Alkalinity Test Kit suggestions

mikeintosh · 03/20/2010, 01:26 AM

Hi, I need an alkalinity test kit that will take readings in the 35-50dkh range. I currently use the Salifert kit but it only reads up to 16dkh. Is there a common brand that someone can recommend?

Thanks

Yogre · 03/20/2010, 05:23 AM

With the Salifert kit you can refill the syringe and keep on titrating; add the amounts used up ie a syringe and a half equals 24 dKH.

The API kit may work for you as well, 1 drop= 1 dKH.

That's going to be a seriously dark solution at the endpoint. You may even need to dilute your sample with RO/DI water before titrating.

mikeintosh · 03/20/2010, 09:33 AM

Do you mean when it reaches .5 on the syringe?

I actually kept titrating just see how much more it would take and it reached .47. So I'll need to titrate more than 2 syringes full to get the 35+dkh level I want?

Thanks

Yogre · 03/20/2010, 09:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mikeintosh

Do you mean when it reaches .5 on the syringe?

I actually kept titrating just see how much more it would take and it reached .47. So I'll need to titrate more than 2 syringes full to get the 35+dkh level I want?

Thanks

I haven't used the Salifert alk kit in a while, so my memory may be faulty, but yes, if the syringe is 1.0 ml= 16 dKH then 0.5 on the syringe would equal 8 dKH. You'll most likely need more than 2 syringes worth for 35 dKH.

Maybe someone who's a little more current on the Salifert kit than I am can chime in, too.

mikeintosh · 03/20/2010, 11:01 AM

Thanks very much. That info is very helpful.

bertoni · 03/20/2010, 09:31 PM

At some point, using another syringe might be inaccurate, so I'd dilute the solution with 4 parts RO/DI water, and multiple the result by 5, to make sure that the test kit is still working linearly.

Billybeau1 · 03/21/2010, 07:18 AM

What kind of water are you testing that requires a range of 35 to 50 dkh ????

If it is not seawater, I doubt the Salifert will be very accurate.

Randy Holmes-Farley · 03/21/2010, 07:27 AM

Probably CaCO3/CO2 reactor effluent?

Billybeau1 · 03/21/2010, 07:50 AM

I doubt any of our hobby grade kits could measure that high of dkh accurately. And diluting would depend on the alkalinity of the water being used, no ? Ro/di is not the same alkalinity everywhere in the country is it ?

I'll bet Hach has a test kit for that but it will cost you.

Yogre · 03/21/2010, 08:21 AM

Would it be possible to titrate a sample of the RO/DI water used for dilution and subtract that value out of a diluted sample?

Edit to add: Duh, Billy you just mentioned the Salifert kit may not be accurate in freshwater, so that idea wouldn't work would it?

bertoni · 03/21/2010, 08:24 AM

RO/DI should have an alkalinity of zero. Otherwise, the filter needs work.

tbalankura · 03/22/2010, 12:06 PM

I heard salifert gives unusual high readings on KH .... is it true?

bertoni · 03/22/2010, 08:06 PM

To Reef Central

Every brand has problem reports. There's no objective data on how well each brand works, but I am suspicious about such broad claims as that.

mikeintosh · 03/23/2010, 04:47 PM

I am testing the effluent from my Calcium Reactor. And so far based on Yogre's suggestions, it seems to be working.

Based on my reading/research, I should be shooting for a dKH of 30-50 in order to get the aragonite to start "melting". The pH probe is reading of 6.5 inside the chamber, so I guess I'll just wait and see to make sure the effluent is keeping up with the tanks needs.

One other issue I am having, though, if anyone can shed any light, is I can't seem to keep the milwaukee regulator on a consistent bubble count. I'm always having to open up the fine tune valve slightly every few hours to keep the bubbles going. I've read some people just turned up the psi. But how high can I go? I have it up to 105psi and it still won't keep a steady count...

Thanks

Boomer · 03/23/2010, 05:04 PM

Have you seen these ?

A Guide to Using Calcium Reactors
http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2002-0...ture/index.htm

Calcium Reactor setup calculator (CaCO3/CO2 reactors)
http://home.comcast.net/~jdieck1/reactor.html

Note:

be shooting for a dKH of 30-50 in order to get the aragonite to start "melting"

Where did you hear that from ?

If the effluent Alk is 30 - 50 dKH it is already melting big time. Lets pretend the tank Alk is 10 dKH, which is the water going into the reactor and is coming out 30 - 50 dKH. That is 3 - 5 times the influent Alk.

Boomer · 03/23/2010, 05:10 PM

I heard salifert gives unusual high readings on KH .... is it true?

It is suppose to be slightly higher than all the others, as they are FW kits used for seawater and the Salifert is for seawater. So, it reads around 10 % higher than the others, as they are missing 10% of the Alk. FW kits do not titrate low enough for seawater to make End-Point, so they read to low.

ksed · 03/23/2010, 07:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boomer

I heard salifert gives unusual high readings on KH .... is it true?

