Deltec vs Octopus?

[nikonosis]

ive seen alot of the TOTM people use homemade skimmers... but you are right alot of them do use deltec!

[nikonosis]

blah

[crab0000]

Man, somebody just likes to argue. How much R&D do you think Coralvue put into their skimmer compared to Deltec? How much air does the Octupus pump pull? How much is this compared to what a Deltec pump pulls? I didn't buy a Deltec because I have money to burn. Lord knows with my wife and I being teachers we aren't rolling in money, but I wanted what I thought was best for my tank. Could I have gotten the same performance for less money? Possibly, but I am confident in my purchase which makes me happy. Having spent a lot of money on cheaper altenatives in the past, and not being happy with the results, I came to the conclusion that you do get what you pay for and now I just buy higher priced equipment. I guess according to you that makes me stupid, but everyone is entitled to their oppinion.

Originally posted by E-A-G-L-E-S
anyones thoughts on this?
?(by the way i just bought a nice one, but my tank has a low-medium bioload and i only feed once a day...so i'm wondering if there just won't be much to pull??)

I had my EuroReef ES8-2 on a 37 with one fish fed one time per day, sometimes every other day, and it stll pulled plenty of gunk out. I just added a Deltec Turbo 1250 to the tank and it is pulling gunk. IMO you can not overskim a tank. There will always be stuff to skim out.

[crab0000]

Also, IBTL .

[nikonosis]

Originally posted by crab0000
Man, somebody just likes to argue. How much R&D do you think Coralvue put into their skimmer compared to Deltec? How much air does the Octupus pump pull? How much is this compared to what a Deltec pump pulls? I didn't buy a Deltec because I have money to burn. Lord knows with my wife and I being teachers we aren't rolling in money, but I wanted what I thought was best for my tank. Could I have gotten the same performance for less money? Possibly, but I am confident in my purchase which makes me happy. Having spent a lot of money on cheaper altenatives in the past, and not being happy with the results, I came to the conclusion that you do get what you pay for and now I just buy higher priced equipment. I guess according to you that makes me stupid, but everyone is entitled to their oppinion.


I had my EuroReef ES8-2 on a 37 with one fish fed one time per day, sometimes every other day, and it stll pulled plenty of gunk out. I just added a Deltec Turbo 1250 to the tank and it is pulling gunk. IMO you can not overskim a tank. There will always be stuff to skim out.

How much better does that deltec work compared to the euro? I don't like to argue but people keep coming on here and saying deltec is the best and don't really provide any facts to back that up other than they bought one and they love it.

[ujohnk]

I dont think Deltec are great, i have owned 3 of there skimmers and had problems with all 3.
John.

[nikonosis]

Originally posted by ujohnk
I dont think Deltec are great, i have owned 3 of there skimmers and had problems with all 3.
John.

amazing, someone that owned a deltec and doesn't rave about them just because he spent alot of money on them and didn't want to be embarrased by saying something negative about them. How was their customer support when you had problems?

[crab0000]

Originally posted by nikonosis
How much better does that deltec work compared to the euro?

It's only been on the tank for a few days, but I have noticed a few things. First the Deltec bubbles seem to be smaller and more dense than the ER. Secondly my tank temp has fallen two to three degrees since the switch. I can't really compare skimmate production yet since the Deltec is still breaking in. It's also going to be hard to compare the two since they are so different in size. One thing I have noticed is an improvement in polyp extension on my SPS for some reason.

[ujohnk]

Im in the UK, but the customer support is pretty good. I have spent a lot over the years on Deltec equipment, but it is cheaper in this country.
There is not as much choice on skimmers in the UK, and the ones you can get by different companys are all around the same price (Deltec,Aquamedic,H&S) there isnt really any good cheap skimmers to pick from.
John.

John.

[rock455]

Have you looked at MRC?
www.myreefcreations.com

I have the MR-2 and have been very happy with it -- I have owned a Berlin XL, Euroreef and a Deltec -- I have to say that I have been more satisfied with the performance of the MRC over time.

