Water Change Set-Ups

wardworld · 12/26/2006, 10:25 AM

As I'm preparing to plumb my new 120, I'm trying to foresee any possible concerns now (before the stand is filled w/ water). One area I'm interested in is possible creative ways to do water changes.
Any ideas on how to plumb for more "automatic" water changes - as opposed to the good old-fashioned siphon and bucket?
My tank is an AGA 120 w/ dual overflows in the center back of the tank. Right now, I was planning on using spa-flex to go from the drains to my filter socks in my sump.
Thanks for any ideas !

BLANKENSHIP76 · 12/26/2006, 10:50 AM

I have he same set-up as you and I have yet to figure out a better way to do water changes. Still using the old bucket and hose. Whats even worse is I have to lug the water up a flight of stairs in order to refill the tank.

I am interested to hear any ideas on this as well.

wardworld · 12/26/2006, 11:14 AM

The only other thing I was contemplating was using an extra pump and hose to physically siphon the water out of the tank. But as far as I can tell this would mean submerging the pump in the tank and removing approx. 25 gallons either into a bucket OR hooking up a hose to drain it about 40' into my yard.....
Any other options??????

jag1979 · 12/26/2006, 12:28 PM

I use a rio 2100 and 3/4 tubing to change water from my sump...but I am thinking of buying a reef filler to do continuous water changes from the garage.

wardworld · 12/26/2006, 12:30 PM

jag, could you explain how you change it from your sump? Do you just "pump" the water from your sump until you've reached the set amount (in my case probably about 25 gal)?
And BTW, what's a "reef filler?"
Thanks,

BLANKENSHIP76 · 12/26/2006, 12:30 PM

I have thought of putting an auto-top off, but any solution for the actual water change seems more cumbersome than just siphoning the water out???

wardworld · 12/26/2006, 12:32 PM

Yes, blankenship...I'm doing an auto-top off as well, but I'd sure like to figure out a way to make the wc much less "cumbersome" (well-put!)

jag1979 · 12/26/2006, 12:42 PM

reef filler: http://www.championlighting.com/prod...cat=386&page=1

I would run the tubing up through my attic then down to my garage w/ two buckets, one for new one for old water. I would probably do a gallon a day on my 180 gallon.

My sump is a 60 gallon sump half full, I can normally pump out about 25 gallons, then pump in the new water, takes me about 20 minutes start to finish...but I still want the reef filler: that much easier and probably better to do continuous water change

ReefNeck · 12/26/2006, 12:47 PM

I have 3 75G Reefs, a 55G Reef and a 120G Reef. When it comes to water changes I use a Mag24 (2400GPH) and 50' of 1" vinyl hose. I pump from the tank to the toilet. then pump new SW from my mixing tub to the tank. Sure makes it easy doing so many tanks.

pjf · 12/26/2006, 01:05 PM

I have a 75-gallon display tank with a 29-gallon sump refugium. The return compartment of the sump is 20-gallons with an external pump. I have a Kold Ster-il system which gives me filtered water on demand.

If I want to perform a 20% water change, I simply turn off the pump, siphon the return compartment, mix salt in the return compartment, heat, and turn the pump back on.

To perform a 30% water change, I need to siphon the entire sump and the overflow:

1. Turn off external pump & skimmer
2. Remove skimmer & chaetomorpha
3. Siphon sump, remove standpipe, keep siphoning until empty
4. Mix water and salt in sump and heat
5. Replace skimmer, chaetomorpha and standpipe
6. Turn on external pump & skimmer

The 30% water change used to be easier when my sump had a hang-on skimmer and no macroalgae.

JOSEPHLB · 12/26/2006, 01:48 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by ReefNeck
I have 3 75G Reefs, a 55G Reef and a 120G Reef. When it comes to water changes I use a Mag24 (2400GPH) and 50' of 1" vinyl hose. I pump from the tank to the toilet. then pump new SW from my mixing tub to the tank. Sure makes it easy doing so many tanks.

Does that setup work well?

I have about 30 feet from my tank to where I'll be doing my mixing and kind of assumed this was how I was going to have to do it.. or carry buckets back and forth..

What would be the minimum pump to use? Is that Mag24 overkill or am I going to need something similiar?

