sumpless????

Erniethisle · 11/12/2009, 02:11 PM

has anyone had luck with this if so can you explain please????thanks in advance

kyrin01 · 11/12/2009, 03:24 PM

15% weekly water changes. nuff said.

i have no sump on my 20g and have no issues with anything. just keep up with the water changes and u shouldnt have any problems.

Works alot better on smaller tanks tho. 55 or less id say.

Paul B · 11/12/2009, 03:47 PM

Tank is 40 years old, no sump. What is there to explain?

barnabus's gimp · 11/12/2009, 03:56 PM

I'm with paul on this one, that tank is wonderful

Paul B · 11/12/2009, 04:05 PM

Sump, I don't need no stinkin sump

herozero · 11/12/2009, 06:01 PM

look at this month's tank of the month.

Erniethisle · 11/13/2009, 01:26 PM

Seems do able how about on larger sps tanks. Anyone have any info?

Erniethisle · 11/13/2009, 03:11 PM

found it any more?????

Erniethisle · 11/13/2009, 06:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Erniethisle

Seems do able how about on larger sps tanks. Anyone have any info?

smatter · 11/13/2009, 08:03 PM

My 40g is sumpless and houses mainly SPS. I run a Tunze 9010 skimmer with two Tunze 6055 Nano Streams. There is also a Tunze 3165 Nano Cleaner for mechanical and chemical filtration. It also skims the surface, but this is not needed with strong surface agitation. I had the same tank with a built-in overflow at one time and the internal equipment actually takes up less space than the overflow did. I have had plenty of over complicated systems with elaborate sumps. I much prefer the simplicity of internal filtration.

sharrison · 11/13/2009, 08:54 PM

Paul I would like more information about your tank, if possible. Sumpless sounds grand...

moondoggy4 · 11/14/2009, 12:49 AM

Good circulation and a strong skimmer is a must for a sumpless tank.

nano427 · 11/14/2009, 02:57 AM

sure you can go sumpless but you will need some hob's. ie: skimmer and/or fuge

Paul B · 11/14/2009, 06:58 AM

Quote:

Paul I would like more information about your tank, if possible. Sumpless sounds grand...

I started my tank before sumps were in use. I have nothing against them, I just don't need one.
I like a large skimmer which would not fit in a sump, my skimmer is a Homemade 5' model.
I also don't have a fuge but for the last five years I have an algae trough that I installed above the water and to the rear of the tank. It uses waste light that would have just gone to light the rear of the tank. The trough is of course not needed.
The protein skimmer is fed from a home made surface skimmer which is 2" in diameter.
I know all this stuff is homemade but you can buy HOB skimmers, you just need a large one.
My HOB skimmer

Algae trough

No equipment shows from the front

sharrison · 11/14/2009, 08:13 PM

That setup is interesting. I believe, for my 180 gallon, I am going get a 50 Long.
I know quite a bit about chemistry and find that a lot of people are dosing these days to bring various nutrients up or down. I do not believe in this approach to reefing. It appears that you have a stable system based on things being consistent and not what people would be say is the perfect environment.
I think stability is the perfect environment not necessarily, so called "perfect" parameters.

I may be way off but this looks like your approach.

Ekdrummer · 11/14/2009, 11:02 PM

I am far too lazy to go sumpless!!!.. That would mean I would have to do a water change more than once a year

Paul B · 11/15/2009, 06:45 AM

Sharrison, my tank and methods are very natural, I depend on the algae trough to eliminate nitrates along with my very slow running RUGF and live rock much of which is hollow being I built it.

Quote:

I am far too lazy to go sumpless!!!.. That would mean I would have to do a water change more than once a year

That is true, I change some water 4 or 5 times a year. The tank will be running 40 years next March

Jman13 · 11/15/2009, 10:11 AM

i have a 55 gallon sumpless tank. if you get a good hang on back skimmer and keep up on your water changes youll do great

sharrison · 11/15/2009, 10:29 AM

+1 to the natural approach.

smatter · 11/15/2009, 03:05 PM

Water changes aren't critical with a sumpless system if it is set up properly. I'm doing a 10% water change today, but it has been months since the last one. I find the tank just looks better the less I mess with it.

Paul B · 11/15/2009, 03:07 PM

Quote:

Water changes aren't critical with a sumpless system if it is set up properly

I don't know what to make of this statement.
What difference would it make if there is a sump or not?
I am just curious.

sharrison · 11/15/2009, 04:47 PM

It doesn't make any difference. The only thing it's used for is to hide items and have more water volume. The added water volume is not necessarily a benefit.

I'm going to add one because of limited space under the DT and wanting to keep my 180 clean looking. I want all of my tanks 72x24x25 size for viewing.

sharrison · 11/15/2009, 04:48 PM

Paul I ran across where you made some home made rock but the link didn't work. Any other links to how you created rock?

Paul B · 11/15/2009, 05:49 PM

There should be articles about it on here somewhere but basically I heat some PVC (outdoors) and bend it into wierd shapes. I can also glue other pieces to it. I wrap it in window screen and smear cement on it. It takes about 5 or 6 coats as the first coat hardly sticks.
The first picture is the building of the thing. The last picture, you can see that piece behind the Moorish Idol.

About a quarter of the rock is hollow and homemade

Ekdrummer · 11/15/2009, 06:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul B

Sharrison, my tank and methods are very natural, I depend on the algae trough to eliminate nitrates along with my very slow running RUGF and live rock much of which is hollow being I built it.

