sump build question

saltysteven · 10/29/2008, 02:28 PM

sump build question
well since i cant find a non tempered 55 locally - i was thinking of doing two 30 gal and connecting them
How should i go about connecting them- cut holes and put in pipe? what size? is there a easier way?

id like my sump to contain:
protein skimmer than bubble wall than return than refugium also flowing into the return area.

pretty much a standard sump with skimmer return and refug.

but whats the best way the make this out of 2 30 gals?

faded1004 · 10/29/2008, 02:39 PM

it isn't too hard to drill glass... just make sure to have the right tools. diamond drill bit (ebay has a few good cheap ones)... may be just drill a nice bridge tube. like connect both with a 1.5" pcv tube with bulkheads. should give you nice flow through both tanks.

put may be in this order? just a suggestion...

drain , skimmer, bridge, fuge, retun pump...

hahahaha... simple pic...

saltysteven · 10/29/2008, 03:39 PM

i guess i was thinking more of this

water enters on left 75% in skimmer
water enters on right 25% in refug

the small hole in the middle is the exit for return.
the bridge is one way but i thought there might be other ways to do this.
so 1.5 pvc should be good?

faded1004 · 10/29/2008, 03:57 PM

hahaha, yours look alot better... , but yea... i think 1.5" on the RC calculator is rated for a 1300 gph flow rate? of you need more... then just add another... should be fine...

this setup looks like it would be a budget setup... try it out? you can always remove the builkheads and stuff... try it out and give your self room to correct any errors, like tank to tank space... you should try to use threaded bulkheads and couplers so it can be removable...

saltysteven · 10/29/2008, 07:02 PM

yes i plan on putting in a union so i could move the two tanks around if need be.
i just need to find non tempered tanks. every one who is selling them used doesnt know wht they are. tempered glass is my main issue

justilorah · 10/29/2008, 07:06 PM

i have had many 55 gallon tanks and only the bottom glass was tempered.

faded1004 · 10/29/2008, 08:37 PM

yea, alot of tanks aren't really tempered... dont for get the polarized sunglasses trick... you can easily see tempered glass from regular glass...

therealfatman · 10/30/2008, 08:33 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by saltysteven

i guess i was thinking more of this

water enters on left 75% in skimmer
water enters on right 25% in refug

the small hole in the middle is the exit for return.
the bridge is one way but i thought there might be other ways to do this.
so 1.5 pvc should be good?

Your getting very close. Your skimmer compartment should be no bigger than needed to hold the skimmer and any needed pumps for the skimmer. Only raw water should flow into the skimmer compartment. Your skimmers discharge should be into the bubble compartment not into the skimmer compartment. The overflow from the skimmer compartment should be minimal.

You do not want excess overflow water or skimmer discharge water flowing into the skimmer compartment. Your right about a small amount of flow going into the refugium tank and having it overflow directly into the return pump compartment.

What you missed is that you need a third branch from your overflow drain that will handle all the excess water that is not needed by the skimmer compartment or the refugium. This third branch needs no ball valve as it must take all the water that is excess and flow it straight to the return pump chamber.

I have found the best overflow drain method method is to use two "T" fittings one a top the other with the horns being up and down and the noses sideways. The lower horn has a ball valve and feeds the skimmer. The excess water backs up to the nose branch which has a ball valve and it feeds the refugium. The excess water from these two valves back up and feeds the pump return directly without a control valve needed. The larger your return pump is the larger your flow directly into your return pump chamber.

The refugium should take up the full second tank (no extra chamber or baffles) and the overflow should be two drilled holes (redundancy to prevent water on flor if one drain got plugged)at the level of overflow. There overflow pipes should be at approximately the height level of the skimmer baffle wall overflow baffle.

