Is there a such thing as reefsafe ich treatments?

oneoffcustom · 06/03/2009, 04:26 PM

I was curiouse if there was such a thing as a reef safe ich treatment. I have seen a few sites that have whats called reef safe ich treatments and was wondering did anyone ever use and have any success with these?

Now i know all about the freshwater dip, qting, hyposalinity.

I do not have a fish with ich but was just curiouse if anyone had any luck with these.

LTCrunch · 06/03/2009, 05:17 PM

I have found a product that works incredibly well. It is a probiotic that works great for mild ich cases and does wonders when used regularly. Its called Probiotic Marine Formula. Drs Foster and Smith sell it, Ive used it for years and have not had an Ich outbreak since! Check it out.

rkelman · 06/03/2009, 07:11 PM

No there is no reef safe ich treatment. Just alot of snake oils.

wetWolger · 06/03/2009, 07:39 PM

I think that most are snakeoils....but I did have good luck with an anti-parasite medication that is produced by seachem.

http://www.seachem.com/Products/prod...onidazole.html

It can be hard to find. But you soak the food in it with some garlic and they eat the stuff (instead of just pouring it in the water).

Do some searching, others seem to agree that it at least helps, some have had just as good of luck as I have. But there is nothing scientific backing it ether. All I know is that I have never had a fish stop showing symptoms on it's own (long term that is, obviously life cycle, blah, blah).

maynardjames · 06/03/2009, 09:31 PM

i have used chem marin stop parasites several times when first starting out. worked everytime with 5 day treatment. few times had a very bad outbreak. fed well with garlic soaked food & used product. worked for me anyway. not sure results others have had with product. i never had any inverts or fish die during treatment

danrobberg · 06/03/2009, 10:12 PM

I've used garlic with the food and a product called kickich. I don know who makes it my lfs sells it. its about 20 bucks. It took more than one treatment though. sounds like the other products mentioned work better

jenglish · 06/03/2009, 10:35 PM

There are several ich safe reef treatments out there

rkelman · 06/04/2009, 04:29 AM

"There are several ich safe reef treatments out there "

Yes just none that work.

You can mess around with foods and ich kick and garlic and whatever. But in the long run you will watch your fish get sick / maybe they will get better for a time. Until they are stressed and they get reinfected and die. Its just not worth it. QT and Copper or Hypo are the only PROVEN methods.

str8clownr · 06/04/2009, 08:01 AM

I used Kick-Ich, on my tank, i had to do it twice, but it definitely worked, my tang hasnt had ich in years, and neither have my other fish too.

but at 20 bucks a pop, it gets expensive, but it isnt as tedious/time consuming as hypo, qt, or copper

BigJay · 06/04/2009, 08:02 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by rkelman
"There are several ich safe reef treatments out there "

Yes just none that work.

That was the joke mate, "ich-safe" meaning it won't do anything to the parasite.

Now you've gone and made it not-funny anymore.

1DeR9_3Hy · 06/04/2009, 08:39 AM

Proven to work reef safe ich treatment:

Kordon's Ich Attack.

You can argue it all you want, but i have seen it work for years.

/thread

Nanz · 06/04/2009, 09:00 AM

Only quarantine with hyposalinity or copper will really work. If you QT all the fish in your tank and leave your tank free of fish for 12 weeks then the ich cycle will break and die on its own. I went through this process a year ago and donâ€™t have any ich my tank as of today.

Adding treatments to your tank to kill parasites is not the answer. Sooner or later its going to fail. I would rather make sure my tank is ich free rather than using a treatment that is only clouding the symptoms in my opinion.

There is much debate on this subject and some fish seem become immune to ich over time. Google Hyposalinity and you should find some treatments that are natural. Study the life cycle of ich and make your own decision. I believe alot of tank's healthiness is dependent upon bacteria and microorganisms which may be killed by your ich treatment.

Good Luck

oneoffcustom · 06/04/2009, 11:58 AM

Wow lots of replies. I actually do not have an ich outbreak as of yet, but i am anticipating on one. I have a 75 gallon tank that i will be using as my qt. The problem is i have all my live rock in the tank curing with the fish. My question now is i guess if i remove all my live rock from the tank will it cause the tank to cycle again or would the tank stay as normal? If the tank will not recycle i could use a copper treatment and all would be lovely. any one wanna touch that question?

oneoffcustom · 06/04/2009, 12:00 PM

the rock is cured its just in the tank as well

stuccodude · 06/04/2009, 12:20 PM

i had ich bad 2 years ago and used garlic extreme and within days the ich was gone but it couldnt have been the garlic, i was just lucky, just like when we go camping and the night before i pop a few cloves of garlic and the mosquitoes dont mess with me. luck.

sunsetSPS · 06/04/2009, 05:26 PM

I heard different fallow period for ich parasite to die: 6 weeks then 8 weeks then now 12 weeks? longer is safer but what is the time from real experiences? I know all reefers know how to say : keep your tank for ??? weeks to cure ich, but I guess not many ppl who know how to say it, actually had experienced themselves but rather heard or read from somewhere (yet from another ppl who heard/read from somewhere too). I'm not trying to offense anyone but just try to get some real info.

blennymower · 06/04/2009, 07:06 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by 1DeR9_3Hy
Proven to work reef safe ich treatment:

Kordon's Ich Attack.

