HELP! They're dying!

[mdignard]

I need help!

I have a 180 gallon display tank with a 55 gallon refugium. I have a wave-maker and a good skimmer. The tank was set up with 125 lbs of live rock. (A Lawnmower Blenny stowed away in one of the rocks). All my water levels were good--ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, ph, salt, etc. I have about 1150 watts of light--actinic, halogen, and moon. Everything seemed good, so I added 2 tiny Percula Clownfish, a scallop, an anemone, a fire shrimp, and a ribbon eel. Well, the Lawnmower Blenny is the only one that will eat. He seems very happy. Within a few days, the scallop died, the anemone died, and one of the Clownfish died; none of them will eat. I have tried misis shrimp, brine shrimp, and copepods. I don't know what to do next. Does anybody have ideas on how to de-stress the fish?

Marty

[DrBegalke]

What was your acclimation procedure?

The first things I would start with is turning off/way down the lights and retesting the water.

[DawnOctopus]

Did you add all of the new guys at one time?

[jhendu]

I second the acclimation question but also, was your source of all the new livestock the same? Any chance that their source may have resulted in their death?

[Toddrtrex]

To Reef Central

The scallop dieing doesn't shock me at all, since they shouldn't be kept. Though I am a bit surprised that it died as quickly as it did. It could have been on its way out before you got it, and the stress of being moved pushed it over the edge.

What type of anemone was it?

And like others have asked how did you acclimate everything? And what are the actually numbers for your water parameters?

[OnoIgotICH]

I dont blame you at all...blame you where you got it from...did they eat there?

[pimpinitup6969]

yeah its really strange that you are loseing everything so fast if your parameters are all good sounds like an issue with the supplier

Matt

[Toddrtrex]

Oh and I would keep an eye on that ribbon eel, very very poor survival rates.

[WarrenG]

Originally posted by mdignard
I have about 1150 watts of light--actinic, halogen.... Does anybody have ideas on how to de-stress the fish?

Try it with about 300w of light. I hope you don't really have halogen lights.

What are the measured amounts for nitrate, phosphate, salinity, ph, temperature, and hardness?

[Harley-J]

what test kits are you using to check your params?? and what is good?

[nanoDude]

We really need a but more info to be much help. What are the actual results of your tests? How long has the system been up and running?

[sundancer]

Does anybody have ideas on how to de-stress the fish?

Yes,get a QT tank. Put all your purchases in there for at least 4 weeks. This way you can control their environment to make them feel save, to recoup from being pulled out of the ocean,to put on weight,to learn to eat prepared foods. In short,to learn to be an aquarium pet. If they don't eat or get sick don't put them in your 180. Buy one type of fish at a time. Don't buy fish that don't belong together and don't buy difficult fish to start. Stocking a tank takes much more thought and planning than most people think. It's mostly a one way street. Make a mistake and it is very difficult to make U turns. Well, you can take this opportunity to start over. Recheck your water. Rethink your livestock list and create a stocking plan. There is A LOT that you can do to de-stress fish and it's all worth doing because your fish will thank you instead of dying on you.

[mdignard]

Okay, here's the info.

I am using the Instant Ocean test kits with the little silver powder packets.

Ph 8.0 - 8.2
Ammonia < 0.2
Nitrites < 0.2
Nitrates < 10
Salt 1.024
Temp 76 - 77

The lighting may be a problem. I have 3 halides (not halogens) at 250W and 4 blue actinic at 96W and some tiny moonlights at night. I have the blue actinic set for 8am - 8pm and the halides set for 10am - 6pm. I was told that these were the best settings, but it could be too much.

I got all the fish from the same aquarium store, and they have a lot of saltwater tanks. They don't seem to have a problem with stock dying. I have seen some fish there for 2 or 3 weeks. Because it was such a large tank and all the levels looked good, they said that adding 4 or 5 at the beginning would not be a problem. I have 125 lbs of live rock and 80 lbs of live sand. I checked the waterwhen the scallop, anemone, and clownfish died, and the levels were still on the lowest level of the charts...so I think the biological cycle is doing okay.

