running skimmerless tank?

Moonstream · 08/28/2008, 05:11 PM

my skimmer has been taking up a massive amount of room in my 75g reef, and I often think that the tank would be fine w/o it, I actually ran the system without it for several weeks with good results, and I have been wondering if I commited to doing water changes (planning to do a 20g water changes weekly and I would also grow massive amounts of macro algaes in the fuge.

would this work okay? I am hoping to keep a little bit of everything (my main interest is SPS and zoas, and I also love LPS, mushrooms, softies, clams, ect)...

Moonstream · 08/28/2008, 05:24 PM

bump

Capt_Cully · 08/28/2008, 05:24 PM

That is how many of the nano-reefkeepers do it. They go skimmerless and rely on water changes. I'd say if you're RELIGIOUS about water changes, you could get away with it.

FishNFun · 08/28/2008, 05:31 PM

/\ What he said. Just dont get lazy with the water changes. And that's assuming you're not an over-feeder or have any messy eaters.

Moonstream · 08/28/2008, 05:37 PM

none of my fish are overly messy, and I do plan to be as religious as possible with water changes. if after a few months my corals arent doing well I will definetly get a HOB skimmer.

Moonstream · 08/28/2008, 06:22 PM

bumpity bopp

in_flight · 08/28/2008, 06:58 PM

are you using the room for something else that you'd forego the benefits of a skimmer?

Moonstream · 08/28/2008, 07:03 PM

I want to spread the rock out, get a good light, and get some more macro algae. I have been thinking about maybe getting a smaller HOB skimmer, but in the meantime I am going to run skimmerless.

Rustylugnuts · 08/28/2008, 07:55 PM

I've been running skimmerless for about a month on my 20. The xenia lets me know when to change out 5 gallons. It's only a tempory tank till I get the 40 runnin. Once that's setup I'll be on the hunt for an Octo DNW-150.

crabbejoe · 08/28/2008, 08:16 PM

I've been running a 55 skimmerless for about 6 months. I change about 10 gallons every two weeks. The only problem I'm getting is a film on the surface of the water at times. But not all the time. I have softies and a couple lps. But I'm seeing that it really is just much easier with a skimmer. I probably won't keep it skimmerless much longer.

Moonstream · 08/28/2008, 08:25 PM

it might be hard w/o a skimmer because you have an eel... also, the surface scum is from not having enough surface agitation, ponit a few PHs at it and it should go away.

crabbejoe · 08/29/2008, 04:59 AM

I'm just saying, you'll be fine without a skimmer, but life is easier with one.

sterling18 · 08/29/2008, 06:18 AM

If you go skimmerless, bulk up on your live rock, or just add dry base rock a month in advance. Add more macro also. You should be able to get away from have to do water changes on a weekly basis too.

Most nano's don't have a sump and refugium. If you have both, bulk up on those and you can turn your skimmer off. Remember, you have replace whatever export your skimmer was doing with live rock and macro. If done correctly, you should be able to just go as if you had a skimmer.

This is just my opinion.

mcbaes72 · 08/29/2008, 06:58 AM

I ran a skimmer-less tank for about six years...no water changes either, just top off w/ RO water every day. I got away w/ it since I had a low bio-load (three fish in a 50 gal) and only hardy corals (mushrooms and polyps) + clean up crew and chaeto macro in sump and main display. Amazing that I got away w/ doing that for so long. Only downside to that...it looked like a giant refugium, hardly a display tank to show off and the water was slightly discolored, probably from yrs of macro w/ no skimming is my guess.

I upgraded my tank after moving and now use a combo of skimming and chaeto in sump w/ 10K bulb and reverse daylight. Sure there's extra noise w/ a downdraft skimmer and pump, but I'm gonna stick w/ this for a while. Only thing I'm debating is whether I should do water changes bi-monthly -OR- no water changes at all and supplement tank w/ trace elements. From doing extensive research on RC, most reefers seem to prefer sw changes as the better of the two.

sterling18 · 08/29/2008, 09:16 AM

mcbaes72,

I believe if you use carbon, that might have resolved that water color. Not saying it's best, but I just thought about your water comment and said, why not carbon. But you are correct, if you want something to live, that will do, if you want something to thrive, then do it all the way.