[nikonosis]

Originally posted by rock455
Have you looked at MRC?
www.myreefcreations.com

I have the MR-2 and have been very happy with it -- I have owned a Berlin XL, Euroreef and a Deltec -- I have to say that I have been more satisfied with the performance of the MRC over time.

I was going to get an mr2 but Ive heard from alot of people that they require alot of tinkering and I really don't want that. Do you have to mess with yours alot?

[rock455]

No -- In the beginning you need to let it break in and then after about 24hrs you can set the amount of air going into the injector and walk away -- I have the valve about half open and it does great.

I also clean mine about once a month.

If you want one that you don't have to mess with at all you want the Euroreef -- it is literally plug and play --

I didn't like it because I couldn't really control the skimmate to suit me -- The MR-2 is also expandable -- I have visions of a 500g system in total some day and plan to be able to upgrade my MR2 to handle that tank -- which it can do. Also Andy at MRC is great -- service has been excellent.

I also bought a Ca Reactor from him as well as a custom sump for my 110g system.

[E-A-G-L-E-S]

crab0000.....but if there isn't a load(couple fish-few corals-minimal feeding)....WHERE do the excess organics come from for the skimmer to pull everyday?

[moonpod]

Beckett skimmers are RELATIVELY twitchier and require a bit more maintenance than needlewheels in particular if you try to skim anything remotely dry. If you try to skim anything that's vaguely dry you tend to collect a lot of stuff on the top of the chamber right before the neck and that stuff needs to go regularly to keep your skimmer going. This is IMO the result of relatively large bubbles generated by beckett injectors. If you set the thing up well on the install of the skimmer, then in general the only other thing is to clean the beckett injectors regularly b/c all manner of "stuff" will get into them. People with little snails in your tank, these things will constantly end up in the injectors, I have no friggin idea why. I have owned a MR3 and it was a good performer, but you're either a beckett devotee or you are not. Nothing "wrong" or "right" about one or the other, they are just different.

nikonosis I have owned an ER 8-2 standard (obviously this is back in the day) and an ER 6-2 RC with a "SP pump" instead of the old sedras. The....thought that goes into these units vs a Deltec is...not comparable. They check enough to make sure the pump won't flood the chamber but beyond that....They've changed the lineup now and I think they've eliminated most of the models that were dogs, but...they still don't compare in terms of performance in the same footprint.

Now here's the rub--what is that worth to you and is the price differential meaningful to you. Now I will say this: the price difference between ER RC units and H&S and Deltec RC units ain't all that much IMO. So...

As for the smaller units and when you begin to compare to stuff like Octopus and Corallife superskimmers, blah, blah, blah, the first thing I will say is that these units are great for the more economical and yes larger segment of the market. IMO they represent a significant effort to mass market a better skimmer than the previous seaclowns and whatever else. The next thing is that they don't really compare on a size basis to what you can get performance wise with steps up in the "skimmer heirarchy". HOWEVER that by no means=your reef is gonna fail without one of these high end units. Again, it's a relative value thing. I've got a bit more slack in my budget and space constraints were a problem for me so what did I buy....a bubble king. That doesn't mean I couldn't find an ASM that would work for my system (well actually given what I want out of my skimmer I couldn't), or a cheaper option, but this skimmer gave me the best combo of size, performance, low heat input, silence and electrical effeciency that were important to me. To someone else it isn't worth it however and there's nothing wrong with that.

[nikonosis]

Originally posted by rock455
No -- In the beginning you need to let it break in and then after about 24hrs you can set the amount of air going into the injector and walk away -- I have the valve about half open and it does great.

I also clean mine about once a month.

If you want one that you don't have to mess with at all you want the Euroreef -- it is literally plug and play --

I didn't like it because I couldn't really control the skimmate to suit me -- The MR-2 is also expandable -- I have visions of a 500g system in total some day and plan to be able to upgrade my MR2 to handle that tank -- which it can do. Also Andy at MRC is great -- service has been excellent.