If your tanks are typical tanks 30 gallon glass tanks such as Aqueon or AGA etc. and if they are rectangle tanks the side walls will not be tempered. However nearly all rectangular glass tanks 37 gallon and larger,excluding the 40 gallon breeder tank by AGA, (Aqueon) have tempered bottom glass.

saltysteven · 10/30/2008, 11:03 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by faded1004
yea, alot of tanks aren't really tempered... dont for get the polarized sunglasses trick... you can easily see tempered glass from regular glass...

i didnt think so but the last 4 55s ive come across were tempered all around. i called aga and they said unless the tank was bought separately its tempered. they mean like not in a kit at petco with heater light rocks - everything. all those pet store kit tanks she said are tempered.
i just cant seem to locate one in my area

used

saltysteven · 10/30/2008, 11:49 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by therealfatman
Your getting very close. Your skimmer compartment should be no bigger than needed to hold the skimmer and any needed pumps for the skimmer. Only raw water should flow into the skimmer compartment. Your skimmers discharge should be into the bubble compartment not into the skimmer compartment. The overflow from the skimmer compartment should be minimal.

You do not want excess overflow water or skimmer discharge water flowing into the skimmer compartment. Your right about a small amount of flow going into the refugium tank and having it overflow directly into the return pump compartment.

What you missed is that you need a third branch from your overflow drain that will handle all the excess water that is not needed by the skimmer compartment or the refugium. This third branch needs no ball valve as it must take all the water that is excess and flow it straight to the return pump chamber.

I have found the best overflow drain method method is to use two "T" fittings one a top the other with the horns being up and down and the noses sideways. The lower horn has a ball valve and feeds the skimmer. The excess water backs up to the nose branch which has a ball valve and it feeds the refugium. The excess water from these two valves back up and feeds the pump return directly without a control valve needed. The larger your return pump is the larger your flow directly into your return pump chamber.

The refugium should take up the full second tank (no extra chamber or baffles) and the overflow should be two drilled holes (redundancy to prevent water on flor if one drain got plugged)at the level of overflow. There overflow pipes should be at approximately the height level of the skimmer baffle wall overflow baffle.

If your tanks are typical tanks 30 gallon glass tanks such as Aqueon or AGA etc. and if they are rectangle tanks the side walls will not be tempered. However nearly all rectangular glass tanks 37 gallon and larger,excluding the 40 gallon breeder tank by AGA, (Aqueon) have tempered bottom glass.

thanks for the response!
A few things- my skimmer will just get raw water 75%
and i wont need a third chamber. my water will flow through it drain and will split itself at a Y. the water isnt forced in any direction by gravity, so after the split itll head to the refug which will have a ball joint to regulate the amount of water at both exits.
The skimmer will only have enough room for it itself. The skimmer exit is before the bubble wall to prevent bubbles from going into the main tamk.
im not understanding this-
" Your skimmers discharge should be into the bubble compartment not into the skimmer compartment. The overflow from the skimmer compartment should be minimal"
"You do not want excess overflow water or skimmer discharge water flowing into the skimmer compartment."

also can you draw this?
> "I have found the best overflow drain method method is to use two "T" fittings one a top the other with the horns being up and down and the noses sideways. The lower horn has a ball valve and feeds the skimmer. The excess water backs up to the nose branch which has a ball valve and it feeds the refugium. The excess water from these two valves back up and feeds the pump return directly without a control valve needed. The larger your return pump is the larger your flow directly into your return pump chamber."

and yes the refug should take up the 2nd tank- i thought of that after. i can pipe the over flow straight down into the return chamber in the first tank.

justilorah · 10/30/2008, 12:23 PM

thats how i bought one of my 55's and drilled the back for an glass-holes internal overflow with no problems and it ia an aga tank. i know that the bottom glass is tempered.

saltysteven · 10/31/2008, 01:04 PM

i took a little time to draw it up and i really have this as a plan - i hope it works.

not_sponsored · 10/31/2008, 01:18 PM

^^ I like that idea, the one posted earlier won't get much (if any) flow to the refugium on the far left side.

As far as plumbing both tanks together just be careful when moving the tanks in, make sure everything is square when the bulkheads are put in to preven the glass from cracking. I'm not sure if uniseals would be better in this situation because they do have some play in them.

saltysteven · 10/31/2008, 01:39 PM

thanks.
the earlier one just didnt show the pipes flowing into the two sumps- it was the same idea though

NanoReefWanabe · 11/01/2008, 11:21 AM

i am pretty sure 1.5" PVC wont handle 1300GPH in the horizontal position...i would guess closer to 40% of that...

also dont forget to put some sort of Union or something in the refuge feed line... so you can remove it too if need be...

also if you are putting a union in the "link" then you will want to bush it up to a 2" union or so as the 1.5" will cause further restrictions

looks good otherwise...