Thanks

elf5 · 12/26/2006, 03:21 PM

I have a 125 FOWLR system. I drained 25 gallons of water into five five gallon buckets and measured how far down the water line went from the top of the tank. I have a 50 gallon bucket of RODI saltwater mixed and ready for the water change. Usually I will let the water mix in the bucket for about two days. I then pump the water directly from the tank out my garage using a pump and garden hose from Home Depot, about forty feet long and cost $10.00. I then put the pump in the bucket of mixed saltwater and fill the tank back up. It is very easy, no water on the floor and takes about twenty minutes.

DaveWC · 12/26/2006, 03:35 PM

I've got a 67g/35g reef & 225g/75g reef in adjoining rooms. There is a holding/mixing tank in the room with the 67g tank. There is a Mag 12 in the holding tank to mix the salt. I ran a PVC pipe from the holding tank, along the wall and T'd off to the sump for the 67g reef, then through the wall to my office and along that wall around the office to the sump of my 225g tank. Along the way this 1/2" pvc line also T's off to my house sump. There are ball valves all around so I can open a line from the holding tank to each sump, from each sump to the drain or even from one tank to the other. The PVC line at each sump connects to the sump return line, with a ball valve there as well so this line is always closed when the tank is running.

When I want to do a w/c I shut off the pump in the sump of the tank I want to change water. I open the valve doing to the house drain, close the valves going to the tank on the return line. When I start up the pump it drains the sump. Each sump holds enough water to do a 10% w/c on the tank it services. When the sump is low enough that the pump starts sucking air I turn it off... close a few valves, open a few and the pump in the holding tank refills the sump. Close a few valves, open a few and the tank is operating again. It works the same for both tanks and works well. I reuse the pump that's already in the sump of each tank so nothing is wasted. I need a pump in the holding tank to mix the salt & keep the water recirculating so that's not wasted either. I can change 10% in both tanks in about 10 minutes. When I'm done I just open the valve from the RO to the holding tank and walk away... the float switch will turn that off when it's done.

wardworld · 12/26/2006, 03:55 PM

Dave, you are the man....that's one cool set-up you've got there. My one problem in doing it your way is that I'm not sure my new sump will drain 25 gallons (for a 20% change)...it might, but I'll have to check it. I do like the turning of valves as opposed to filling, carrying, and emptying buckets...

DaveWC · 12/26/2006, 03:58 PM

So don't do a 20% w/c. If you can only drain 10g then drain 10g twice a week if you want to do a 20% w/c. It's probably better for your tank that way.

wardworld · 12/26/2006, 03:59 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by elf5
I then pump the water directly from the tank

That's what I think I'm going to do as well...elf5, whereabouts in Mass. are you? I'm a huge Sox fan, not so much for the Bruins, but a stinkin' uge Sox fan

wardworld · 12/26/2006, 04:01 PM

Dave, good point...I could definitely do the 10% weekly...I also like the "permanent" nature of yours as opposed to the flexible tubing/hose method. I'll have to see if I can work out a plumbing plan to get the water out of the house through some PVC.

DaveWC · 12/26/2006, 04:04 PM

I learned that the hard way. For 3 years the 225g tank (formerly a 180g tank in that location) held Discus and I'd do daily w/c of about 35%. I'd run a hose from the tank to my drain & siphon out water, then run the hose to the holding tank & pump it back in. When I started on s/w I decided that I'd never unroll a hose again and plumbed in the pvc line. It was a snap & very cheap.

baja_hammer2003 · 12/26/2006, 04:13 PM

I have a 280 with a 65 gallon sump i have drain on my sump i hook a hose to it drains about 50 gallons of water then i have another drain on 1 of my standpipes that drains about another 50 gallons from display tank. takes about 15 minutes to drain 100 gallons. I have a 100 gallon barrel that i keep in a spare room i bring it out when i need to change water i use a oceanus poseidon top off i just remaove it from my sump stick the float assembly in the barrel with line from ro/di turn it on it shuts off when full i use a small power head and some 1/2" tubing to refill sump all together it takes about 30 minutes of my time and about 18-20 hours to fill the barrel. if i had a place next to my sump to keep the barrel it would be very easy

wardworld · 12/26/2006, 04:27 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DaveWC
daily w/c of about 35%.

