Refugium used as Quarintine tank?

Bri Guy · 05/16/2006, 11:16 AM

I had an Idea, Im setting up a 30g with 15g sump and 10g refugium. Ive heard a quarintine tank is a must, I have none. But the new set up will have a refugium overflowing into the sump. The 30 is drilled for 2 overflows one runs straight into the sump and one into the refugium.

Heres the Idea, take the overflow from the tank that runs into the refugium and move it to the sump, now both overflows run into the sump and the refugium is no longer in the system loop, add a small filter, and use it as a temperary quarintine tank, the new guys would have plenty of pods or algae to eat and would be the only big things down there so they would have a stressless home,when all seems well hook the ref. back up to the sump system for a day or two, then move residents to the upper tank.

A temperary Q tank, better than nothing or bad idea?

Travis L. Stevens · 05/16/2006, 11:23 AM

This is a bad idea. Because if you introduce a fish that is infected, the whole refugium will have it. Let's take Marine Ich for example. They can survive 4-6 weeks without a host fish. So, if you add a carrier fish in the Temporary QT/Refugium, not see signs of a problem, and put everything back together, you will have just introduced Marine Ich into the entire tank. Just because there are no outward signs of Marine Ich, doesn't mean that it isn't present. And once it hits your main tank, it could wreak havoc on the other fish.

My suggestion is to have a permanently seperate quarintine tank, your main display tank, and a hospital tank in case something happens to a fish in the display or your new quarintined fish needs to be treated for something.

Bri Guy · 05/16/2006, 11:40 AM

How exactly long are you guys keeping fish in a Quarintine tank?
A full 6 weeks incase of the Marine Ich sittuation?

Travis L. Stevens · 05/16/2006, 12:06 PM

The usual amount of time is about 3-4 weeks. Some people do it for two or less, and highly recommend to do the 3-4 week period. Also, make sure you QT new invertebrates and corals as well. I've seen a few beautiful SPS and Zoanthid tanks get wiped out by Red Bugs, Montipora Eating Nudibranchs, Zoanthid Eating Nudibranchs, and Sundial Snails.

whiirly · 05/16/2006, 12:43 PM

I have never QT anything and havent had any problems
I know this is not a great practice but its what works for me
I also only acclimate for temp then put the fish in.
I havent lost a fish in three years(knock on wood)
I use the same practice with my corals

Bri Guy · 05/16/2006, 01:13 PM

Well thats kinda where Im at, Ive never Qt anything before and not sure I can afford another tank right now (new Qt tank) so thats why I figured if I use the ref. for the Qt tank its better than nothing right?

If I don't use my Idea of temperary Qt tank I don't think Im going to Qt at all!!!

So would it be better to take the chance of destroying my refugium, or the enire setup?
Im sure people find the problem with their new fish/inverts within the first few days more often than less. I think its at least some form of safety that others don't even take.

Travis L. Stevens · 05/16/2006, 01:28 PM

Why not just pic up an empty 10g tank from WalMart for $10? Fill it with a little tank water, some different size PVC tubes and fittings, a heater, and a HOB Filter. That's all you really need. Maybe a $5 reflector and an $8 Lights of America light if you were QTing corals. It's really not that expensive. YOu can even break down the tank and store it in a garage or closet until you purchase a new addition.

jlawson382 · 05/16/2006, 01:54 PM

Not that I'm for this idea, but what's the difference in your scenario?

"So, if you add a carrier fish in the Temporary QT/Refugium, not see signs of a problem, and put everything back together, you will have just introduced Marine Ich into the entire tank. "

So you replace "put everything back together" with "put the fish in your display"... isn't the outcome the same?

Back on topic - just set up a cheapie QT like Travis says. Better safe than sorry. (Says the guy with no QT tank at the moment...)

Travis L. Stevens · 05/16/2006, 02:07 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by jlawson382
So you replace "put everything back together" with "put the fish in your display"... isn't the outcome the same?

Not actually. The liklehood of it actually carrying the Marine Ich without showing outward signs is very slim, but still present. The chances of your sand and rocks carrying it is very high. Basically, it's always a risk to put anything new in the tank, but you can reduce your risks statistically by following a QT procedure.

jlawson382 · 05/16/2006, 02:16 PM

I wan going to reply something about "you said carrier fish/not see signs" etc etc, but to be honest, I simply don't have the heart to argue semantics on the internet. :P I was just busting your chops a little in the first place.

RichConley · 05/16/2006, 02:17 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Travis L. Stevens
This is a bad idea. Because if you introduce a fish that is infected, the whole refugium will have it. Let's take Marine Ich for example. They can survive 4-6 weeks without a host fish. So, if you add a carrier fish in the Temporary QT/Refugium, not see signs of a problem, and put everything back together, you will have just introduced Marine Ich into the entire tank. Just because there are no outward signs of Marine Ich, doesn't mean that it isn't present. And once it hits your main tank, it could wreak havoc on the other fish.

