Help! I just messed up my fuge....I think???

luv951 · 08/12/2007, 03:48 PM

OK, so I have a 20 gallon long for my fuge. I have some live rock rubble in there and a big ball of Chaeto.

I was looking at the chaeto and it was overgrown with green and red slime algae, plus it was full (and I mean FULL) of detritus. After thinking about it a lot, I finally decided that I would remove the chaeto ball and run it under some water to get the detritus out.

What I did not realize until I was running it under water is that the ball of chaeto was inhabited by hundred of bristle worms. At least thats what I think they are - they have dozens of legs, are anywhere from 1/4 inch to 2 inches long and kinda reddish brown. Look like a milipede. As I was cleaning the chaeto, I found a 'colony' of dozens to hundreds of these things.

I had been running the water (tap water) for about a good two minutes. I tried to get the temp close but was not exact by any means. None of the worms were moving....did I kill them?

I put the ball back in the fuge pretty quickly after seeing them, but now I am wondering, did I just put a hundred little dead animals in my system????

Please help, what should I do? Get new chaeto and scrap that ball? leave it?

Thanks everyone : )

Kiel'thalin · 08/12/2007, 04:11 PM

Yes running tap water over your cheato might kill the organisms that inhabit it. There is a problem if nuisance algae is growing all over your cheato. Maybe a increase in flow or adding a small cleanup crew down there might help. Next time just take out a gallon of tank water and swish the cheato in it until you get the nuisance algae and detrius under control. I would take a turkey baster and suck out any detrius that has settled in the sump and maybe remove the rock rubble completely.

luv951 · 08/12/2007, 04:18 PM

I had one of those d'oh moments right after I saw the worms, when I realized that I should have swished it in saltwater.

Should I throw it out, or leave it back in?

ludnix · 08/12/2007, 04:24 PM

Put it back in. The chaeto is probably fine once it gets back in saltwater. The bristleworms will return in time.

luv951 · 08/12/2007, 04:33 PM

The dead bodies are no concern? I just looked and unfortunately, they are all white now, and still not moving - dead.

Does this make me a mass murderer?

Peter Eichler · 08/12/2007, 05:03 PM

If you have bristleworms, detritus, and nuisance algae in your Chaeto you are feeding way too much and don't have nearly enough flow around the chaeto.

luv951 · 08/12/2007, 07:14 PM

How much flow should I have. My return pump is doing around 700 GPH and is in the third chamber of a basic, three chamber sump, fuge in the middle. I figured the flow through was not high enough, so there are two small powerheads in the fuge section (about 160 gph each)

Do I need more, and if so, how much?

Peter Eichler · 08/13/2007, 10:58 PM

That should be enough flow, however you need to do something to keep the Chaeto from collecting detritus. I'd suggest pruning it regularly to keep it from getting compacted to the point where it can collect detritus. Also, I can't help but think you're overfeeding with that many bristleworms, so be more conscious of that.

luv951 · 08/14/2007, 11:51 AM

Thanks again Peter,

I am not sure that I am 'overfeeding.' However, I should have mentioned that this is a fowlr tank with a porc. puffer in it that is rapidly getting too large. (bigger tank is waiting in the wings) They are very messy eaters, but he only gets meat about two to three times a week. The rest, he eats nori, and at least two or three days, he gets nothing. Not so much overfeeding, as just a dirty swimming potato that makes a mess of his meals ; )

So, is it better to have a smaller clump of chaeto? Right now, the ball is about the size of a volleyball and fills the fuge chamber pretty well. should I remove half?

Peter Eichler · 08/14/2007, 01:02 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by luv951
Thanks again Peter,

I am not sure that I am 'overfeeding.' However, I should have mentioned that this is a fowlr tank with a porc. puffer in it that is rapidly getting too large. (bigger tank is waiting in the wings) They are very messy eaters, but he only gets meat about two to three times a week. The rest, he eats nori, and at least two or three days, he gets nothing. Not so much overfeeding, as just a dirty swimming potato that makes a mess of his meals ; )

So, is it better to have a smaller clump of chaeto? Right now, the ball is about the size of a volleyball and fills the fuge chamber pretty well. should I remove half?

I would, if you can get a ball of it to tumble and then trim is back when it starts to fill the chamber that would be best IMO. Also, you you trim it back try to fluff it up a bit so water can flow through it better.

rustybucket145 · 08/14/2007, 01:19 PM

The whole point of chaeto is that you remove some of it on a frequent basis. About once a month I trim (pull) mine back to the size of a softball. By a month later it's back the size of a basketball.

Prune away!! The bristleworms are dead, try to remove the larger ones so they don't pollute your system. Just yank out some chaeto. If it gets too thick it will begin to accumulate detrius as you have described b/c it will begin to act like a foam filter, you do not want this to happen. Prune it back, it will grow back fast (if you didn't kill it by running it under freshwater.......)

Jar*Head · 08/14/2007, 01:29 PM

I agree with increase the flow. I have the same problem with my refugium (48x48x30) approx 300G. I have been battling with red slime algea for almost 3 months. I have couple power head in side the fuge but it doesn't help. So i increase the turnover rate, within a week. I notice the red slime algae slowly disappear.