Whoaa, a daily of 35%, necessity truly is the mother of invention. I'm already planning the PVC location in my mind - I'm not sure my wife will approve of the exposed PVC, so I'm going to have to figure out the stealth mode.

ReefNeck · 12/26/2006, 06:44 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by JOSEPHLB
Does that setup work well?

I have about 30 feet from my tank to where I'll be doing my mixing and kind of assumed this was how I was going to have to do it.. or carry buckets back and forth..

What would be the minimum pump to use? Is that Mag24 overkill or am I going to need something similiar?

Thanks

It works great for me. Makes my life very easy. I don't think the Mag24 is overkill since I am pumping through 50' of hose.

Bergovoy · 12/26/2006, 07:46 PM

I am planning on putting a three way valve after my return pump, (before a manifold) that will pump to a hose that runs to the outside drain.

I will then have a mixing tank that will have a pupm that will run on recirc with another three way valve that will pump into the sump.

So to operate, I turn the three way at the sump to drain, it drains until I lower the water level to the specified mark onteh sump, then turn turn it back to operate. then I turn the recirc pump onteh mixing tank to fill. when I het the full mark on the sump, I turn that pump back to recirc...

I will then start mixing moer salt water for the next time.

I plan on weekly water changes of between 5-10 percent. Depending on the bio load...

I dotn see any problems with this, and if you do, please let me know, because I will be starting that shortly after I finish plumbing the tankm which should be tomorrow,,, Please god...

elf5 · 12/27/2006, 12:31 PM

I am 10 min North of Boston. I have been trying to get tickets for the Sox online now for a week. The day they go up for sale you can't get two together. I hate paying double or triple the price online or from scalpers. I think the Bruins are starting to get better but watch out for those PATS!

12/26/2006, 10:25 AM	#1
wardworld Gonna Need A Bigger Tank Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Lakeland, FL Posts: 1,398	Water Change Set-Ups As I'm preparing to plumb my new 120, I'm trying to foresee any possible concerns now (before the stand is filled w/ water). One area I'm interested in is possible creative ways to do water changes. Any ideas on how to plumb for more "automatic" water changes - as opposed to the good old-fashioned siphon and bucket? My tank is an AGA 120 w/ dual overflows in the center back of the tank. Right now, I was planning on using spa-flex to go from the drains to my filter socks in my sump. Thanks for any ideas ! __________________ -Daryl Current Tank Info: 180 gallon / 100 gallon rubbermaid sump / 40 gallon fuge / I-Tech 200 skimmer

12/26/2006, 11:14 AM	#3
wardworld Gonna Need A Bigger Tank Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Lakeland, FL Posts: 1,398	The only other thing I was contemplating was using an extra pump and hose to physically siphon the water out of the tank. But as far as I can tell this would mean submerging the pump in the tank and removing approx. 25 gallons either into a bucket OR hooking up a hose to drain it about 40' into my yard..... Any other options?????? __________________ -Daryl Current Tank Info: 180 gallon / 100 gallon rubbermaid sump / 40 gallon fuge / I-Tech 200 skimmer

12/26/2006, 12:28 PM	#4
jag1979 Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Texas Posts: 982	I use a rio 2100 and 3/4 tubing to change water from my sump...but I am thinking of buying a reef filler to do continuous water changes from the garage. __________________ clowns, bi-color pseudo, coral beauty, yellow tang GBTA, crocea clam xenia, various polyps/zoa's, candy cane, tree leather, frogspawn, torch, various mushrooms, green/red plate, birdsnest Current Tank Info: 180 AGA, tunze 6100, 6025 and 6060, 3 x 250 mh's, 3 x 80 t5's, ASM G4+

12/26/2006, 12:30 PM	#5
wardworld Gonna Need A Bigger Tank Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Lakeland, FL Posts: 1,398	jag, could you explain how you change it from your sump? Do you just "pump" the water from your sump until you've reached the set amount (in my case probably about 25 gal)? And BTW, what's a "reef filler?" Thanks, __________________ -Daryl Current Tank Info: 180 gallon / 100 gallon rubbermaid sump / 40 gallon fuge / I-Tech 200 skimmer

12/26/2006, 12:32 PM	#7
wardworld Gonna Need A Bigger Tank Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Lakeland, FL Posts: 1,398	Yes, blankenship...I'm doing an auto-top off as well, but I'd sure like to figure out a way to make the wc much less "cumbersome" (well-put!) __________________ -Daryl Current Tank Info: 180 gallon / 100 gallon rubbermaid sump / 40 gallon fuge / I-Tech 200 skimmer

12/26/2006, 10:50 AM	#2
BLANKENSHIP76 Moved On Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Indianapolis Posts: 827	I have he same set-up as you and I have yet to figure out a better way to do water changes. Still using the old bucket and hose. Whats even worse is I have to lug the water up a flight of stairs in order to refill the tank. I am interested to hear any ideas on this as well.

