Dead live rock??

mnash · 08/08/2007, 09:29 AM

I am cycling my tank with 50lbs of base rock and about 6lbs of live rock. My live rock was pruple and green but now it is almost all brown and dead looking. There is also a whitish grey film on another rock that I assumed was a dead snail or somthing. Should I take these rocks out and scrub the dead looking junck off of them?

77railer · 08/08/2007, 10:11 AM

What are your water results? Could be several things...

Lee

SaltyDr · 08/08/2007, 11:07 AM

Probably dead/bleached coralline. Coralline cannot be scrubbed off. Try to scrape it. If it looks like it'll come loose, I would scrub them down. Can you add any more live rock? It's going to take months to build up the base rock with such a small amount of live rock.

mnash · 08/08/2007, 07:19 PM

The water results are showing that I still have some ammonia, nitrites and some nitrates. The salinity is 1.023 and temp is 75 degrees. What will it take months to build up on the base rock? Bacteria? Coraline?

shuturhole316tx · 08/08/2007, 07:25 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by mnash
The water results are showing that I still have some ammonia, nitrites and some nitrates. The salinity is 1.023 and temp is 75 degrees. What will it take months to build up on the base rock? Bacteria? Coraline?

It will take months for the base rock to become live rock with so little live rock compaired to base rock.

SaltyDr · 08/08/2007, 07:45 PM

Both

mnash · 08/08/2007, 08:07 PM

Once all of my test parameters are down to acceptable levels can I stock the tank slowly (as in a fish per month or per two months)while my rock matures into live rock? Should I be skimming while my tank is cycling?

77railer · 08/08/2007, 08:35 PM

I would say that you need to add more live rock or some live sand to help the base rock become live alittle faster...

Skimming now is definetly a good idea....

Dont add any fish until the tank cycles unless you like risking their death...Id give it a week or two after your tank cycles just to make sure you dont have another spike.

Lee

mnash · 08/08/2007, 11:46 PM

At this point I for one am glad that I went with cheap base rock rather than expensive live rock that would have just turned brown and looked dead in a week. I don't know if I want to add more live rock at least until the cycle is over. If I added it after it would be fully cured rock and it would only (hopefully) cause a small mini cycle.

klaz · 08/09/2007, 12:17 AM

i hope so......

schoch79 · 08/09/2007, 12:24 AM

Sounds like a good plan to me. I'm not sure I quite agree with the statement that it will take months for your rock to become live though. For live rock to truly be called live all it needs is to have the bacteria in it. Bacteria are very quick at reproducing. That is why it only takes upwards of 1 month to cycle a tank. Also even if your live rock was loaded with bacteria it would only hold as much bacteria on it as your bio load would "feed" it. That being said even in an established tank if you add a large bio load you will indeed still get a cycle because your live rock is trying to catch up. I would say that in 1-2 months your live rock will be live but still not as "pretty" as mature live rock. If that isn't clear let me know and I can try to clarify some of that.

mnash · 08/09/2007, 12:40 AM

This makes perfect sense to me. I was wondering if when he said it would take several months if he ment for coraline to spread and make the base look like live or if he ment it would take that long for the bacteria to spread and make the base rock an effective biological filter. I think you are supposed to only add a fish at a time and wait for a while inbetween additional fish because of what you are saying about a bio load feeding the bacteria and making them reproduce.

schoch79 · 08/09/2007, 12:48 AM

I just want to clarify though and say that I am in no way suggesting that you start adding fish now so that your bacteria have something to "eat" either. You will still have to go through your normal cycle then start to slowly add livestock.

mnash · 08/09/2007, 12:31 PM

I know that I have to wait until all of my chemical levels are stable and that ammonia=0 nitrites=0 nitrates= close to 0 ph=8.2 sg=1.023. I will wait until my levels are close to the above and then wait a week to make sure that they stay stable before I add my first clownfish.

schoch79 · 08/09/2007, 12:42 PM

Sounds good to me.

SaltyDr · 08/09/2007, 01:26 PM

Some of the bacteria will populate the rock quickly, but I have read that the bacteria deep in the rock can take much longer. Some of this "deeper" bacteria is involved in denitrification, kind of like a DSB. At least that is what I recall reading. Hope others with more knowledge can chime in here. I used about 20% base rock with my set up, and now, 3 months later it is looking a lot like the other rock. I know it's now "live" but I am not sure it possesses all of the properties of "true" live rock. As long as you take it slowly with your stocking and watch your parameters, I am sure you'll be fine.

schoch79 · 08/09/2007, 05:50 PM

I understand it the same as you saltydr. Deeper in the rock is denitrification bacteria that would act in a similar manner of a DSB. And in theory a lightly stocked tank with plenty of live rock should be able to keep it's own nitrogen cycle in check without having to do a thing for it, including nitrates.

mnash · 08/09/2007, 10:49 PM

I also have a sump with a refugium that has rock rubble, sand and chaeto. This will be my primary means of denitrification. After reading a lot I have concluded that the best thing that you can do is to just be patient and do things very slowly. I have heard that nothing good happens fast in a reef aquarium. This is the motto that I will run my tank by.

08/08/2007, 09:29 AM	#1
mnash Registered Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: Montana Posts: 280	Dead live rock?? I am cycling my tank with 50lbs of base rock and about 6lbs of live rock. My live rock was pruple and green but now it is almost all brown and dead looking. There is also a whitish grey film on another rock that I assumed was a dead snail or somthing. Should I take these rocks out and scrub the dead looking junck off of them?