MrSpiffy · 08/14/2007, 01:50 PM

Wow! Those bristleworms might make me think twice about grabbing chaeto without gloves.

yoboyjdizz · 08/14/2007, 02:00 PM

Whats the best way to prune it? I never knew you should prune it often, i have a decent sized refuge and have been just letting it grow. I had some algae problems i added a maxi jet 900gph and its been getting alot better.

MrSpiffy · 08/14/2007, 02:04 PM

If you don't prune it, you're not removing the nitrates/phosphates/etc. from your system. You have to prune it, or it'll compact itself in the fuge and be useless, as it can't grow any more. Keep it pruned so that it can kinda float around and tumble a bit.

yoboyjdizz · 08/14/2007, 02:07 PM

What do you guys use to prune yours?

rustybucket145 · 08/14/2007, 02:20 PM

my hands..

Grab each side of the 'ball' or 'clump' with your hands and pull in opposing directions. It will tear, split or whatever it does... You can't really hurt it (other than possibly bathing in freshwater

)

yoboyjdizz · 08/14/2007, 02:29 PM

Sounds good to me.

luv951 · 08/14/2007, 03:34 PM

Mr. Spiffy - When I noticed the worms, it was a ball of them about the size of an egg, just all clumped together. Then I started seeing more and more of them. Then I got that feeling that something was crawling up my leg......then I grabbed some salad tongs.

Thanks to all for the replies. I never new that trimming it was so vital. I have let it do its own thing for about two years now and never really saw good growth - now I know why.

Right now, the chaeto looks fine, plus I saw more bristle worms running around the fuge, so I think (hope) I am done seeing the fallout of my freshwater bath.....I love learning the hard way!!!

08/12/2007, 03:48 PM	#1
luv951 Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Washougal, WA Posts: 841	Help! I just messed up my fuge....I think??? OK, so I have a 20 gallon long for my fuge. I have some live rock rubble in there and a big ball of Chaeto. I was looking at the chaeto and it was overgrown with green and red slime algae, plus it was full (and I mean FULL) of detritus. After thinking about it a lot, I finally decided that I would remove the chaeto ball and run it under some water to get the detritus out. What I did not realize until I was running it under water is that the ball of chaeto was inhabited by hundred of bristle worms. At least thats what I think they are - they have dozens of legs, are anywhere from 1/4 inch to 2 inches long and kinda reddish brown. Look like a milipede. As I was cleaning the chaeto, I found a 'colony' of dozens to hundreds of these things. I had been running the water (tap water) for about a good two minutes. I tried to get the temp close but was not exact by any means. None of the worms were moving....did I kill them? I put the ball back in the fuge pretty quickly after seeing them, but now I am wondering, did I just put a hundred little dead animals in my system???? Please help, what should I do? Get new chaeto and scrap that ball? leave it? Thanks everyone : ) __________________ "Ummm, you do realize that you just took a picture of a cup of poo, right?" -my wife

08/12/2007, 04:18 PM	#3
luv951 Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Washougal, WA Posts: 841	I had one of those d'oh moments right after I saw the worms, when I realized that I should have swished it in saltwater. Should I throw it out, or leave it back in? __________________ "Ummm, you do realize that you just took a picture of a cup of poo, right?" -my wife

08/12/2007, 04:24 PM	#4
ludnix Registered Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: California Posts: 3,031	Put it back in. The chaeto is probably fine once it gets back in saltwater. The bristleworms will return in time. __________________ -Eric Sutter Current Tank Info: 14g Biocube

08/12/2007, 04:33 PM	#5
luv951 Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Washougal, WA Posts: 841	The dead bodies are no concern? I just looked and unfortunately, they are all white now, and still not moving - dead. Does this make me a mass murderer? __________________ "Ummm, you do realize that you just took a picture of a cup of poo, right?" -my wife

08/12/2007, 05:03 PM	#6
Peter Eichler Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Milwaukee Posts: 6,081	If you have bristleworms, detritus, and nuisance algae in your Chaeto you are feeding way too much and don't have nearly enough flow around the chaeto. __________________ April 2015 TOTM

08/12/2007, 04:11 PM	#2
Kiel'thalin Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Albany, Georgia Posts: 575	Yes running tap water over your cheato might kill the organisms that inhabit it. There is a problem if nuisance algae is growing all over your cheato. Maybe a increase in flow or adding a small cleanup crew down there might help. Next time just take out a gallon of tank water and swish the cheato in it until you get the nuisance algae and detrius under control. I would take a turkey baster and suck out any detrius that has settled in the sump and maybe remove the rock rubble completely.