12/26/2006, 12:42 PM	#8
jag1979 Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Texas Posts: 982	reef filler: http://www.championlighting.com/prod...cat=386&page=1 I would run the tubing up through my attic then down to my garage w/ two buckets, one for new one for old water. I would probably do a gallon a day on my 180 gallon. My sump is a 60 gallon sump half full, I can normally pump out about 25 gallons, then pump in the new water, takes me about 20 minutes start to finish...but I still want the reef filler: that much easier and probably better to do continuous water change __________________ clowns, bi-color pseudo, coral beauty, yellow tang GBTA, crocea clam xenia, various polyps/zoa's, candy cane, tree leather, frogspawn, torch, various mushrooms, green/red plate, birdsnest Current Tank Info: 180 AGA, tunze 6100, 6025 and 6060, 3 x 250 mh's, 3 x 80 t5's, ASM G4+

12/26/2006, 12:47 PM	#9
ReefNeck Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Jacksonville, Fl. Posts: 543	I have 3 75G Reefs, a 55G Reef and a 120G Reef. When it comes to water changes I use a Mag24 (2400GPH) and 50' of 1" vinyl hose. I pump from the tank to the toilet. then pump new SW from my mixing tub to the tank. Sure makes it easy doing so many tanks.

12/26/2006, 01:05 PM	#10
pjf Premium Member Join Date: May 2005 Location: Colorado Posts: 2,954	Use Sump for Water Changes I have a 75-gallon display tank with a 29-gallon sump refugium. The return compartment of the sump is 20-gallons with an external pump. I have a Kold Ster-il system which gives me filtered water on demand. If I want to perform a 20% water change, I simply turn off the pump, siphon the return compartment, mix salt in the return compartment, heat, and turn the pump back on. To perform a 30% water change, I need to siphon the entire sump and the overflow: 1. Turn off external pump & skimmer 2. Remove skimmer & chaetomorpha 3. Siphon sump, remove standpipe, keep siphoning until empty 4. Mix water and salt in sump and heat 5. Replace skimmer, chaetomorpha and standpipe 6. Turn on external pump & skimmer The 30% water change used to be easier when my sump had a hang-on skimmer and no macroalgae.

12/26/2006, 03:21 PM	#12
elf5 Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Boston Posts: 41	I have a 125 FOWLR system. I drained 25 gallons of water into five five gallon buckets and measured how far down the water line went from the top of the tank. I have a 50 gallon bucket of RODI saltwater mixed and ready for the water change. Usually I will let the water mix in the bucket for about two days. I then pump the water directly from the tank out my garage using a pump and garden hose from Home Depot, about forty feet long and cost $10.00. I then put the pump in the bucket of mixed saltwater and fill the tank back up. It is very easy, no water on the floor and takes about twenty minutes.

12/26/2006, 03:35 PM	#13
DaveWC Premium Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Winnipeg, Canada Posts: 217	I've got a 67g/35g reef & 225g/75g reef in adjoining rooms. There is a holding/mixing tank in the room with the 67g tank. There is a Mag 12 in the holding tank to mix the salt. I ran a PVC pipe from the holding tank, along the wall and T'd off to the sump for the 67g reef, then through the wall to my office and along that wall around the office to the sump of my 225g tank. Along the way this 1/2" pvc line also T's off to my house sump. There are ball valves all around so I can open a line from the holding tank to each sump, from each sump to the drain or even from one tank to the other. The PVC line at each sump connects to the sump return line, with a ball valve there as well so this line is always closed when the tank is running. When I want to do a w/c I shut off the pump in the sump of the tank I want to change water. I open the valve doing to the house drain, close the valves going to the tank on the return line. When I start up the pump it drains the sump. Each sump holds enough water to do a 10% w/c on the tank it services. When the sump is low enough that the pump starts sucking air I turn it off... close a few valves, open a few and the pump in the holding tank refills the sump. Close a few valves, open a few and the tank is operating again. It works the same for both tanks and works well. I reuse the pump that's already in the sump of each tank so nothing is wasted. I need a pump in the holding tank to mix the salt & keep the water recirculating so that's not wasted either. I can change 10% in both tanks in about 10 minutes. When I'm done I just open the valve from the RO to the holding tank and walk away... the float switch will turn that off when it's done.

