Things keep dying

vblick · 03/14/2009, 12:48 PM

My emerald crabs, hermit crabs, and various snails keep dying on me.

I currently have the following setup:

24 gallon aqua pod
20 lbs of live rock
3" of substrate
sponge filter
bioballs

2 orange clownfish
1 valentini puffer
2 peppermint shrimp
6 small nassarius snails

Readings:
pH 8.2-8.4
Nitrate 0
Nitrite 0
Ammonia 0
Copper 0 (use tap water with aquasafe)
Salinity 1.025
water temp 78 deg
Calcium 400 ppm

I've had the tank for two months. The first month was just cycling with nothing in the tank besides live rock and live sand substrate. I added the cleaning crew mix of hermit crabs, emerald crab, and turbo snails after the 4 weeks of cycling. Emerald crab lived about a week and the turbo snails lasted about 3 weeks. I added the fish about 3 weeks ago along with more turbos, another emerald crab, and the peppermint shrimp. The puffer kept knocking the turbos on their back while I was at work so they eventually died because they were on their back for too long. The emerald crab died after 5 days. As of this week the hermit crabs that I bought a month ago started dying. I'm not sure what is going on here. From what i've been reading I didn't really need to feed them a special diet, they are just supposed to be good scavengers. My tank stopped growing diatom alge recently and the live rock is turing purple in places and is starting to grow green alge and moss like alge in the tank. I do weekly 3 gallon water changes in the tank and feed the fish daily with a mix of flake food and brine shrimp. You guys have any ideas or suggestions on how to keep the snails and crabs alive?

jasonrp104 · 03/14/2009, 12:52 PM

How do you acclimate your snails/crabs to your tank?

vblick · 03/14/2009, 12:57 PM

I float them in the bag for about 15 minutes to match the temperature. Then I check the salinity in the bag. If it differs from the salinity in my tank, I put them in a bowl and add about 1 cup of water from my tank into the bowl every 5 minutes for about 20 to 25 minutes.

interceptor · 03/14/2009, 01:15 PM

try getting rid of your valentini puffer they are known to pick on and eat snails, hermit crabs, arrow crabs, emerald crabs, and shrimp

returnofsid · 03/14/2009, 01:50 PM

Snails and crabs are very sensitive to changes in pH. Because of this, you should usually drip acclimate for 3 hours. Your acclimation is probably what's killing them, though it could also be your puffer.

agold11520 · 03/14/2009, 01:54 PM

Snails and crabs are great Puffer food! The puffer will also eat any coral you try to put in the tank. He gotta go!

jasonrp104 · 03/14/2009, 03:02 PM

They are right about the puffer, however, you haven't mentioned it eating any of them so I would check your acclimation first. If you slowly acclimate them to your tank they should arrive nice and healthy for the puffer to eat them

Butterz · 03/14/2009, 03:07 PM

I'll agree with what has been said above about acclimating them. Any crust invert should be acclimated slowly and for at least an hour. I use air line tubing and tie it in a knot to control water flow. I never seem to find valves when I need them.

I've put in 250 plus crabs in my tank total and never had one that died which wasn't a result of their gang fights.

jasonrp104 · 03/14/2009, 03:14 PM

Is that in your 72? That would be a sight to see

Butterz · 03/14/2009, 03:17 PM

I had a bad hair algae problem when I first started, so I ordered about 75 blue and 75 white legged hermit crabs to tackle the algae. Well, every morning I'd find pieces of crabs all over my live rock. The white ones were cheaper, but I liked the blue ones better, so I ordered more of those to take care of the rest of the white ones.

jasonrp104 · 03/14/2009, 03:27 PM

Got a pic? The DT at my lfs is a 300 with about 150 hermits in it and they are everywhere you look. I'd love to have a hermit loaded tank but they come with too many problems. I have enough trouble with 4 killing all my snails

Butterz · 03/14/2009, 03:53 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by jasonrp104
Got a pic? The DT at my lfs is a 300 with about 150 hermits in it and they are everywhere you look. I'd love to have a hermit loaded tank but they come with too many problems. I have enough trouble with 4 killing all my snails

No great pics of mass herds, but here's what feeding time looks like no more than 10 seconds when I put the food in.

CoRPS · 03/14/2009, 05:12 PM

I think it's funny the way people acclimate their snails. I used to drip mine for an hour or so, and then I watched the guy at the fish store plop them in right out of the bag. Now I just float them for a half hour and throw them in. Never had a single death that wasn't due to a hermit crab eating a snail.

troyman · 03/14/2009, 06:31 PM

ditch the bio balls put a bag of chemipure or pura complete in its place

vblick · 03/16/2009, 08:54 AM

Okay, i'm going to try the drip method and a chemipure bag. I was under the impression that if they died overnight or within the next day that I was doing something wrong with the acclimation process. I didn't realize it could take weeks for them to kill over. As far as the puffer goes, i've only seen him peck at the shells of the crabs/snails. I haven't seen him eating anything.

