Keeping calcium level constant

[Ronny#66]

I have been using Kent turbo cal 1 tsp for 5 gal water change weekly . I tries the A and B liquid but found this hard to reguate with it. Is there an easier cheaper way than the Kent Turbo cal ?

[Ronny#66]

Darned typos

[Aquarist007]

what are your tank parameters for calcium, magnesium , pH and alkalinity?
if your magnesium is not 1300 ppm then you will have trouble sustaining your calcium level over 400ppm

The best thing for you Ronny would be to get on a 2 part dosing system like b-ionics. It does an excellent job of maintaining stability in cal and alkalinity.
I can tell you how to set it up but I need to know the present readings for cal mag and alk in your tank

[HookedOnReefing]

You can purchase affordable bulk quantity 2 part and magnesium kits at bulkreefsupply.com

[seapug]

Kalkwasser is a bit more labor intensive but works great and has a number of beneficial side-effects.

[Toddrtrex]

Originally posted by seapug
Kalkwasser is a bit more labor intensive but works great and has a number of beneficial side-effects.

Yep. Plus, for me it also serves as a cheap auto top off -- at least for a couple of days until I have to refill it.

I also have to use 2 part. I pour in the same amount each night and my levels stay constant.

[OceanDweller]

Kalk is really good, you could look into a smaller calcium reactor for your upcoming 75

[tmz]

Tubo calcium is calcium chloride. If you use it alone without a buffer , it is just as if you used the calcium part of a two part additive without the carbonate part. Calcifying organisms including corals need both calcium and carbonate.They can't use one without the other. If you keep dosing just the calcium chloride you will throw you tank out of balance.Kalkwasser( limewater) is calcium hydroxide which is a balnced supplement which will meet the need for both calcium and carbonate. For more ingformation you should spoend some time reading the articles by Randy holmes Farely in the reef chemistry forum.

[snorvich]

I agree with tmz completely. If it were me . . .

I would opt for:

a calcium reactor
dosing ESV two part (actually 3 part)
dosing home made two part (actually 3 part)
dosing kalkwasser

in this order. More control of the top options, less with the bottom but less expensive. Note that you have to keep your magnesium around NSW of 1300 (1380) or you will have trouble keeping your calcium up.

[Aquarist007]

Originally posted by snorvich
I agree with tmz completely. If it were me . . .

I would opt for:

a calcium reactor
dosing ESV two part (actually 3 part)
dosing home made two part (actually 3 part)
dosing kalkwasser

in this order. More control of the top options, less with the bottom but less expensive. Note that you have to keep your magnesium around NSW of 1300 (1380) or you will have trouble keeping your calcium up.

IMO this is overkill on a 25gal system. I guess I have had the advantage of seeing a pic of his tank. He does not have a major draw on calcium and his pH is not a problem
I still think his mag level is low and needs to be brought up to 1300ppm
Then I would use Kent Turbo calcium to bring up the calcium level over 400 ppm, Kent super dKh to bring up the alkalinity to 10 dkH and Kent Tech-M to bring up the mag to 1300ppm
Having done that I would use the two part b-ionics as directed on the containers for one week
Remeasure and adjust accordingly
Continue for another week---measure an readjus
by a month this tank will be stable

[Tswifty]

Hey Ronny, a good place to start is to measure your current Ca, Alk, and Mag.

Don't dose anything for 3 days, then measure the levels again.

This should give you a good idea of your tank's daily draw. Once you figure out how much your tank consumes on a daily basis, then it will be much easier to determine a course of action.

Also, depending on your brand of salt mix... weekly water changes on a tank that size may make it hard to keep your levels high (especially mag) unless you are buffering up your water change water's levels to match that of your tank.

[Aquarist007]

Originally posted by Tswifty8
Hey Ronny, a good place to start is to measure your current Ca, Alk, and Mag.

Don't dose anything for 3 days, then measure the levels again.

This should give you a good idea of your tank's daily draw. Once you figure out how much your tank consumes on a daily basis, then it will be much easier to determine a course of action.

Also, depending on your brand of salt mix... weekly water changes on a tank that size may make it hard to keep your levels high (especially mag) unless you are buffering up your water change water's levels to match that of your tank.

+1 on that

here is a comparison chart of what's in the different salt mixes
http://reefcentral.com/forums/showth...readid=1287118

[tmz]

ccurate.

[tmz]

Something ate my post. Sorry . Here it is again.

Good advice above.

Test before you dose anything and doublecheck your measures. Hobby grade test can be off. water changes may be all you need for a while. But if you wan't to encourage some coraline and coral growth maanging relatively high calcium and alkalinity is key.

If you want to get a good understanding of reef chemistry ,particulary the ionic choreography of calcium, carbonate and magnesium, the articles by Randy homes Farely in the Reef Chemistry Forum are excellent. They can be a bit difficult and will take some time and rereads but they are worth the effort.