You can argue it all you want, but i have seen it work for years.

/thread

how about a +1000 on this one...

I have always used Kordon's inch attach. It has always killed the ich with no harmful side affects to the corals I keep.

rkelman · 06/04/2009, 07:37 PM

"Now you've gone and made it not-funny anymore."

Aw. I missed it. Soooo sorry.

jenglish · 06/04/2009, 07:59 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by blennymower
how about a +1000 on this one...

I have always used Kordon's inch attach. It has always killed the ich with no harmful side affects to the corals I keep.

Snake oil, does absolutely nothing. It doesn't appear to hurt corals when they have studied but so far there is 0 evidence from any studies that it has any effect whatsoever on ich.

Rendos · 06/04/2009, 08:08 PM

Seachem's Metronidazole works great and is completely reef safe.

greenbean36191 · 06/04/2009, 08:15 PM

There are only three methods proven to treat ich- hyposalinity, copper, and tank transfer. None can be used in a reef tank.

None of the other treatments have been proven to work, though the active ingredients of many of them have been proven not to work in laboratory tests against Cryptocaryon. Steven Pro and others have also tested the reef safeness of a few of them and found that they don't live up to their claims.

Hobbyist reports are not reliable because there is no way to determine whether a fish is affected or not via visual inspection and even without any treatment most fish will develop resistance to the parasite after the initial round of parasites leave the fish (i.e. the spots disappear and don't come back). However, that does not equate to a cure because they still harbor a small number of parasites which can create future outbreaks. To determine whether a treatment is effective you have to do biopsies of the fish and determine if the parasite load is statistically different than for untreated fish.

snorvich · 06/04/2009, 08:25 PM

+1 I could not have said it better.

kb27973 · 06/04/2009, 11:51 PM

It still confounds me why people have so many problems and are so freaked out about Ich. Buy from a reputable dealer, feed your fish more than once a day (one or two cubes every other day ain't gonna cut it!) keep good water quality and you won't have a problem with disease. I buy 99% of my fish online and even after going through shipping if they start out healthy and you feed them things will be fine. In 10 years I have never had a fish die from disease, but I feed my fish a lot. Just my experience.

So to answer the question I would say the reef safe cure/prevention would be Food and water quality.

Ken

LargeAngels · 06/05/2009, 12:10 PM

+2. No, No and No again to any Reef Safe Ich products that have been PROVEN to work.

oneoffcustom · 06/05/2009, 12:11 PM

cool more info....

06/03/2009, 04:26 PM	#1
oneoffcustom Registered Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: houston texas Posts: 311	Is there a such thing as reefsafe ich treatments? I was curiouse if there was such a thing as a reef safe ich treatment. I have seen a few sites that have whats called reef safe ich treatments and was wondering did anyone ever use and have any success with these? Now i know all about the freshwater dip, qting, hyposalinity. I do not have a fish with ich but was just curiouse if anyone had any luck with these. __________________ Honey your are gonna be ****ed but... I really needed it!!! Current Tank Info: 5g Unknown destination!

06/03/2009, 05:17 PM	#2
LTCrunch Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Baltimore Posts: 216	I have found a product that works incredibly well. It is a probiotic that works great for mild ich cases and does wonders when used regularly. Its called Probiotic Marine Formula. Drs Foster and Smith sell it, Ive used it for years and have not had an Ich outbreak since! Check it out. __________________ .... yes, that will most likely catch on fire! Current Tank Info: 55 frag

06/03/2009, 07:39 PM	#4
wetWolger Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Colorado Posts: 1,955	I think that most are snakeoils....but I did have good luck with an anti-parasite medication that is produced by seachem. http://www.seachem.com/Products/prod...onidazole.html It can be hard to find. But you soak the food in it with some garlic and they eat the stuff (instead of just pouring it in the water). Do some searching, others seem to agree that it at least helps, some have had just as good of luck as I have. But there is nothing scientific backing it ether. All I know is that I have never had a fish stop showing symptoms on it's own (long term that is, obviously life cycle, blah, blah). __________________ cheers, jent d-_-b Current Tank Info: 66gal = 32x24x20

