coraline?

woogy · 03/22/2008, 01:09 PM

ok I tested my alk first with a red sea kit and it was yellow which means it was low...0-1.6

so I find out that carbonate hardness is the same as alkalinity and I did have a test kit by API which came out to be 8dKH, which is in the normal range.

Other parameters are:

pH=8.3
calcium=440
phosphate=0
alk=8
nitrate=10

I know I still have to test for mag and see what that is but I think most of my #'s are in a decent range so why do I not see any coraline algae growth?

I do water changes weekly of 4-5gallons so my trace elements should be in check...I was told to keep my lighting off for a few days due to the nasty brown algae caused by new lights

kevin2000 · 03/22/2008, 01:18 PM

How old is the tank? How much live rock?

Your water parameters are fine ... tweaking it isn't going to make much of a difference.

Most new aquarist are anxious for coralline - so long as your doing regular water changes and have some live rock (or other initial source of coralline) you should get plenty of coralline over time - patience may be in order.

Also ... I noted that you have T-5's .. coralline tends to do better in subdued lighting so your light setup may retard growth a bit .. as such even more patience may be in order.

ultimatemusky · 03/22/2008, 01:21 PM

Did you have any to begin with? On live rock? Or did you use anything to seed coraline?

ultimatemusky · 03/22/2008, 01:22 PM

Guess I have to type faster

Aquarist007 · 03/22/2008, 01:40 PM

doesn't that bug you---and probably your computer is hanging because the other posts are in line in front of you trying to access a band width starved server.
One time the other night I did a water change while the computer hung----sorry that's a little exaggerated but I couldn't resist

woogy · 03/22/2008, 01:44 PM

kevin2000

Tanks is over 5years old...I have over 30#s of LR...just added 16#s to it that have some coraline over it on tues...but this is already turning brown...so this is why I am shutting my lights off for a few days

And for the T5s...do you feel this lighting is too much for my tank?...the idea behind it was to eventually keep some sps.

xJake · 03/22/2008, 01:48 PM

Coralline algae almost has a mind of it's own. The tank I run at my school wasn't growing coralline on anything for almost 2 months after I set it up. Then when preparing the tank for the weekend one Friday I noticed some small spots of coralline on the overflow and the hydor koralia pumps. When I got back that Monday they were half covered in the dark purple stuff. A week later the whole overflow and both pumps were completely covered and it had begun to grow on the back wall of the tank.
Basically don't worry about test kit numbers and what should be happening just keep dosing your Cal./Alk. and let the coralline do it's thing. Just be patient.

suzimcmullen · 03/22/2008, 01:49 PM

I'm getting coralline growth all over my tank that is only 2 months old. It's coming on very rapid. I do just a small change every day that some days is probably only 1/2 gallon and somedays as much as a whole gallon. I fill a 5 gallon bucket and most goes through my quarantine tank and I save the last little bit for the reef tank. My tests all come out nice too. But I figure fresh water daily can't hurt. It's only a 14 gallon biocube and I won't ever have a skimmer. I have about 20-22 pounds of rock in it and don't use any mechanical filtration. I have used a little bit of purpleup but not daily and to any great degree. I just dribble a little in when I think of it.

Suzi

kevin2000 · 03/22/2008, 02:07 PM

A couple of thoughts.

Two things that tend to impede coralline are phosphates and nusiance algae's (hard to get coralline to grow when the rock surfaces are already covered with other algae's or cyano).

Intense lighting may slow down coralline growth but its not going to stop it (plenty of people use t-5's and MH's and their tanks are loaded with coralline).

mixed_reefer · 03/22/2008, 02:35 PM

Check your magnesium maybe, coraline uses mag at 4x the rate of stony corals i believe so that possibly could be a factor if its low.

drparker · 03/22/2008, 02:45 PM

A few months back I started testing for mg and I was just at 1000. I've now boosted it to 1300 and have seen an explosion in my coraline growth and calcium usage

tmz · 03/22/2008, 07:24 PM

Do you have any urchins? How about large nos of asterina stars? They can decimate coraline.

woogy · 03/22/2008, 07:37 PM

yes i do...but there are places in the tank he can't get to

Roy G. Biv · 03/22/2008, 07:45 PM

When I clean my tank, I use a razor blade on the glass. Half way through I need a new blade, the first is dull from all the scraping. This is every 1-2 weeks. Buy a calcium reactor. It will keep your Alk and Calcium in order.

woogy · 03/22/2008, 07:48 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Pmolan
When I clean my tank, I use a razor blade on the glass. Half way through I need a new blade, the first is dull from all the scraping. This is every 1-2 weeks. Buy a calcium reactor. It will keep your Alk and Calcium in order.

my alk is 8 and calcium is 440...do I really need a calcium reactor in my 29gallon?