That is true, I change some water 4 or 5 times a year. The tank will be running 40 years next March

Actually I do chage about 1/4 of it about once a quarter. I am in the middle of a new tank build so I am doing about a 50% change in the process. I have about 300 gallons total water volume and a 200 gallon display.

Rob

11/12/2009, 02:11 PM	#1
Erniethisle Moved On Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: CALIFORNIA Posts: 57	sumpless???? has anyone had luck with this if so can you explain please????thanks in advance

11/12/2009, 03:47 PM	#3
Paul B Premium Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Long Island NY Posts: 15,549	Tank is 40 years old, no sump. What is there to explain? __________________ I used to get shocked when I put my hand in my tank. Then the electric eel went dead. Current Tank Info: 100 gal reef set up in 1971

11/12/2009, 04:05 PM	#5
Paul B Premium Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Long Island NY Posts: 15,549	Sump, I don't need no stinkin sump __________________ I used to get shocked when I put my hand in my tank. Then the electric eel went dead. Current Tank Info: 100 gal reef set up in 1971

11/15/2009, 05:49 PM	#24
Paul B Premium Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Long Island NY Posts: 15,549	There should be articles about it on here somewhere but basically I heat some PVC (outdoors) and bend it into wierd shapes. I can also glue other pieces to it. I wrap it in window screen and smear cement on it. It takes about 5 or 6 coats as the first coat hardly sticks. The first picture is the building of the thing. The last picture, you can see that piece behind the Moorish Idol. About a quarter of the rock is hollow and homemade __________________ I used to get shocked when I put my hand in my tank. Then the electric eel went dead. Current Tank Info: 100 gal reef set up in 1971 Last edited by Paul B; 11/15/2009 at 05:54 PM.

11/12/2009, 03:24 PM	#2
kyrin01 Moved On Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 301	15% weekly water changes. nuff said. i have no sump on my 20g and have no issues with anything. just keep up with the water changes and u shouldnt have any problems. Works alot better on smaller tanks tho. 55 or less id say.

11/12/2009, 03:56 PM	#4
barnabus's gimp Moved On Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Orange County Ca Posts: 578	I'm with paul on this one, that tank is wonderful

11/12/2009, 06:01 PM	#6
herozero Registered Member. Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 717	look at this month's tank of the month.

11/13/2009, 01:26 PM	#7
Erniethisle Moved On Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: CALIFORNIA Posts: 57	Seems do able how about on larger sps tanks. Anyone have any info?

11/13/2009, 03:11 PM	#8
Erniethisle Moved On Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: CALIFORNIA Posts: 57	found it any more?????

11/13/2009, 08:03 PM	#10
smatter Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Madison, WI Posts: 2,055	My 40g is sumpless and houses mainly SPS. I run a Tunze 9010 skimmer with two Tunze 6055 Nano Streams. There is also a Tunze 3165 Nano Cleaner for mechanical and chemical filtration. It also skims the surface, but this is not needed with strong surface agitation. I had the same tank with a built-in overflow at one time and the internal equipment actually takes up less space than the overflow did. I have had plenty of over complicated systems with elaborate sumps. I much prefer the simplicity of internal filtration.

11/13/2009, 08:54 PM	#11
sharrison *"Registered Member"* Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Waynesboro, TN Posts: 354	Paul I would like more information about your tank, if possible. Sumpless sounds grand...

11/14/2009, 12:49 AM	#12
moondoggy4 Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: menifee So cal Posts: 11,042	Good circulation and a strong skimmer is a must for a sumpless tank.

11/14/2009, 02:57 AM	#13
nano427 Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: AV OC CA USA Posts: 877	sure you can go sumpless but you will need some hob's. ie: skimmer and/or fuge

11/14/2009, 08:13 PM	#15
sharrison *"Registered Member"* Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Waynesboro, TN Posts: 354	That setup is interesting. I believe, for my 180 gallon, I am going get a 50 Long. I know quite a bit about chemistry and find that a lot of people are dosing these days to bring various nutrients up or down. I do not believe in this approach to reefing. It appears that you have a stable system based on things being consistent and not what people would be say is the perfect environment. I think stability is the perfect environment not necessarily, so called "perfect" parameters. I may be way off but this looks like your approach.

11/14/2009, 11:02 PM	#16
Ekdrummer Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Columbia, SC Posts: 62	I am far too lazy to go sumpless!!!.. That would mean I would have to do a water change more than once a year

11/15/2009, 10:11 AM	#18
Jman13 Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Plumsteadville, PA Posts: 154	i have a 55 gallon sumpless tank. if you get a good hang on back skimmer and keep up on your water changes youll do great

11/15/2009, 10:29 AM	#19
sharrison *"Registered Member"* Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Waynesboro, TN Posts: 354	+1 to the natural approach.

11/15/2009, 03:05 PM	#20
smatter Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Madison, WI Posts: 2,055	Water changes aren't critical with a sumpless system if it is set up properly. I'm doing a 10% water change today, but it has been months since the last one. I find the tank just looks better the less I mess with it.

11/15/2009, 04:47 PM	#22
sharrison *"Registered Member"* Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Waynesboro, TN Posts: 354	It doesn't make any difference. The only thing it's used for is to hide items and have more water volume. The added water volume is not necessarily a benefit. I'm going to add one because of limited space under the DT and wanting to keep my 180 clean looking. I want all of my tanks 72x24x25 size for viewing.

11/15/2009, 04:48 PM	#23
sharrison *"Registered Member"* Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Waynesboro, TN Posts: 354	Paul I ran across where you made some home made rock but the link didn't work. Any other links to how you created rock?