[nanoDude]

Your ammonia, nitrites, and nitrates should be undetectable when the cycle is finished. It sounds like your tank isn't ready for fish yet.

[mdignard]

Those numbers are the lowest on the scales...so I put them for when no trace showed.

[driftin]

I'm not surprised by the anemone in a young tank.

Do you know what the fish were eating while at the store?

[nanoDude]

Originally posted by mdignard
Those numbers are the lowest on the scales...so I put them for when no trace showed.

Oh, sorry. How long has the system been up and running?

[stuccodude]

i heard of a guy that could not keep anything in his tank and it was a lack of a shield from his lights, he cooked everything even though temp was at 80, good luck

[Amoore311]

Everything seemed good, so I added 2 tiny Percula Clownfish, a scallop, an anemone, a fire shrimp, and a ribbon eel. Well, the Lawnmower Blenny is the only one that will eat. He seems very happy. Within a few days, the scallop died, the anemone died, and one of the Clownfish died; none of them will eat. I have tried misis shrimp, brine shrimp, and copepods. I don't know what to do next. Does anybody have ideas on how to de-stress the fish?

How small were the clowns? Babies are notoriously harder to get to eat than adolescent clowns. The anenome and scallop I'm really not suprised about. They could have both died very quickly from poor acclimation. Or they could have been sick/weak already.

You basically bought a handful of tough/extremely hard specimens to keep all at one time.

Avoid baby clowns unless you see them eat at the LFS.

Scallops are filter feeders that require more phytoplankton than we can provide w/o fowling our water.

Anenomes should be avoided in new tanks. They are also very sensitive to acclimation and parameter change. Same thing here with the Fire Shrimp.

Ribbon Eels are also notoriously tough to coax into eating prepared foods.


Lesson that should be learned here is to research as much as you can first. It's unfortunate that this is all happening to you, but now you know the importance research.

[rustybucket145]

How long has the tank been setup? Did you add all of them at the same time?

[OnoIgotICH]

As you probably noticed, theres not much you can really do. if everything checks out. I wouldn't really blame the lfs, but those fish probably weren't the best out of the batch. hopfully your lfs will 'help' you out next time, sheet happens you know?

Feed your ribbon eel very small feeders. he'll go for it.

[MrSpiffy]

I second the question about your lighting, too. Are you using halogens or halides? There's a huge difference. And are your lights shielded for UV protection?

Granted, that's not the only issue at hand. Your tank is very young, you've picked difficult specimens, and you added them all at once without using quarantine practices.

Anemones: Don't usually do well in new tanks. Wait until your tank has matured before adding an anemone.

Ribbon eels: Extremely difficult to get eating in captivity. Usually they're a lost cause. Similar to Moorish Idols, Batfish, etc.

Flame Scallops: Require daily (even multiple times daily) target feeding of phytoplankton. So much phyto would probably foul your water, as Amoore311 mentioned.

Unless you have a lot of experience, start with easier fish/inverts. Clowns would work, but maybe look for a mated pair or larger clowns. And wait on shrimp until things have gotten more mature and settled in.

[HoopsGuru]

Fish, even sick ones, rarely die within a few days without some sort of outward symptoms....did you notice anything? (spots, streaks, etc.). The fact that a wide range of animals died (not just fish)leads me to believe there is something amiss with your water or you acclimation procedures. A disease would not have wiped out from fish to inverts.

For example, many fish stores keep their holding tanks at a much lower salinity to save costs. If you brought livestock home and only acclimated them for a short period or for temperature only that could lead to this kind of shock and rapid dieoff. Something is amiss, I would not jump to blame the LFS for this, as an anemone or scallop just a few days from death would have been obvious in their holding tanks.

Evaluate and provide more info.

[rebodi]

so I added 2 tiny Percula Clownfish, a scallop, an anemone, a fire shrimp, and a ribbon eel.

If your LFS sold you all of that at one time its time to start surfing the internet. How did you acclimate your new residents? All of the creatures you mentioned are very sensitive to rapid chemical changes. I wouldnt want to have to acclimate all of your purchases at one time.

[zippopunk1]

try a marine betta u cant kill those fish with a shotgun lol