Aquarist007 · 03/22/2008, 07:49 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by woogy
kevin2000

Tanks is over 5years old...I have over 30#s of LR...just added 16#s to it that have some coraline over it on tues...but this is already turning brown...so this is why I am shutting my lights off for a few days

And for the T5s...do you feel this lighting is too much for my tank?...the idea behind it was to eventually keep some sps.

check your phosphates and ammonia levels--16 lbs of live rock in a 29 gal tank is bound to have an effect

Toad42013 · 03/22/2008, 07:53 PM

tagging along. I have this same problem. I know I have a phosphates problem. Im working on getting it in check.

woogy · 03/22/2008, 07:54 PM

phosphate and ammonia is 0...I have been keeping an eye on all levels in the tank since adding the new rock.

kevin2000 · 03/22/2008, 08:23 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by woogy
phosphate and ammonia is 0...I have been keeping an eye on all levels in the tank since adding the new rock.

Since you don't have coralline and you apparently have plenty of other nuisance algae .. chances are excellent that your tank has plenty of phosphates. Remember that your test kit only registers inorganic phosphates which are quickly consumed/sequestered by algae/cyano so that many phosphate laden tanks will show zero using a phosphate test kit. Kinda of a cruel joke but often the best method of determining whether you have phosphates is just looking at the tank.

woogy · 03/22/2008, 08:42 PM

ok then...are all the phosphate kits just false?...what should I do to bring this down lower?....I always wondered if my sand is the problem...it use to be in my 55gallon and then went into my 29gallon...like i said the tank is well over 5+years...maybe I should just start from scratch again

tmz · 03/22/2008, 09:05 PM

Old sand could be a source for phosphates.

woogy · 03/22/2008, 09:06 PM

bummer...should I change the sand and how?

woogy · 03/22/2008, 09:08 PM

also I hear about those sand sifting stars which I know will die because they will eat everything up in the sandbed but in my case will this help?

tmz · 03/22/2008, 09:10 PM

Regarding lighting: I just added a 90 g tank to my system. It is 24 x24 x36 inches and lighted with 2x250mh14k and 180w actinic. Coraline growth is excellent after 2 months. In the past I have experienced better growth under pc than mh go figure.

kevin2000 · 03/22/2008, 09:17 PM

Phosphate test kits are often best used to test the water going into the tank rather than testing the water within the tank (if the tank has an algae or cyano issue).

Calcium carbonate can bind phosphates which can subsequently leach back into the water column ... an old aragonite/crushed coral substrate which has prolonged exposure to phosphates can become an ongoing source of chronic algae issues (sometimes called old tank syndrome). Whether this is your problem is unknown but something to consider.

Controlling phosphates boils down to minimizing their import while maximizing their export.

Major source for phosphates are tap water and food. If your using tap water switch to ro/di. All food contains phosphates but some flake food is loaded with phosphates .. if your using flake switch to frozen .. if your using frozen make sure you thaw and rinse well before using. Also - consider cutting back of feeding.

Export methods include water changes, skimming, phosphate binders (phosban etc). Macro algae will help consume phosphate and Kalwasser will help precipitate it out of the water column.

Hope this helps.

03/22/2008, 01:09 PM	#1
woogy Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Western PA Posts: 986	coraline? ok I tested my alk first with a red sea kit and it was yellow which means it was low...0-1.6 so I find out that carbonate hardness is the same as alkalinity and I did have a test kit by API which came out to be 8dKH, which is in the normal range. Other parameters are: pH=8.3 calcium=440 phosphate=0 alk=8 nitrate=10 I know I still have to test for mag and see what that is but I think most of my #'s are in a decent range so why do I not see any coraline algae growth? I do water changes weekly of 4-5gallons so my trace elements should be in check...I was told to keep my lighting off for a few days due to the nasty brown algae caused by new lights