My suggestion is to have a permanently seperate quarintine tank, your main display tank, and a hospital tank in case something happens to a fish in the display or your new quarintined fish needs to be treated for something.

If its a carrier fish that shows no signs, you add the ich to the tank when you add the fish. The fuge having it wouldnt matter at that point.

RichConley · 05/16/2006, 02:19 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Travis L. Stevens
Not actually. The liklehood of it actually carrying the Marine Ich without showing outward signs is very slim, but still present. The chances of your sand and rocks carrying it is very high. Basically, it's always a risk to put anything new in the tank, but you can reduce your risks statistically by following a QT procedure.

?? How is the chances of the fish having it but not showing it slim, and the tank having it and not showing it high?

If its in there, it got in there because a fish was carrying it that didnt show.

Honestly, most people dont QT. This is a step in the right direction, adn for those of us who believe that Ich is always present in marine aquarium at some level, this is the perfect solution.

Bri Guy · 05/16/2006, 03:28 PM

RichConley"Honestly, most people dont QT. This is a step in the right direction, "
Thats what I was thinkin, Still a chance of getting something, or destroying the refugium. but most people don't get even a day to catch a hitchhiker or disease. This seems like a little better choice than just throwing it in.

As of right now the tank is not set up,so Ill just set up the "Refugium" as a Qt for the first couple of months, (and not have a Refugium yet) after the cycle and introduction of most of my new items, then it will become a Refugium down the road....in which Ill be able to afford another setup especially for the new Qt tank.

What is the differance between a Qt tank and a Hospital tank?
Could you use the same tank for the two differant types, (not at the same time) if needed Qt a new guy, but if the tank was not in use Hospital a sick guy?
Thankx for all the help so far!

reefgeek84 · 05/16/2006, 03:33 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by whiirly

I also only acclimate for temp then put the fish in.

You really do not acclimate for salinty?

whiirly · 05/16/2006, 03:40 PM

You really do not acclimate for salinty?

No I have never done that now mind you I do check the salinity and as long as its close I am ok
Most of my fish were bought from fellow reefers and there salinty is always higher than say a LFS
Plus the NOT SO LFS I use keeps his salinity at around1.026 for any thing I buy from him its the same as mine the only difference is maybe PH

reefgeek84 · 05/16/2006, 03:42 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by whiirly
You really do not acclimate for salinty?

No I have never done that now mind you I do check the salinity and as long as its close I am ok
Most of my fish were bought from fellow reefers and there salinty is always higher than say a LFS
Plus the NOT SO LFS I use keeps his salinity at around1.026 for any thing I buy from him its the same as mine the only difference is maybe PH

interesting you chose this route when eveyone including most major retailers of coral and fish will not give a refund on items that do not make it, if you do not follow thier acclimation process.

whiirly · 05/16/2006, 03:48 PM

I havent bought a fish or coral from a retailer in 3 years I chose to but my frags and such from other reefers in my area
the Joys of living in this area
Mind you I dont recommend this practice this is just what has worked for me havent lost a fish in 3 years
most fish I have, had a year in someone elses tank b4 going into mine

reefgeek84 · 05/16/2006, 03:53 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by whiirly
I havent bought a fish or coral from a retailer in 3 years I chose to but my frags and such from other reefers in my area
the Joys of living in this area
Mind you I dont recommend this practice this is just what has worked for me havent lost a fish in 3 years
most fish I have, had a year in someone elses tank b4 going into mine

No, I find this very interesting... I have always thought about going that route but a little to scared to find out the outcome if it was bad.

whiirly · 05/16/2006, 05:35 PM

Well because every one is close its easy to find some one or several people who are willing to swap corals or just sell frags that you gwet to know and deal with alot This to has worked out very nicely for me

kiowascout · 05/16/2006, 06:47 PM

podhead..
I think its a bad idea also.

One thing to remember is that if your fish does show signs of illness and you treat the fuge/QT, you'll most likely kill any and all beneificial life forms in the fuge.

So, in order for you to put it back into operation as a fuge, youd have to restock it anyway.

I recommend you go with a cheapo 10 gal from wallyworld and keep a sponge filter in the sump of your main tank to transfer to the QT when needed. After QT break it down, clean out mr. sponge filter and then put it back in to the sump to recolonize.