08/09/2007, 12:17 AM	#10
klaz Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: GREECE-thessaloniki Posts: 37	i hope so...... __________________ 100 gal light reef tank Current Tank Info: 120 gal

08/09/2007, 12:24 AM	#11
schoch79 Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: hegins,pa Posts: 1,071	Sounds like a good plan to me. I'm not sure I quite agree with the statement that it will take months for your rock to become live though. For live rock to truly be called live all it needs is to have the bacteria in it. Bacteria are very quick at reproducing. That is why it only takes upwards of 1 month to cycle a tank. Also even if your live rock was loaded with bacteria it would only hold as much bacteria on it as your bio load would "feed" it. That being said even in an established tank if you add a large bio load you will indeed still get a cycle because your live rock is trying to catch up. I would say that in 1-2 months your live rock will be live but still not as "pretty" as mature live rock. If that isn't clear let me know and I can try to clarify some of that. __________________ We'd better get back, 'cause it'll be dark soon, and they mostly come at night... mostly.

08/09/2007, 12:48 AM	#13
schoch79 Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: hegins,pa Posts: 1,071	I just want to clarify though and say that I am in no way suggesting that you start adding fish now so that your bacteria have something to "eat" either. You will still have to go through your normal cycle then start to slowly add livestock. __________________ We'd better get back, 'cause it'll be dark soon, and they mostly come at night... mostly.

08/09/2007, 12:42 PM	#15
schoch79 Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: hegins,pa Posts: 1,071	Sounds good to me. __________________ We'd better get back, 'cause it'll be dark soon, and they mostly come at night... mostly.

08/08/2007, 10:11 AM	#2
77railer Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Sumter, South Carolina Posts: 276	What are your water results? Could be several things... Lee

08/08/2007, 11:07 AM	#3
SaltyDr Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Southwest Florida Posts: 1,191	Probably dead/bleached coralline. Coralline cannot be scrubbed off. Try to scrape it. If it looks like it'll come loose, I would scrub them down. Can you add any more live rock? It's going to take months to build up the base rock with such a small amount of live rock.

08/08/2007, 07:19 PM	#4
mnash Registered Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: Montana Posts: 280	The water results are showing that I still have some ammonia, nitrites and some nitrates. The salinity is 1.023 and temp is 75 degrees. What will it take months to build up on the base rock? Bacteria? Coraline?

08/08/2007, 07:45 PM	#6
SaltyDr Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Southwest Florida Posts: 1,191	Both

08/08/2007, 08:07 PM	#7
mnash Registered Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: Montana Posts: 280	Once all of my test parameters are down to acceptable levels can I stock the tank slowly (as in a fish per month or per two months)while my rock matures into live rock? Should I be skimming while my tank is cycling?

08/08/2007, 08:35 PM	#8
77railer Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Sumter, South Carolina Posts: 276	I would say that you need to add more live rock or some live sand to help the base rock become live alittle faster... Skimming now is definetly a good idea.... Dont add any fish until the tank cycles unless you like risking their death...Id give it a week or two after your tank cycles just to make sure you dont have another spike. Lee

08/08/2007, 11:46 PM	#9
mnash Registered Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: Montana Posts: 280	At this point I for one am glad that I went with cheap base rock rather than expensive live rock that would have just turned brown and looked dead in a week. I don't know if I want to add more live rock at least until the cycle is over. If I added it after it would be fully cured rock and it would only (hopefully) cause a small mini cycle.

08/09/2007, 12:40 AM	#12
mnash Registered Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: Montana Posts: 280	This makes perfect sense to me. I was wondering if when he said it would take several months if he ment for coraline to spread and make the base look like live or if he ment it would take that long for the bacteria to spread and make the base rock an effective biological filter. I think you are supposed to only add a fish at a time and wait for a while inbetween additional fish because of what you are saying about a bio load feeding the bacteria and making them reproduce.

08/09/2007, 12:31 PM	#14
mnash Registered Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: Montana Posts: 280	I know that I have to wait until all of my chemical levels are stable and that ammonia=0 nitrites=0 nitrates= close to 0 ph=8.2 sg=1.023. I will wait until my levels are close to the above and then wait a week to make sure that they stay stable before I add my first clownfish.

08/09/2007, 01:26 PM	#16
SaltyDr Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Southwest Florida Posts: 1,191	Some of the bacteria will populate the rock quickly, but I have read that the bacteria deep in the rock can take much longer. Some of this "deeper" bacteria is involved in denitrification, kind of like a DSB. At least that is what I recall reading. Hope others with more knowledge can chime in here. I used about 20% base rock with my set up, and now, 3 months later it is looking a lot like the other rock. I know it's now "live" but I am not sure it possesses all of the properties of "true" live rock. As long as you take it slowly with your stocking and watch your parameters, I am sure you'll be fine.

08/09/2007, 05:50 PM	#17
schoch79 Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: hegins,pa Posts: 1,071	I understand it the same as you saltydr. Deeper in the rock is denitrification bacteria that would act in a similar manner of a DSB. And in theory a lightly stocked tank with plenty of live rock should be able to keep it's own nitrogen cycle in check without having to do a thing for it, including nitrates. __________________ We'd better get back, 'cause it'll be dark soon, and they mostly come at night... mostly.

08/09/2007, 10:49 PM	#18
mnash Registered Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: Montana Posts: 280	I also have a sump with a refugium that has rock rubble, sand and chaeto. This will be my primary means of denitrification. After reading a lot I have concluded that the best thing that you can do is to just be patient and do things very slowly. I have heard that nothing good happens fast in a reef aquarium. This is the motto that I will run my tank by.