03/22/2008, 01:21 PM	#3
ultimatemusky Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: wisconsin Posts: 462	Did you have any to begin with? On live rock? Or did you use anything to seed coraline? __________________ Goooz--Frabba........Ok, that didn't work I'm still ticked off. Current Tank Info: 75 gal w/lps, zoas, shrooms, RO/DI, 500watt halide+ 108watt t5, 1500+gph flow, 10g fuge w/chaeto/rubble rock, 10gal sump w/rock, 125#'s+ live rock, 3.5" sand bed, 40 gal breeder frag tank w/250 watt halide & 192 watts actinic pc's

03/22/2008, 01:22 PM	#4
ultimatemusky Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: wisconsin Posts: 462	Guess I have to type faster __________________ Goooz--Frabba........Ok, that didn't work I'm still ticked off. Current Tank Info: 75 gal w/lps, zoas, shrooms, RO/DI, 500watt halide+ 108watt t5, 1500+gph flow, 10g fuge w/chaeto/rubble rock, 10gal sump w/rock, 125#'s+ live rock, 3.5" sand bed, 40 gal breeder frag tank w/250 watt halide & 192 watts actinic pc's

03/22/2008, 01:40 PM	#5
Aquarist007 Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Hamilton, Canada Posts: 28,240 Blog Entries: 1	doesn't that bug you---and probably your computer is hanging because the other posts are in line in front of you trying to access a band width starved server. One time the other night I did a water change while the computer hung----sorry that's a little exaggerated but I couldn't resist __________________ I prefer my substrates stirred but not shaken Current Tank Info: 150gal long mixed reef, 90gal sump, 60 gal refugium with 200 lbs live rock

03/22/2008, 07:24 PM	#12
tmz ReefKeeping Mag staff Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: West Seneca NY Posts: 27,691	Do you have any urchins? How about large nos of asterina stars? They can decimate coraline. __________________ Tom Current Tank Info: Tank of the Month , November 2011 : 600gal integrated system: 3 display tanks (120 g, 90g, 89g),several frag/grow out tanks, macroalgae refugia, cryptic zones. 40+ fish, seahorses, sps,lps,leathers, zoanthidae and non photosynthetic corals.

03/22/2008, 01:18 PM	#2
kevin2000 Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 3,805	How old is the tank? How much live rock? Your water parameters are fine ... tweaking it isn't going to make much of a difference. Most new aquarist are anxious for coralline - so long as your doing regular water changes and have some live rock (or other initial source of coralline) you should get plenty of coralline over time - patience may be in order. Also ... I noted that you have T-5's .. coralline tends to do better in subdued lighting so your light setup may retard growth a bit .. as such even more patience may be in order.

03/22/2008, 01:44 PM	#6
woogy Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Western PA Posts: 986	kevin2000 Tanks is over 5years old...I have over 30#s of LR...just added 16#s to it that have some coraline over it on tues...but this is already turning brown...so this is why I am shutting my lights off for a few days And for the T5s...do you feel this lighting is too much for my tank?...the idea behind it was to eventually keep some sps.

03/22/2008, 01:48 PM	#7
xJake Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 1,385	Coralline algae almost has a mind of it's own. The tank I run at my school wasn't growing coralline on anything for almost 2 months after I set it up. Then when preparing the tank for the weekend one Friday I noticed some small spots of coralline on the overflow and the hydor koralia pumps. When I got back that Monday they were half covered in the dark purple stuff. A week later the whole overflow and both pumps were completely covered and it had begun to grow on the back wall of the tank. Basically don't worry about test kit numbers and what should be happening just keep dosing your Cal./Alk. and let the coralline do it's thing. Just be patient.

03/22/2008, 01:49 PM	#8
suzimcmullen Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Midwest Posts: 890	I'm getting coralline growth all over my tank that is only 2 months old. It's coming on very rapid. I do just a small change every day that some days is probably only 1/2 gallon and somedays as much as a whole gallon. I fill a 5 gallon bucket and most goes through my quarantine tank and I save the last little bit for the reef tank. My tests all come out nice too. But I figure fresh water daily can't hurt. It's only a 14 gallon biocube and I won't ever have a skimmer. I have about 20-22 pounds of rock in it and don't use any mechanical filtration. I have used a little bit of purpleup but not daily and to any great degree. I just dribble a little in when I think of it. Suzi

03/22/2008, 02:07 PM	#9
kevin2000 Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 3,805	A couple of thoughts. Two things that tend to impede coralline are phosphates and nusiance algae's (hard to get coralline to grow when the rock surfaces are already covered with other algae's or cyano). Intense lighting may slow down coralline growth but its not going to stop it (plenty of people use t-5's and MH's and their tanks are loaded with coralline).