08/12/2007, 07:14 PM	#7
luv951 Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Washougal, WA Posts: 841	How much flow should I have. My return pump is doing around 700 GPH and is in the third chamber of a basic, three chamber sump, fuge in the middle. I figured the flow through was not high enough, so there are two small powerheads in the fuge section (about 160 gph each) Do I need more, and if so, how much? __________________ "Ummm, you do realize that you just took a picture of a cup of poo, right?" -my wife

08/13/2007, 10:58 PM	#8
Peter Eichler Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Milwaukee Posts: 6,081	That should be enough flow, however you need to do something to keep the Chaeto from collecting detritus. I'd suggest pruning it regularly to keep it from getting compacted to the point where it can collect detritus. Also, I can't help but think you're overfeeding with that many bristleworms, so be more conscious of that. __________________ April 2015 TOTM

08/14/2007, 11:51 AM	#9
luv951 Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Washougal, WA Posts: 841	Thanks again Peter, I am not sure that I am 'overfeeding.' However, I should have mentioned that this is a fowlr tank with a porc. puffer in it that is rapidly getting too large. (bigger tank is waiting in the wings) They are very messy eaters, but he only gets meat about two to three times a week. The rest, he eats nori, and at least two or three days, he gets nothing. Not so much overfeeding, as just a dirty swimming potato that makes a mess of his meals ; ) So, is it better to have a smaller clump of chaeto? Right now, the ball is about the size of a volleyball and fills the fuge chamber pretty well. should I remove half? __________________ "Ummm, you do realize that you just took a picture of a cup of poo, right?" -my wife

08/14/2007, 01:19 PM	#11
rustybucket145 Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: valdosta, ga Posts: 3,707	The whole point of chaeto is that you remove some of it on a frequent basis. About once a month I trim (pull) mine back to the size of a softball. By a month later it's back the size of a basketball. Prune away!! The bristleworms are dead, try to remove the larger ones so they don't pollute your system. Just yank out some chaeto. If it gets too thick it will begin to accumulate detrius as you have described b/c it will begin to act like a foam filter, you do not want this to happen. Prune it back, it will grow back fast (if you didn't kill it by running it under freshwater.......) __________________ 400gals of various tanks in the same system. Current Tank Info: 2 175w MH, 2 VH0 Actinics, Lots of Live Rock, tons of copepods, a Fat Mandarin Goby, Niger Trigger, Yellow Tang, Falco Hawkfish, Bi-Color Pseudo, numerous soft, SPS and LPS Corals

08/14/2007, 01:29 PM	#12
Jar*Head Premium Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Orange County, CA Posts: 8,630	I agree with increase the flow. I have the same problem with my refugium (48x48x30) approx 300G. I have been battling with red slime algea for almost 3 months. I have couple power head in side the fuge but it doesn't help. So i increase the turnover rate, within a week. I notice the red slime algae slowly disappear. __________________ Steve Tankless. Current Tank Info: 480g peninsula

08/14/2007, 01:50 PM	#13
MrSpiffy Premium Member Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Loveland, CO Posts: 1,300	Wow! Those bristleworms might make me think twice about grabbing chaeto without gloves.

08/14/2007, 02:00 PM	#14
yoboyjdizz Registered Member Join Date: May 2005 Location: Elk Grove, CA Posts: 3,137	Whats the best way to prune it? I never knew you should prune it often, i have a decent sized refuge and have been just letting it grow. I had some algae problems i added a maxi jet 900gph and its been getting alot better.

08/14/2007, 02:04 PM	#15
MrSpiffy Premium Member Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Loveland, CO Posts: 1,300	If you don't prune it, you're not removing the nitrates/phosphates/etc. from your system. You have to prune it, or it'll compact itself in the fuge and be useless, as it can't grow any more. Keep it pruned so that it can kinda float around and tumble a bit.

08/14/2007, 02:07 PM	#16
yoboyjdizz Registered Member Join Date: May 2005 Location: Elk Grove, CA Posts: 3,137	What do you guys use to prune yours?

08/14/2007, 02:20 PM	#17
rustybucket145 Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: valdosta, ga Posts: 3,707	my hands.. Grab each side of the 'ball' or 'clump' with your hands and pull in opposing directions. It will tear, split or whatever it does... You can't really hurt it (other than possibly bathing in freshwater ) __________________ 400gals of various tanks in the same system. Current Tank Info: 2 175w MH, 2 VH0 Actinics, Lots of Live Rock, tons of copepods, a Fat Mandarin Goby, Niger Trigger, Yellow Tang, Falco Hawkfish, Bi-Color Pseudo, numerous soft, SPS and LPS Corals

08/14/2007, 02:29 PM	#18
yoboyjdizz Registered Member Join Date: May 2005 Location: Elk Grove, CA Posts: 3,137	Sounds good to me.

08/14/2007, 03:34 PM	#19
luv951 Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Washougal, WA Posts: 841	Mr. Spiffy - When I noticed the worms, it was a ball of them about the size of an egg, just all clumped together. Then I started seeing more and more of them. Then I got that feeling that something was crawling up my leg......then I grabbed some salad tongs. Thanks to all for the replies. I never new that trimming it was so vital. I have let it do its own thing for about two years now and never really saw good growth - now I know why. Right now, the chaeto looks fine, plus I saw more bristle worms running around the fuge, so I think (hope) I am done seeing the fallout of my freshwater bath.....I love learning the hard way!!! __________________ "Ummm, you do realize that you just took a picture of a cup of poo, right?" -my wife