I also bought a Ca Reactor from him as well as a custom sump for my 110g system.

Ive seen people on RC saying you have to clean the injectors like once a week. Its so hard to tell how good something is based on what people say on RC now because every single person says something different.

[nikonosis]

Originally posted by moonpod
Beckett skimmers are RELATIVELY twitchier and require a bit more maintenance than needlewheels in particular if you try to skim anything remotely dry. If you try to skim anything that's vaguely dry you tend to collect a lot of stuff on the top of the chamber right before the neck and that stuff needs to go regularly to keep your skimmer going. This is IMO the result of relatively large bubbles generated by beckett injectors. If you set the thing up well on the install of the skimmer, then in general the only other thing is to clean the beckett injectors regularly b/c all manner of "stuff" will get into them. People with little snails in your tank, these things will constantly end up in the injectors, I have no friggin idea why. I have owned a MR3 and it was a good performer, but you're either a beckett devotee or you are not. Nothing "wrong" or "right" about one or the other, they are just different.

nikonosis I have owned an ER 8-2 standard (obviously this is back in the day) and an ER 6-2 RC with a "SP pump" instead of the old sedras. The....thought that goes into these units vs a Deltec is...not comparable. They check enough to make sure the pump won't flood the chamber but beyond that....They've changed the lineup now and I think they've eliminated most of the models that were dogs, but...they still don't compare in terms of performance in the same footprint.

Now here's the rub--what is that worth to you and is the price differential meaningful to you. Now I will say this: the price difference between ER RC units and H&S and Deltec RC units ain't all that much IMO. So...

As for the smaller units and when you begin to compare to stuff like Octopus and Corallife superskimmers, blah, blah, blah, the first thing I will say is that these units are great for the more economical and yes larger segment of the market. IMO they represent a significant effort to mass market a better skimmer than the previous seaclowns and whatever else. The next thing is that they don't really compare on a size basis to what you can get performance wise with steps up in the "skimmer heirarchy". HOWEVER that by no means=your reef is gonna fail without one of these high end units. Again, it's a relative value thing. I've got a bit more slack in my budget and space constraints were a problem for me so what did I buy....a bubble king. That doesn't mean I couldn't find an ASM that would work for my system (well actually given what I want out of my skimmer I couldn't), or a cheaper option, but this skimmer gave me the best combo of size, performance, low heat input, silence and electrical effeciency that were important to me. To someone else it isn't worth it however and there's nothing wrong with that.

That is by far the best answer so far and is exactly what i was looking for! Thanks

[moonpod]

The frequency of need to clean your beckett injectors varies with one if you are monitoring air injection (put an air guage on the beckett and clean when the it drops--which of course will make you clean your injector more frequently) and two if you've got certain things in your tank like little strombus snails that friggin procreate like crazy and the little baby snails can get EVERYWHERE in particular in my experience my injectors causing obvious drop in air injection.

[E-A-G-L-E-S]

moonpod.....(your thoughts would be appreciated)
.....but if there isn't a load(couple fish-few corals-minimal feeding)....WHERE do the excess organics come from for the skimmer to pull everyday?

[moonpod]

pollutants from the air. Your arms sticking in the tank. Life processes in the tank. What happens when you combine CO2 with light energy in a photosynthetic animal? You generate sugars and carbohydrates which become...TAH DAH....ORGANICS! Essentially there are always organics in there being produced, albeit feedings add to it much more rapidly than photosynthetic processes.

Frankly, realistically, I've never seen an "overskimmed" system. I don't believe such a thing exists b/c ideally your skimmer is so overpowering you strip the organics out before they have a chance to sit around. Like BAM. I've got a BK400ext on my tank which is an absolute beast and I can still grow chaeto in my fuge at a good clip. Granted I also have way too many fish and I feed excessively, but....I like it like that ya know?

[Bebo77]

chuck i am going to reccomend you for RC staff

[E-A-G-L-E-S]

but on a large skimmer(for the tank its cleaning) shouldn't there be weeks where you've pulled out alot, then the weeks where you don't?