03/14/2009, 12:48 PM	#1
vblick Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 4	Things keep dying My emerald crabs, hermit crabs, and various snails keep dying on me. I currently have the following setup: 24 gallon aqua pod 20 lbs of live rock 3" of substrate sponge filter bioballs 2 orange clownfish 1 valentini puffer 2 peppermint shrimp 6 small nassarius snails Readings: pH 8.2-8.4 Nitrate 0 Nitrite 0 Ammonia 0 Copper 0 (use tap water with aquasafe) Salinity 1.025 water temp 78 deg Calcium 400 ppm I've had the tank for two months. The first month was just cycling with nothing in the tank besides live rock and live sand substrate. I added the cleaning crew mix of hermit crabs, emerald crab, and turbo snails after the 4 weeks of cycling. Emerald crab lived about a week and the turbo snails lasted about 3 weeks. I added the fish about 3 weeks ago along with more turbos, another emerald crab, and the peppermint shrimp. The puffer kept knocking the turbos on their back while I was at work so they eventually died because they were on their back for too long. The emerald crab died after 5 days. As of this week the hermit crabs that I bought a month ago started dying. I'm not sure what is going on here. From what i've been reading I didn't really need to feed them a special diet, they are just supposed to be good scavengers. My tank stopped growing diatom alge recently and the live rock is turing purple in places and is starting to grow green alge and moss like alge in the tank. I do weekly 3 gallon water changes in the tank and feed the fish daily with a mix of flake food and brine shrimp. You guys have any ideas or suggestions on how to keep the snails and crabs alive?

03/16/2009, 08:54 AM	#15
vblick Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 4	Okay, i'm going to try the drip method and a chemipure bag. I was under the impression that if they died overnight or within the next day that I was doing something wrong with the acclimation process. I didn't realize it could take weeks for them to kill over. As far as the puffer goes, i've only seen him peck at the shells of the crabs/snails. I haven't seen him eating anything. Last edited by vblick; 03/16/2009 at 09:21 AM.

03/14/2009, 12:52 PM	#2
jasonrp104 Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: vt Posts: 1,113	How do you acclimate your snails/crabs to your tank?

03/14/2009, 12:57 PM	#3
vblick Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 4	I float them in the bag for about 15 minutes to match the temperature. Then I check the salinity in the bag. If it differs from the salinity in my tank, I put them in a bowl and add about 1 cup of water from my tank into the bowl every 5 minutes for about 20 to 25 minutes.

03/14/2009, 01:15 PM	#4
interceptor Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: El Paso Texas Posts: 15	try getting rid of your valentini puffer they are known to pick on and eat snails, hermit crabs, arrow crabs, emerald crabs, and shrimp

03/14/2009, 01:50 PM	#5
returnofsid Registered Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Spokane, WA Posts: 3,852	Snails and crabs are very sensitive to changes in pH. Because of this, you should usually drip acclimate for 3 hours. Your acclimation is probably what's killing them, though it could also be your puffer.

03/14/2009, 01:54 PM	#6
agold11520 Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: NY Posts: 121	Snails and crabs are great Puffer food! The puffer will also eat any coral you try to put in the tank. He gotta go!

03/14/2009, 03:02 PM	#7
jasonrp104 Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: vt Posts: 1,113	They are right about the puffer, however, you haven't mentioned it eating any of them so I would check your acclimation first. If you slowly acclimate them to your tank they should arrive nice and healthy for the puffer to eat them

03/14/2009, 03:07 PM	#8
Butterz Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Iowa Posts: 174	I'll agree with what has been said above about acclimating them. Any crust invert should be acclimated slowly and for at least an hour. I use air line tubing and tie it in a knot to control water flow. I never seem to find valves when I need them. I've put in 250 plus crabs in my tank total and never had one that died which wasn't a result of their gang fights.

03/14/2009, 03:14 PM	#9
jasonrp104 Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: vt Posts: 1,113	Is that in your 72? That would be a sight to see

03/14/2009, 03:17 PM	#10
Butterz Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Iowa Posts: 174	I had a bad hair algae problem when I first started, so I ordered about 75 blue and 75 white legged hermit crabs to tackle the algae. Well, every morning I'd find pieces of crabs all over my live rock. The white ones were cheaper, but I liked the blue ones better, so I ordered more of those to take care of the rest of the white ones.

03/14/2009, 03:27 PM	#11
jasonrp104 Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: vt Posts: 1,113	Got a pic? The DT at my lfs is a 300 with about 150 hermits in it and they are everywhere you look. I'd love to have a hermit loaded tank but they come with too many problems. I have enough trouble with 4 killing all my snails

03/14/2009, 05:12 PM	#13
CoRPS Big Time Reefer Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: P-RINE Posts: 2,887	I think it's funny the way people acclimate their snails. I used to drip mine for an hour or so, and then I watched the guy at the fish store plop them in right out of the bag. Now I just float them for a half hour and throw them in. Never had a single death that wasn't due to a hermit crab eating a snail.

03/14/2009, 06:31 PM	#14
troyman Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: troy ny Posts: 1,025	ditch the bio balls put a bag of chemipure or pura complete in its place