05/16/2006, 11:16 AM	#1
Bri Guy Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Appleton, Wisconsin Posts: 2,995	Refugium used as Quarintine tank? I had an Idea, Im setting up a 30g with 15g sump and 10g refugium. Ive heard a quarintine tank is a must, I have none. But the new set up will have a refugium overflowing into the sump. The 30 is drilled for 2 overflows one runs straight into the sump and one into the refugium. Heres the Idea, take the overflow from the tank that runs into the refugium and move it to the sump, now both overflows run into the sump and the refugium is no longer in the system loop, add a small filter, and use it as a temperary quarintine tank, the new guys would have plenty of pods or algae to eat and would be the only big things down there so they would have a stressless home,when all seems well hook the ref. back up to the sump system for a day or two, then move residents to the upper tank. A temperary Q tank, better than nothing or bad idea? __________________ For my birthday i got a humidifier and a de-humidifier... I put them in the same room and let them fight it out. (Steven Wright) Current Tank Info: 40BR w/ 250w 14K Phoenix + 192w PC, 10g fuge w/ 55w PC, 10g sump, Eheim 1250 return w/ SCWD, ASM Mini G skimmer, Gravity fed ATO, Kalk doser, 1/10 HP chiller, 1 Vortec + 3MJs, all on an AC Jr. - Born on date 8-06 Pics in gallery! + 55g FOWLR w/ macro

05/16/2006, 11:23 AM	#2
Travis L. Stevens Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Perry, OK Posts: 13,946	This is a bad idea. Because if you introduce a fish that is infected, the whole refugium will have it. Let's take Marine Ich for example. They can survive 4-6 weeks without a host fish. So, if you add a carrier fish in the Temporary QT/Refugium, not see signs of a problem, and put everything back together, you will have just introduced Marine Ich into the entire tank. Just because there are no outward signs of Marine Ich, doesn't mean that it isn't present. And once it hits your main tank, it could wreak havoc on the other fish. My suggestion is to have a permanently seperate quarintine tank, your main display tank, and a hospital tank in case something happens to a fish in the display or your new quarintined fish needs to be treated for something. __________________ Travis Stevens Current Tank Info: Restarting 28g Bowfront

05/16/2006, 11:40 AM	#3
Bri Guy Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Appleton, Wisconsin Posts: 2,995	How exactly long are you guys keeping fish in a Quarintine tank? A full 6 weeks incase of the Marine Ich sittuation? __________________ For my birthday i got a humidifier and a de-humidifier... I put them in the same room and let them fight it out. (Steven Wright) Current Tank Info: 40BR w/ 250w 14K Phoenix + 192w PC, 10g fuge w/ 55w PC, 10g sump, Eheim 1250 return w/ SCWD, ASM Mini G skimmer, Gravity fed ATO, Kalk doser, 1/10 HP chiller, 1 Vortec + 3MJs, all on an AC Jr. - Born on date 8-06 Pics in gallery! + 55g FOWLR w/ macro

05/16/2006, 12:06 PM	#4
Travis L. Stevens Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Perry, OK Posts: 13,946	The usual amount of time is about 3-4 weeks. Some people do it for two or less, and highly recommend to do the 3-4 week period. Also, make sure you QT new invertebrates and corals as well. I've seen a few beautiful SPS and Zoanthid tanks get wiped out by Red Bugs, Montipora Eating Nudibranchs, Zoanthid Eating Nudibranchs, and Sundial Snails. __________________ Travis Stevens Current Tank Info: Restarting 28g Bowfront

05/16/2006, 12:43 PM	#5
whiirly Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Orland Park ILL Posts: 3,177	I have never QT anything and havent had any problems I know this is not a great practice but its what works for me I also only acclimate for temp then put the fish in. I havent lost a fish in three years(knock on wood) I use the same practice with my corals __________________ Whiirly A.K.A The One and ONLY:)> Current Tank Info: 180 might as well be a FOWLR

05/16/2006, 01:13 PM	#6
Bri Guy Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Appleton, Wisconsin Posts: 2,995	Well thats kinda where Im at, Ive never Qt anything before and not sure I can afford another tank right now (new Qt tank) so thats why I figured if I use the ref. for the Qt tank its better than nothing right? If I don't use my Idea of temperary Qt tank I don't think Im going to Qt at all!!! So would it be better to take the chance of destroying my refugium, or the enire setup? Im sure people find the problem with their new fish/inverts within the first few days more often than less. I think its at least some form of safety that others don't even take. __________________ For my birthday i got a humidifier and a de-humidifier... I put them in the same room and let them fight it out. (Steven Wright) Current Tank Info: 40BR w/ 250w 14K Phoenix + 192w PC, 10g fuge w/ 55w PC, 10g sump, Eheim 1250 return w/ SCWD, ASM Mini G skimmer, Gravity fed ATO, Kalk doser, 1/10 HP chiller, 1 Vortec + 3MJs, all on an AC Jr. - Born on date 8-06 Pics in gallery! + 55g FOWLR w/ macro