But if it was a FOWLR, with the same bio load, then yea, I think you could get away with it.

miwoodar · 08/29/2008, 10:12 AM

This guy removed his skimmer a year before these pictures were taken. I am inclined to believe that his collection of mature fast growing corals keep his water stripped pretty clean.

http://haaga.aqua-web.org/082006/index.htm

illal · 08/29/2008, 11:33 AM

ive always got better results with a skimmer! eventually we all get lazy and tired of doing large waterchanges every week and they can add up too! $$$... i say if u have any sps a skimmer is a must otherwise if your religous about the water changes its possible

tank o tang · 08/29/2008, 11:33 AM

without a skimmer and not enough agitation (scum on surface) make sure tank has enough oxygen for your fish.

Moonstream · 08/29/2008, 11:37 AM

I have decided to remove the 40br and replace it instead with a 20H sump and a fuge, the size of which I have not yet decided on.

Moonstream · 08/29/2008, 11:37 AM

forgot to add, I will be keeping the skimmer. it will go in the sump.

mcbaes72 · 08/30/2008, 07:56 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by sterling18
mcbaes72,

I believe if you use carbon, that might have resolved that water color. Not saying it's best, but I just thought about your water comment and said, why not carbon. But you are correct, if you want something to live, that will do, if you want something to thrive, then do it all the way.

But if it was a FOWLR, with the same bio load, then yea, I think you could get away with it.

I think you're right, it probably would've worked if I just tried it. I never ran carbon to clean up my old tank. I may or may not run it on my new tank since I read somewhere than Emporer Angels don't do well w/ carbon...will have to research that further.

mcbaes72 · 08/30/2008, 08:05 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Moonstream
forgot to add, I will be keeping the skimmer. it will go in the sump.

I think it's a good idea that you plan on running a skimmer along w/ a refugium. The best of both worlds, IMO. You may wanna consider a place for media, too (i.e. carbon, nitrate remover, etc). I recently added PHoSAR to lower PO4 levels since mine was .5 ppm and seemed kinda high.

08/28/2008, 05:11 PM	#1
Moonstream Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: NYC Posts: 2,581	running skimmerless tank? my skimmer has been taking up a massive amount of room in my 75g reef, and I often think that the tank would be fine w/o it, I actually ran the system without it for several weeks with good results, and I have been wondering if I commited to doing water changes (planning to do a 20g water changes weekly and I would also grow massive amounts of macro algaes in the fuge. would this work okay? I am hoping to keep a little bit of everything (my main interest is SPS and zoas, and I also love LPS, mushrooms, softies, clams, ect)...

08/28/2008, 05:24 PM	#3
Capt_Cully Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Syracuse, NY Posts: 13,574	That is how many of the nano-reefkeepers do it. They go skimmerless and rely on water changes. I'd say if you're RELIGIOUS about water changes, you could get away with it. __________________ People say cars are a bad investment. Those people don't have reef tanks. Current Tank Info: 120, Radion Gen 2 Pro x 2

08/28/2008, 07:55 PM	#9
Rustylugnuts Powdered Toast Man Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Peoria, IL Posts: 813	I've been running skimmerless for about a month on my 20. The xenia lets me know when to change out 5 gallons. It's only a tempory tank till I get the 40 runnin. Once that's setup I'll be on the hunt for an Octo DNW-150. __________________ And now back to my regularly scheduled lurking. Drill It! Current Tank Info: Buncha parts and tanks of various size. Nothing currently running :(

08/28/2008, 08:16 PM	#10
crabbejoe Premium Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Little Chute, WI Posts: 707	I've been running a 55 skimmerless for about 6 months. I change about 10 gallons every two weeks. The only problem I'm getting is a film on the surface of the water at times. But not all the time. I have softies and a couple lps. But I'm seeing that it really is just much easier with a skimmer. I probably won't keep it skimmerless much longer. __________________ Joe Current Tank Info: 20 gallon reef, 75 gallon FOWLR

08/29/2008, 04:59 AM	#12
crabbejoe Premium Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Little Chute, WI Posts: 707	I'm just saying, you'll be fine without a skimmer, but life is easier with one. __________________ Joe Current Tank Info: 20 gallon reef, 75 gallon FOWLR

08/28/2008, 05:31 PM	#4
FishNFun Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Columbus, OH Posts: 521	/\ What he said. Just dont get lazy with the water changes. And that's assuming you're not an over-feeder or have any messy eaters.