06/03/2009, 09:31 PM	#5
maynardjames Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: west tennessee Posts: 1,600	i have used chem marin stop parasites several times when first starting out. worked everytime with 5 day treatment. few times had a very bad outbreak. fed well with garlic soaked food & used product. worked for me anyway. not sure results others have had with product. i never had any inverts or fish die during treatment __________________ if your 555 Current Tank Info: 120 rr dual overflows, solarflare t5 fixture,octo extreme 200,vortech mp40w esx2. brs reactor for carbon, brs reactor for gfo, 40 gal breeder sump

06/03/2009, 10:35 PM	#7
jenglish Marquis de Carabas Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Evansville, IN Posts: 2,523	There are several ich safe reef treatments out there __________________ Jeremy Brown liquor never hurt anybody “Je n'ai pas besoin de cette hypothèse" Pierre-Simon Laplace I should want to cook him a simple meal, but I shouldn't want to cut into him, to tear the flesh, to wear the flesh, to be born unto new worlds where his flesh becomes my key. Current Tank Info: broken and dry

06/03/2009, 07:11 PM	#3
rkelman Registered Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Belleville, Ontario Canada Posts: 3,438	No there is no reef safe ich treatment. Just alot of snake oils.

06/03/2009, 10:12 PM	#6
danrobberg Registered Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: Buffalo NY Posts: 962	I've used garlic with the food and a product called kickich. I don know who makes it my lfs sells it. its about 20 bucks. It took more than one treatment though. sounds like the other products mentioned work better

06/04/2009, 04:29 AM	#8
rkelman Registered Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Belleville, Ontario Canada Posts: 3,438	"There are several ich safe reef treatments out there " Yes just none that work. You can mess around with foods and ich kick and garlic and whatever. But in the long run you will watch your fish get sick / maybe they will get better for a time. Until they are stressed and they get reinfected and die. Its just not worth it. QT and Copper or Hypo are the only PROVEN methods.

06/04/2009, 08:01 AM	#9
str8clownr Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: mia Posts: 619	I used Kick-Ich, on my tank, i had to do it twice, but it definitely worked, my tang hasnt had ich in years, and neither have my other fish too. but at 20 bucks a pop, it gets expensive, but it isnt as tedious/time consuming as hypo, qt, or copper

06/04/2009, 08:39 AM	#11
1DeR9_3Hy Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 2,575	Proven to work reef safe ich treatment: Kordon's Ich Attack. You can argue it all you want, but i have seen it work for years. /thread __________________ I hope it never catches on, I like having the oldest tank on here and I don't have to worry about calcification, bio pellets, Vodka dosing, DSBs, Chaetomorpha (I don't even know what that is) Carbonite hardness and all of these other things many people worry about. If I had to think about all of that stuff I would get a stroke. My test kit came in a wooden box and the directions say to keep in a cool chariott. I throw some food in the tank, wave hello to the fish and go out with my wife and have a nice glass of merlot with dinner. Have a great day but most of all, have fun. -PaulB Current Tank Info: 27 Gallon DAS softy/fish reef

06/04/2009, 09:00 AM	#12
Nanz Premium Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Ohio Posts: 1,389	Only quarantine with hyposalinity or copper will really work. If you QT all the fish in your tank and leave your tank free of fish for 12 weeks then the ich cycle will break and die on its own. I went through this process a year ago and donâ€™t have any ich my tank as of today. Adding treatments to your tank to kill parasites is not the answer. Sooner or later its going to fail. I would rather make sure my tank is ich free rather than using a treatment that is only clouding the symptoms in my opinion. There is much debate on this subject and some fish seem become immune to ich over time. Google Hyposalinity and you should find some treatments that are natural. Study the life cycle of ich and make your own decision. I believe alot of tank's healthiness is dependent upon bacteria and microorganisms which may be killed by your ich treatment. Good Luck __________________ S.G. = 1.025, Temp = 78.5, pH = 8.00 Ca = 550 ppm, Alk = 176 ppm (9.85 dKH), Mg = 1300 ppm NO3 = 0.97 ppm, PO4 = 0.07 ppm Nuvo 30, Razor Nano LED, Tunze ATO, Tunze 9004 skimmer, Vortec mp10,

06/04/2009, 11:58 AM	#13
oneoffcustom Registered Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: houston texas Posts: 311	Wow lots of replies. I actually do not have an ich outbreak as of yet, but i am anticipating on one. I have a 75 gallon tank that i will be using as my qt. The problem is i have all my live rock in the tank curing with the fish. My question now is i guess if i remove all my live rock from the tank will it cause the tank to cycle again or would the tank stay as normal? If the tank will not recycle i could use a copper treatment and all would be lovely. any one wanna touch that question? __________________ Honey your are gonna be ****ed but... I really needed it!!! Current Tank Info: 5g Unknown destination!