03/22/2008, 02:35 PM	#10
mixed_reefer Moved On Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: St. Louis, MO Posts: 516	Check your magnesium maybe, coraline uses mag at 4x the rate of stony corals i believe so that possibly could be a factor if its low.

03/22/2008, 02:45 PM	#11
drparker Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Palatine, IL Posts: 2,652	A few months back I started testing for mg and I was just at 1000. I've now boosted it to 1300 and have seen an explosion in my coraline growth and calcium usage

03/22/2008, 07:37 PM	#13
woogy Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Western PA Posts: 986	yes i do...but there are places in the tank he can't get to

03/22/2008, 07:45 PM	#14
Roy G. Biv Premium Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: New Jersey Posts: 3,646	When I clean my tank, I use a razor blade on the glass. Half way through I need a new blade, the first is dull from all the scraping. This is every 1-2 weeks. Buy a calcium reactor. It will keep your Alk and Calcium in order.

03/22/2008, 07:53 PM	#17
Toad42013 Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Colorado Posts: 185	tagging along. I have this same problem. I know I have a phosphates problem. Im working on getting it in check.

03/22/2008, 07:54 PM	#18
woogy Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Western PA Posts: 986	phosphate and ammonia is 0...I have been keeping an eye on all levels in the tank since adding the new rock.

03/22/2008, 08:42 PM	#20
woogy Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Western PA Posts: 986	ok then...are all the phosphate kits just false?...what should I do to bring this down lower?....I always wondered if my sand is the problem...it use to be in my 55gallon and then went into my 29gallon...like i said the tank is well over 5+years...maybe I should just start from scratch again

03/22/2008, 09:05 PM	#21
tmz ReefKeeping Mag staff Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: West Seneca NY Posts: 27,691	Old sand could be a source for phosphates. __________________ Tom Current Tank Info: Tank of the Month , November 2011 : 600gal integrated system: 3 display tanks (120 g, 90g, 89g),several frag/grow out tanks, macroalgae refugia, cryptic zones. 40+ fish, seahorses, sps,lps,leathers, zoanthidae and non photosynthetic corals.

03/22/2008, 09:06 PM	#22
woogy Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Western PA Posts: 986	bummer...should I change the sand and how?

03/22/2008, 09:08 PM	#23
woogy Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Western PA Posts: 986	also I hear about those sand sifting stars which I know will die because they will eat everything up in the sandbed but in my case will this help?

03/22/2008, 09:10 PM	#24
tmz ReefKeeping Mag staff Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: West Seneca NY Posts: 27,691	Regarding lighting: I just added a 90 g tank to my system. It is 24 x24 x36 inches and lighted with 2x250mh14k and 180w actinic. Coraline growth is excellent after 2 months. In the past I have experienced better growth under pc than mh go figure. __________________ Tom Current Tank Info: Tank of the Month , November 2011 : 600gal integrated system: 3 display tanks (120 g, 90g, 89g),several frag/grow out tanks, macroalgae refugia, cryptic zones. 40+ fish, seahorses, sps,lps,leathers, zoanthidae and non photosynthetic corals.

03/22/2008, 09:17 PM	#25
kevin2000 Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 3,805	Phosphate test kits are often best used to test the water going into the tank rather than testing the water within the tank (if the tank has an algae or cyano issue). Calcium carbonate can bind phosphates which can subsequently leach back into the water column ... an old aragonite/crushed coral substrate which has prolonged exposure to phosphates can become an ongoing source of chronic algae issues (sometimes called old tank syndrome). Whether this is your problem is unknown but something to consider. Controlling phosphates boils down to minimizing their import while maximizing their export. Major source for phosphates are tap water and food. If your using tap water switch to ro/di. All food contains phosphates but some flake food is loaded with phosphates .. if your using flake switch to frozen .. if your using frozen make sure you thaw and rinse well before using. Also - consider cutting back of feeding. Export methods include water changes, skimming, phosphate binders (phosban etc). Macro algae will help consume phosphate and Kalwasser will help precipitate it out of the water column. Hope this helps.