months im thinking) Well I pulled the mandarin out 2 weeks ago to rid ich in my tank, and in that time I have lost 3 separate frags of about 5 polyps per....So tell me if they still eat the dead/dying zoas, coz it sure looks like they have a liking for my expensive zoas!!

11/19/2008, 10:08 PM	#20
saltman123 Registered Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: CT Posts: 1,048	I will say that these zoas were definitely NOT sick, and were thriving. I only had them in my tank for a few weeks, but from the pictures you can see they were happy and healthy. Those amphipods are bad news, no excuses guys! __________________ 12 Gallon Aquapod. 4 Gallon Pico-Coming Soon Current Tank Info: 12 Gallon Aquapod

11/19/2008, 10:48 PM	#22
IFbettas Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Woodridge, IL Posts: 1,953	That really sucks! You might want to get a wrasse like a sixline or a halichoeres genus wrasse to control the pod population. __________________ Current Tank Info: 180G SPS Dominant, 75 Gallon Sump/Fuge, 3x250w Reeflux 12k in Lumenbrights, Octo Extreme 250 Skimmer, Lots of flow

11/19/2008, 11:46 PM	#24
flyyyguy King of the white corals Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 5,239	I, like many at one point would doubt the people saying they were eating healthy zoas, and figured they just didnt know any better. Then you witness it for yourself. They tend to really love PE type(zoanthus gigantus) polyps of any flavor, but I have had signifigant problems with them with many polyps to the point of even nuking my tank with a heavy dose of interceptor to try to kill the majority of them, that and wrasses. Wrasses are the key to keep them in check as they are pretty burly bugs and even interceptor wont kill them all. I also believe the coral munchers are different than the regular ones we have seen for so long. Otherwise how could we see these things for years not cause any issues whatsoever, and then they all of a sudden go rogue on us?? Not likely, but I surely dont have the ability to distinguish them apart visually. One more reason to kill everything but the coral before you put new arrivals in your tank One thing I can tell you for sure is that this guy pictured to the right most definitely will munch on healthy polyps (so will the guy on the left of course ) __________________ I like holding hands, snuggling, and long walks on the beach

11/20/2008, 01:50 AM	#25
hoosierpat Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Crete, IL Posts: 862	Those are regular amphipods. And technically, your yellow polyps are not at all zoas. They are in a state of limbo as far as their taxonomical classification but the aren't zoanthoa, palythoa, or protopalythoa at all, that is agreed upon. It doesn't mean that the amphipods aren't eating them. I just thought I would throw that out there.