06/04/2009, 12:00 PM	#14
oneoffcustom Registered Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: houston texas Posts: 311	the rock is cured its just in the tank as well __________________ Honey your are gonna be ****ed but... I really needed it!!! Current Tank Info: 5g Unknown destination!

06/04/2009, 12:20 PM	#15
stuccodude Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: sanger Posts: 1,040	i had ich bad 2 years ago and used garlic extreme and within days the ich was gone but it couldnt have been the garlic, i was just lucky, just like when we go camping and the night before i pop a few cloves of garlic and the mosquitoes dont mess with me. luck. __________________ fear the wrath of patrick willis!!! no offense is safe. Current Tank Info: 240 all the goodies,hydra 26 led lights, chiller etc

06/04/2009, 05:26 PM	#16
sunsetSPS Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 355	I heard different fallow period for ich parasite to die: 6 weeks then 8 weeks then now 12 weeks? longer is safer but what is the time from real experiences? I know all reefers know how to say : keep your tank for ??? weeks to cure ich, but I guess not many ppl who know how to say it, actually had experienced themselves but rather heard or read from somewhere (yet from another ppl who heard/read from somewhere too). I'm not trying to offense anyone but just try to get some real info.

06/04/2009, 07:37 PM	#18
rkelman Registered Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Belleville, Ontario Canada Posts: 3,438	"Now you've gone and made it not-funny anymore." Aw. I missed it. Soooo sorry.

06/04/2009, 08:08 PM	#20
Rendos Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Memphis, TN Posts: 5,380	Seachem's Metronidazole works great and is completely reef safe. __________________ Richard Rendos - Founder WTMRAC It can't rain all the time. Current Tank Info: 92 gallon corner bowfront

06/04/2009, 08:15 PM	#21
greenbean36191 Premium Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Ft. Lauderdale Posts: 10,598	There are only three methods proven to treat ich- hyposalinity, copper, and tank transfer. None can be used in a reef tank. None of the other treatments have been proven to work, though the active ingredients of many of them have been proven not to work in laboratory tests against Cryptocaryon. Steven Pro and others have also tested the reef safeness of a few of them and found that they don't live up to their claims. Hobbyist reports are not reliable because there is no way to determine whether a fish is affected or not via visual inspection and even without any treatment most fish will develop resistance to the parasite after the initial round of parasites leave the fish (i.e. the spots disappear and don't come back). However, that does not equate to a cure because they still harbor a small number of parasites which can create future outbreaks. To determine whether a treatment is effective you have to do biopsies of the fish and determine if the parasite load is statistically different than for untreated fish. __________________ Some say the sun rises in the East. Some say it rises in the West. The truth must be somewhere in the middle. Current Tank Info: tore them down to move and haven't had the time or money to set them back up

06/04/2009, 08:25 PM	#22
snorvich Team RC member Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Outlander Posts: 40,953 Blog Entries: 46	+1 I could not have said it better. __________________ Warmest regards, ~Steve~

06/04/2009, 11:51 PM	#23
kb27973 Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Denver, CO. Posts: 715	It still confounds me why people have so many problems and are so freaked out about Ich. Buy from a reputable dealer, feed your fish more than once a day (one or two cubes every other day ain't gonna cut it!) keep good water quality and you won't have a problem with disease. I buy 99% of my fish online and even after going through shipping if they start out healthy and you feed them things will be fine. In 10 years I have never had a fish die from disease, but I feed my fish a lot. Just my experience. So to answer the question I would say the reef safe cure/prevention would be Food and water quality. Ken __________________ Sometimes I think we're alone. Sometimes I think we're not. In either case, the prospect is staggering! - Arthur C. Clarke Current Tank Info: 125G SPS - Regal Angel (3 yrs and going), Pascalus Anthia, Bartletts Anthias, spawning pairs of Six Line Wrasse, Mandarin Gobies, P. Fridmani, Gold Stripe Maroon Clowns

06/05/2009, 12:10 PM	#24
LargeAngels Premium Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: USA Posts: 3,651	+2. No, No and No again to any Reef Safe Ich products that have been PROVEN to work.

06/05/2009, 12:11 PM	#25
oneoffcustom Registered Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: houston texas Posts: 311	cool more info.... __________________ Honey your are gonna be ****ed but... I really needed it!!! Current Tank Info: 5g Unknown destination!