12/26/2006, 03:55 PM	#14
wardworld Gonna Need A Bigger Tank Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Lakeland, FL Posts: 1,398	Dave, you are the man....that's one cool set-up you've got there. My one problem in doing it your way is that I'm not sure my new sump will drain 25 gallons (for a 20% change)...it might, but I'll have to check it. I do like the turning of valves as opposed to filling, carrying, and emptying buckets... __________________ -Daryl Current Tank Info: 180 gallon / 100 gallon rubbermaid sump / 40 gallon fuge / I-Tech 200 skimmer

12/26/2006, 03:58 PM	#15
DaveWC Premium Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Winnipeg, Canada Posts: 217	So don't do a 20% w/c. If you can only drain 10g then drain 10g twice a week if you want to do a 20% w/c. It's probably better for your tank that way.

12/26/2006, 04:01 PM	#17
wardworld Gonna Need A Bigger Tank Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Lakeland, FL Posts: 1,398	Dave, good point...I could definitely do the 10% weekly...I also like the "permanent" nature of yours as opposed to the flexible tubing/hose method. I'll have to see if I can work out a plumbing plan to get the water out of the house through some PVC. __________________ -Daryl Current Tank Info: 180 gallon / 100 gallon rubbermaid sump / 40 gallon fuge / I-Tech 200 skimmer

12/26/2006, 04:04 PM	#18
DaveWC Premium Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Winnipeg, Canada Posts: 217	I learned that the hard way. For 3 years the 225g tank (formerly a 180g tank in that location) held Discus and I'd do daily w/c of about 35%. I'd run a hose from the tank to my drain & siphon out water, then run the hose to the holding tank & pump it back in. When I started on s/w I decided that I'd never unroll a hose again and plumbed in the pvc line. It was a snap & very cheap.

12/26/2006, 04:13 PM	#19
baja_hammer2003 Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: fla Posts: 261	I have a 280 with a 65 gallon sump i have drain on my sump i hook a hose to it drains about 50 gallons of water then i have another drain on 1 of my standpipes that drains about another 50 gallons from display tank. takes about 15 minutes to drain 100 gallons. I have a 100 gallon barrel that i keep in a spare room i bring it out when i need to change water i use a oceanus poseidon top off i just remaove it from my sump stick the float assembly in the barrel with line from ro/di turn it on it shuts off when full i use a small power head and some 1/2" tubing to refill sump all together it takes about 30 minutes of my time and about 18-20 hours to fill the barrel. if i had a place next to my sump to keep the barrel it would be very easy

12/26/2006, 07:46 PM	#22
Bergovoy Moved On Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Monrovia, CA Posts: 2,163	I am planning on putting a three way valve after my return pump, (before a manifold) that will pump to a hose that runs to the outside drain. I will then have a mixing tank that will have a pupm that will run on recirc with another three way valve that will pump into the sump. So to operate, I turn the three way at the sump to drain, it drains until I lower the water level to the specified mark onteh sump, then turn turn it back to operate. then I turn the recirc pump onteh mixing tank to fill. when I het the full mark on the sump, I turn that pump back to recirc... I will then start mixing moer salt water for the next time. I plan on weekly water changes of between 5-10 percent. Depending on the bio load... I dotn see any problems with this, and if you do, please let me know, because I will be starting that shortly after I finish plumbing the tankm which should be tomorrow,,, Please god...

12/27/2006, 12:31 PM	#23
elf5 Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Boston Posts: 41	I am 10 min North of Boston. I have been trying to get tickets for the Sox online now for a week. The day they go up for sale you can't get two together. I hate paying double or triple the price online or from scalpers. I think the Bruins are starting to get better but watch out for those PATS!