[moonpod]

Well...is your routine (feeding etc...) all that different from week to week? Mine isn't.

[ClarkiiClownfish]

I have been in this hobby a decent amount of time (close to 12 years). In that time, I have made many, many, many mistakes that have eventually lead to losing huge chunks of green from my wallet, and a lot of this has come from purchasing skimmers that did not meet expectations. Here is one thing I have learned.

Spray injection skimmers, beckett skimmers, venturi skimmers.....hang-ons, stand alones, sit-in-sump, etc, etc, etc.
I have tried them all.
I am almost ashamed to put this out there, but I spent well over $2500.00 in the first 10 years in this hobby on skimmers for my tanks, BEFORE I broke down and bought a Deltec. I never did get great results, even from an AquaC EV400.

Then I saw a Deltec in person...in action.

I immediately went home and got on the pc and started researching Deltec. Before I saw one in person, I had heard of them, but like a lot of people here just thought they were way overpriced.
I broke down and spent the money on an AP902.

The AP902 pulled out more foul skimmate in 3 weeks than the EV400 did in 3 months.
I spent over $700.00 on that EV400.
I sold it 4 weeks later for $200.00 and didnt even have it a year.

Since then, my Deltec has been performing like no other skimmer I have ever seen in 12 years in this hobby. Why you ask?
I dont know! But I am sure you will argue with me until you are blue in the face, but I dont care. In my opinion, there is no comparison to a Deltec. Why you ask do I feel this way about my Deltec? One word. Experience.
The self-cleaning head is also something that drew me to the Deltec. And that is something that I have not seen any other skimmer manufacturer offer.So I bought one of those too. And it is great. Now my AP902 is pulling even more skimmate, and I have to do less maintenance. AWESOME! Not to metnion my tank has never looked better and been healthier.

So go ahead and bash me for buying an overpriced Deltec with the self-cleaning head. Argue all you want. I think it stems from jealousy anyway. You want one, but probably cant afford one, so you are trying to justify to yourself that they arent worth the money...when in fact, they are worth every penny.

After unsing 6 different kinds/brands of skimmer in the first 10 years I have been in this hobby, I am just so very happy that I will not be buying anymore "underpriced" skimmers that are not well engineered or designed and made of inferior materials. Cuz I know what I get when I buy one of those...and I know from EXPERIENCE that you get an "inferior" skimmer.

[moonpod]

OOOHHH....self cleaning head.....yummy.....

[aurorafish]

Well , i do maintaince on a tank with a deltec 850, one with an h&S 200 (2 eheims), and can say they both perform very well. Both are very quiet and pull good "nog", do not add excess heat to the system,etc.The only bad note for either one in my book is a bit high of a price at initial purchase and down the road(replacement pumps). For my personal tank I run a large mazzei venturi (1 inch mazzei Lifereef) 5 foot tall with an iwaki 55 driving it. This replaced the 850 on my system. It outperforms the 850 and is close to the H&S 200. But it does require a powerhog pump and the skimmer is silent but the pump is not!! Of course you need a dedicated fish room or a really tall stand to run it. I have not used the octopus although would be very curious to see it in action. Possible easy mods might be as simple as a gen-x needlewheel or OR needlewheel, not sure till I see one locally. The ASM's are ok for a budget and have plenty of friends with them, but they leak water and cannot be run externally, they pumps are a bit loud and the ones with multiple pumps add excess heat to the system (problems for some, for others not an issue) but, the pricing is great. Euro reefs- have seen many working very well, but they seem unsure on pump selection at the present moment. One important skimming factor that seems to be under-represented on RC is that your whole system has to be designed to get the organics to the skimmer effectively to let the skimmer do its job. Things like skimming a thin slice of the display tanks water going directly to the skimmer with the proper turnover rate, and keeping detrius from settling (good flow) are ultimately what will allow you to maximize the potential of whatever skimmer you are using. I suggest trying to locate someone local with the particular skimmer you are considering and going to see it in action, as that is the true test.