10/29/2008, 02:28 PM	#1
saltysteven Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: bethany, ct Posts: 851	sump build question sump build question well since i cant find a non tempered 55 locally - i was thinking of doing two 30 gal and connecting them How should i go about connecting them- cut holes and put in pipe? what size? is there a easier way? id like my sump to contain: protein skimmer than bubble wall than return than refugium also flowing into the return area. pretty much a standard sump with skimmer return and refug. but whats the best way the make this out of 2 30 gals?

10/29/2008, 02:39 PM	#2
faded1004 Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: cypress, ca Posts: 2,445	it isn't too hard to drill glass... just make sure to have the right tools. diamond drill bit (ebay has a few good cheap ones)... may be just drill a nice bridge tube. like connect both with a 1.5" pcv tube with bulkheads. should give you nice flow through both tanks. put may be in this order? just a suggestion... drain , skimmer, bridge, fuge, retun pump... hahahaha... simple pic... Last edited by faded1004; 10/29/2008 at 02:48 PM.

10/29/2008, 07:06 PM	#6
justilorah Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: pa Posts: 98	i have had many 55 gallon tanks and only the bottom glass was tempered. __________________ Justin Lorah

10/30/2008, 12:23 PM	#11
justilorah Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: pa Posts: 98	thats how i bought one of my 55's and drilled the back for an glass-holes internal overflow with no problems and it ia an aga tank. i know that the bottom glass is tempered. __________________ Justin Lorah

10/29/2008, 03:39 PM	#3
saltysteven Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: bethany, ct Posts: 851	i guess i was thinking more of this water enters on left 75% in skimmer water enters on right 25% in refug the small hole in the middle is the exit for return. the bridge is one way but i thought there might be other ways to do this. so 1.5 pvc should be good?

10/29/2008, 03:57 PM	#4
faded1004 Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: cypress, ca Posts: 2,445	hahaha, yours look alot better... , but yea... i think 1.5" on the RC calculator is rated for a 1300 gph flow rate? of you need more... then just add another... should be fine... this setup looks like it would be a budget setup... try it out? you can always remove the builkheads and stuff... try it out and give your self room to correct any errors, like tank to tank space... you should try to use threaded bulkheads and couplers so it can be removable...

10/29/2008, 07:02 PM	#5
saltysteven Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: bethany, ct Posts: 851	yes i plan on putting in a union so i could move the two tanks around if need be. i just need to find non tempered tanks. every one who is selling them used doesnt know wht they are. tempered glass is my main issue

10/29/2008, 08:37 PM	#7
faded1004 Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: cypress, ca Posts: 2,445	yea, alot of tanks aren't really tempered... dont for get the polarized sunglasses trick... you can easily see tempered glass from regular glass...

10/31/2008, 01:04 PM	#12
saltysteven Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: bethany, ct Posts: 851	i took a little time to draw it up and i really have this as a plan - i hope it works.

10/31/2008, 01:18 PM	#13
not_sponsored Registered Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: Hiding Posts: 341	^^ I like that idea, the one posted earlier won't get much (if any) flow to the refugium on the far left side. As far as plumbing both tanks together just be careful when moving the tanks in, make sure everything is square when the bulkheads are put in to preven the glass from cracking. I'm not sure if uniseals would be better in this situation because they do have some play in them.

10/31/2008, 01:39 PM	#14
saltysteven Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: bethany, ct Posts: 851	thanks. the earlier one just didnt show the pipes flowing into the two sumps- it was the same idea though

11/01/2008, 11:21 AM	#15
NanoReefWanabe Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Barrie, Ontario, Canada Posts: 6,639	i am pretty sure 1.5" PVC wont handle 1300GPH in the horizontal position...i would guess closer to 40% of that... also dont forget to put some sort of Union or something in the refuge feed line... so you can remove it too if need be... also if you are putting a union in the "link" then you will want to bush it up to a 2" union or so as the 1.5" will cause further restrictions looks good otherwise...