05/16/2006, 01:28 PM	#7
Travis L. Stevens Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Perry, OK Posts: 13,946	Why not just pic up an empty 10g tank from WalMart for $10? Fill it with a little tank water, some different size PVC tubes and fittings, a heater, and a HOB Filter. That's all you really need. Maybe a $5 reflector and an $8 Lights of America light if you were QTing corals. It's really not that expensive. YOu can even break down the tank and store it in a garage or closet until you purchase a new addition. __________________ Travis Stevens Current Tank Info: Restarting 28g Bowfront

05/16/2006, 01:54 PM	#8
jlawson382 Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Greenville, SC Posts: 35	Not that I'm for this idea, but what's the difference in your scenario? "So, if you add a carrier fish in the Temporary QT/Refugium, not see signs of a problem, and put everything back together, you will have just introduced Marine Ich into the entire tank. " So you replace "put everything back together" with "put the fish in your display"... isn't the outcome the same? Back on topic - just set up a cheapie QT like Travis says. Better safe than sorry. (Says the guy with no QT tank at the moment...)

05/16/2006, 02:16 PM	#10
jlawson382 Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Greenville, SC Posts: 35	I wan going to reply something about "you said carrier fish/not see signs" etc etc, but to be honest, I simply don't have the heart to argue semantics on the internet. :P I was just busting your chops a little in the first place.

05/16/2006, 03:28 PM	#13
Bri Guy Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Appleton, Wisconsin Posts: 2,995	RichConley"Honestly, most people dont QT. This is a step in the right direction, " Thats what I was thinkin, Still a chance of getting something, or destroying the refugium. but most people don't get even a day to catch a hitchhiker or disease. This seems like a little better choice than just throwing it in. As of right now the tank is not set up,so Ill just set up the "Refugium" as a Qt for the first couple of months, (and not have a Refugium yet) after the cycle and introduction of most of my new items, then it will become a Refugium down the road....in which Ill be able to afford another setup especially for the new Qt tank. What is the differance between a Qt tank and a Hospital tank? Could you use the same tank for the two differant types, (not at the same time) if needed Qt a new guy, but if the tank was not in use Hospital a sick guy? Thankx for all the help so far! __________________ For my birthday i got a humidifier and a de-humidifier... I put them in the same room and let them fight it out. (Steven Wright) Current Tank Info: 40BR w/ 250w 14K Phoenix + 192w PC, 10g fuge w/ 55w PC, 10g sump, Eheim 1250 return w/ SCWD, ASM Mini G skimmer, Gravity fed ATO, Kalk doser, 1/10 HP chiller, 1 Vortec + 3MJs, all on an AC Jr. - Born on date 8-06 Pics in gallery! + 55g FOWLR w/ macro

05/16/2006, 03:40 PM	#15
whiirly Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Orland Park ILL Posts: 3,177	You really do not acclimate for salinty? No I have never done that now mind you I do check the salinity and as long as its close I am ok Most of my fish were bought from fellow reefers and there salinty is always higher than say a LFS Plus the NOT SO LFS I use keeps his salinity at around1.026 for any thing I buy from him its the same as mine the only difference is maybe PH __________________ Whiirly A.K.A The One and ONLY:)> Current Tank Info: 180 might as well be a FOWLR

05/16/2006, 03:48 PM	#17
whiirly Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Orland Park ILL Posts: 3,177	I havent bought a fish or coral from a retailer in 3 years I chose to but my frags and such from other reefers in my area the Joys of living in this area Mind you I dont recommend this practice this is just what has worked for me havent lost a fish in 3 years most fish I have, had a year in someone elses tank b4 going into mine __________________ Whiirly A.K.A The One and ONLY:)> Current Tank Info: 180 might as well be a FOWLR

05/16/2006, 05:35 PM	#19
whiirly Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Orland Park ILL Posts: 3,177	Well because every one is close its easy to find some one or several people who are willing to swap corals or just sell frags that you gwet to know and deal with alot This to has worked out very nicely for me __________________ Whiirly A.K.A The One and ONLY:)> Current Tank Info: 180 might as well be a FOWLR

05/16/2006, 06:47 PM	#20
kiowascout Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Depere, WI Posts: 467	podhead.. I think its a bad idea also. One thing to remember is that if your fish does show signs of illness and you treat the fuge/QT, you'll most likely kill any and all beneificial life forms in the fuge. So, in order for you to put it back into operation as a fuge, youd have to restock it anyway. I recommend you go with a cheapo 10 gal from wallyworld and keep a sponge filter in the sump of your main tank to transfer to the QT when needed. After QT break it down, clean out mr. sponge filter and then put it back in to the sump to recolonize.