I think a calcium reactor would be very difficult to use efficiently on a 20g system . They are best used on larger systems. A calcium reactor uses CO2 injected water to dissolve calcium carbontae( a balnced additive) in doing so it dispenses an effluent with a ph of about 6.7. This can lead to chronic or sporadic low ph problems in general but particulary in a small system with limited opportunity for gas exchange. I use a calcium reactor on my 500g system with good results but I offset the potential low ph with kalk (limewater ) dosing.

Kalk(limewater) which forms calcium hydroxide when mixed wtih fresh water is a balnced supplement for calcium and alkalinity. It can be dosed in a number of ways: mixed with fresh water and added to the aquarium, dripped, dosed with a dosing pump from a still resevoir or via a kalk reactor. You can only dose a small amount of kalk at anyone time or you will spike your ph. The effluent has a ph of about 12.4. I dose kalk for top off from a still resevoir ( at night to offset normal ph nightime depression).If I had to choose only one thing to dose it would be kalk in my system.

Dosing calcium chloride and carbonate in a two part system is probablly the most efficient and convenient way for you to manage a 20 g tank. Calcium chloride( turbo calcium, other hobby brands, two part additives such as bionic or esv) is concentrated and willl not effect ph. It is important to maintain a blance between the calcium and the carbonate and since calcium chloride contains no carbonate ,the part two of a 2 part is needed in the right proportions.

To iterate ,the most important thing for you to avoid at this point is overdosing any of the above creating a ph spike and precipitation event or an imbalance in calcium and alkalinity. Go slowly , study the reef chemistry and only dose what you test for.

Good Luck

[Ronny#66]

Wow I think ya all missed my point. My cal is 460 I just add a tsp of Kent turbo cal to the 5 gal water change . This had kept my cal at 460 . I add 1 tsp of Kent reef builder for the alk and this keeps it at 9-10 kdh .I have never tested my Magnesium . Was just wanting an easier and cheaper way. The alk was 7 kdh this week . I brought it up using a tsp of reef builder. I tried the part A and part B but found it hard to rais cal this way . This is what tank looks like right now. Doing it the wayIexplained .

[Ronny#66]

So what you think ?

[Ronny#66]

Never tested for Magnesium was told didn't need to with soft and mushrooms i supose this was wrong too it came from LFS !!

[Aquarist007]

Originally posted by Ronny#66
Wow I think ya all missed my point. My cal is 460 I just add a tsp of Kent turbo cal to the 5 gal water change . This had kept my cal at 460 . I add 1 tsp of Kent reef builder for the alk and this keeps it at 9-10 kdh .I have never tested my Magnesium . Was just wanting an easier and cheaper way. The alk was 7 kdh this week . I brought it up using a tsp of reef builder. I tried the part A and part B but found it hard to rais cal this way . This is what tank looks like right now. Doing it the wayIexplained .

IMO you can't really complain about your costs of maintaining your tank. Just using a tsp of those chemicals every water change can't cost anything at all--you must get months out of a container of each.
Having said that
depending on your salt mix I would think you could get away with not dosing at all

[tmz]

There is about 3x as much magnesium as there is calcium in sea water. So with a light bioload of calcifying organisms the magnesium will deplete very slowly. You do have sustantial coraline growlth though and it uses magnesium.. When the corals or coraline or other calcifying organisms lay out calcium carbonate they use calcium, carbonate and magnesium. Since there is so much more magnesium it depletes more slowly but still needs replenishment after a priod of 6 months to a year .

The problem with using turbo calcium and buffer is that you may never get the proportions or timing quite right . The two part additives are balanced more easily . As for a cheaper way , I used Prestone driveway heat( a dow product) an anhydrous calcium chloride and baking soda for carbonate. As noted in my earlier post above follow the 2 part recipie articles bly Randy Holmes Farley in the Chemistry forum.

As for missing the point. I don't think you made the point in your first post. You simply noted you were dosing turbo calcium with no mention of buffer ,levels or testing. It would be helpful if you gave a little more information off the top. Thanks and good luck

[Ronny#66]

Didnt really mean to be rude on missing the point. LOOK no typos my daughter in law is typing this.

[Aquarist007]

Originally posted by Ronny#66
Didnt really mean to be rude on missing the point. LOOK no typos my daughter in law is typing this.

for all the corraline on the glass sides===I highly recommend a pinchusion urchin or two

[Ronny#66]

Can I put a pinchusion in this 25 gal ? Will it disturb anyhing eat something ect. ? I thought that we all want coraline algie.

[Ronny#66]

I use reefcrystals salt it only tests 380 for calcium Dkh 7 i use 1 tsp turbo cal weekly to keep cal 460-480 and one tsp kent reef builder for the alalinity seems to have worked so far . will get mag test though. By the way foster @ smith has deal on reefcrystals I think 28 bucks 160 gal mix.

[Aquarist007]

Originally posted by Ronny#66
I use reefcrystals salt it only tests 380 for calcium Dkh 7 i use 1 tsp turbo cal weekly to keep cal 460-480 and one tsp kent reef builder for the alalinity seems to have worked so far . will get mag test though. By the way foster @ smith has deal on reefcrystals I think 28 bucks 160 gal mix.

sound like a plan

[Ronny#66]

Do you see a problem with how I'm raising my cal and alk ??