08/28/2008, 05:37 PM	#5
Moonstream Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: NYC Posts: 2,581	none of my fish are overly messy, and I do plan to be as religious as possible with water changes. if after a few months my corals arent doing well I will definetly get a HOB skimmer.

08/28/2008, 06:22 PM	#6
Moonstream Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: NYC Posts: 2,581	bumpity bopp

08/28/2008, 06:58 PM	#7
in_flight Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Toronto, Canada Posts: 70	are you using the room for something else that you'd forego the benefits of a skimmer?

08/28/2008, 07:03 PM	#8
Moonstream Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: NYC Posts: 2,581	I want to spread the rock out, get a good light, and get some more macro algae. I have been thinking about maybe getting a smaller HOB skimmer, but in the meantime I am going to run skimmerless.

08/28/2008, 08:25 PM	#11
Moonstream Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: NYC Posts: 2,581	it might be hard w/o a skimmer because you have an eel... also, the surface scum is from not having enough surface agitation, ponit a few PHs at it and it should go away.

08/29/2008, 06:18 AM	#13
sterling18 WMAS and HVReef Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: UT Posts: 519	If you go skimmerless, bulk up on your live rock, or just add dry base rock a month in advance. Add more macro also. You should be able to get away from have to do water changes on a weekly basis too. Most nano's don't have a sump and refugium. If you have both, bulk up on those and you can turn your skimmer off. Remember, you have replace whatever export your skimmer was doing with live rock and macro. If done correctly, you should be able to just go as if you had a skimmer. This is just my opinion.

08/29/2008, 06:58 AM	#14
mcbaes72 -Aidan's Daddy. Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Vallejo, CA Posts: 779	I ran a skimmer-less tank for about six years...no water changes either, just top off w/ RO water every day. I got away w/ it since I had a low bio-load (three fish in a 50 gal) and only hardy corals (mushrooms and polyps) + clean up crew and chaeto macro in sump and main display. Amazing that I got away w/ doing that for so long. Only downside to that...it looked like a giant refugium, hardly a display tank to show off and the water was slightly discolored, probably from yrs of macro w/ no skimming is my guess. I upgraded my tank after moving and now use a combo of skimming and chaeto in sump w/ 10K bulb and reverse daylight. Sure there's extra noise w/ a downdraft skimmer and pump, but I'm gonna stick w/ this for a while. Only thing I'm debating is whether I should do water changes bi-monthly -OR- no water changes at all and supplement tank w/ trace elements. From doing extensive research on RC, most reefers seem to prefer sw changes as the better of the two.

08/29/2008, 09:16 AM	#15
sterling18 WMAS and HVReef Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: UT Posts: 519	mcbaes72, I believe if you use carbon, that might have resolved that water color. Not saying it's best, but I just thought about your water comment and said, why not carbon. But you are correct, if you want something to live, that will do, if you want something to thrive, then do it all the way. But if it was a FOWLR, with the same bio load, then yea, I think you could get away with it.

08/29/2008, 10:12 AM	#16
miwoodar Likey the bikey Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Colorado Posts: 3,371	This guy removed his skimmer a year before these pictures were taken. I am inclined to believe that his collection of mature fast growing corals keep his water stripped pretty clean. http://haaga.aqua-web.org/082006/index.htm __________________ Mike On hiatus. I'm either out riding my bicycle, playing with my family, or throwing ferts in my planted tank. Or working. I hope I'm not doing that though. Current Tank Info: 140 DIY Cube

08/29/2008, 11:33 AM	#17
illal Registered Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Tamarac, Fl Posts: 5,700	ive always got better results with a skimmer! eventually we all get lazy and tired of doing large waterchanges every week and they can add up too! $$$... i say if u have any sps a skimmer is a must otherwise if your religous about the water changes its possible __________________ -AL

08/29/2008, 11:33 AM	#18
tank o tang Thread Lurker Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: CT Posts: 1,527	without a skimmer and not enough agitation (scum on surface) make sure tank has enough oxygen for your fish. __________________ A 5 gallon bucket of water dosen't look like much till it's on your living room floor Current Tank Info: 180gal

08/29/2008, 11:37 AM	#19
Moonstream Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: NYC Posts: 2,581	I have decided to remove the 40br and replace it instead with a 20H sump and a fuge, the size of which I have not yet decided on.