It is suppose to be slightly higher than all the others, as they are FW kits used for seawater and the Salifert is for seawater. So, it reads around 10 % higher than the others, as they are missing 10% of the Alk. FW kits do not titrate low enough for seawater to make End-Point, so they read to low.

Hi Boomer
Wow that is good to know. I was going crazy. Could not figue out why my alk was always low and with Salifert it was fine.
I did notice that Salifert did read higher.
Is Salifert at the moment the only one for seawater?
How about Fauna Marin?

Thanks

Boomer · 03/23/2010, 08:19 PM

I only know of the Salifert.

mano84 · 03/24/2010, 02:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ksed

Hi Boomer
Wow that is good to know. I was going crazy. Could not figue out why my alk was always low and with Salifert it was fine.
I did notice that Salifert did read higher.
Is Salifert at the moment the only one for seawater?
How about Fauna Marin?

Thanks

I do believe that Fauna Marin is a seawater alkalinity test as well, on the box and in the instructions it says for seawater (or saltwater, don't remember which) but nowhere is there anything about freshwater.

From my experience, which is only one box, it also tested slightly higher than the others (elos and jbl).

Boomer · 03/24/2010, 07:51 AM

All it says is High precise alkalinty Test Kit, easy and safe to use for Saltwater Aquariums

03/20/2010, 01:26 AM	#1
mikeintosh Mikeintosh Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 356	Alkalinity Test Kit suggestions Hi, I need an alkalinity test kit that will take readings in the 35-50dkh range. I currently use the Salifert kit but it only reads up to 16dkh. Is there a common brand that someone can recommend? Thanks

03/20/2010, 05:23 AM	#2
Yogre Cheesehead Reefer Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Madison, Wisconsin Posts: 1,351	With the Salifert kit you can refill the syringe and keep on titrating; add the amounts used up ie a syringe and a half equals 24 dKH. The API kit may work for you as well, 1 drop= 1 dKH. That's going to be a seriously dark solution at the endpoint. You may even need to dilute your sample with RO/DI water before titrating. __________________ "Learn from yesterday, live for today, hope for tomorrow." ~ Albert Einstein Current Tank Info: 215 gal TBS Reef

03/20/2010, 09:31 PM	#6
bertoni RC Mod Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Mountain View, CA, USA Posts: 88,616	At some point, using another syringe might be inaccurate, so I'd dilute the solution with 4 parts RO/DI water, and multiple the result by 5, to make sure that the test kit is still working linearly. __________________ Jonathan Bertoni

03/21/2010, 07:18 AM	#7
Billybeau1 Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Dyer, Indiana Posts: 12,010	What kind of water are you testing that requires a range of 35 to 50 dkh ???? If it is not seawater, I doubt the Salifert will be very accurate. __________________ I do not worry about things I can't do anything about Current Tank Info: Picasso Trigger, Racoon Butterfly, Yellow Tail Damsel, Half-Black Angel

03/21/2010, 07:27 AM	#8
Randy Holmes-Farley Reef Chemist Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Arlington, Massachusetts Posts: 86,233	Probably CaCO3/CO2 reactor effluent? __________________ Randy Holmes-Farley Current Tank Info: 120 mixed reef

03/20/2010, 09:33 AM	#3
mikeintosh Mikeintosh Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 356	Do you mean when it reaches .5 on the syringe? I actually kept titrating just see how much more it would take and it reached .47. So I'll need to titrate more than 2 syringes full to get the 35+dkh level I want? Thanks

03/20/2010, 11:01 AM	#5
mikeintosh Mikeintosh Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 356	Thanks very much. That info is very helpful.

03/21/2010, 07:50 AM	#9
Billybeau1 Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Dyer, Indiana Posts: 12,010	I doubt any of our hobby grade kits could measure that high of dkh accurately. And diluting would depend on the alkalinity of the water being used, no ? Ro/di is not the same alkalinity everywhere in the country is it ? I'll bet Hach has a test kit for that but it will cost you. __________________ I do not worry about things I can't do anything about Current Tank Info: Picasso Trigger, Racoon Butterfly, Yellow Tail Damsel, Half-Black Angel

03/21/2010, 08:21 AM	#10
Yogre Cheesehead Reefer Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Madison, Wisconsin Posts: 1,351	Would it be possible to titrate a sample of the RO/DI water used for dilution and subtract that value out of a diluted sample? Edit to add: Duh, Billy you just mentioned the Salifert kit may not be accurate in freshwater, so that idea wouldn't work would it? __________________ "Learn from yesterday, live for today, hope for tomorrow." ~ Albert Einstein Current Tank Info: 215 gal TBS Reef

03/21/2010, 08:24 AM	#11
bertoni RC Mod Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Mountain View, CA, USA Posts: 88,616	RO/DI should have an alkalinity of zero. Otherwise, the filter needs work. __________________ Jonathan Bertoni

03/22/2010, 12:06 PM	#12
tbalankura Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 1	I heard salifert gives unusual high readings on KH .... is it true?

03/22/2010, 08:06 PM	#13
bertoni RC Mod Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Mountain View, CA, USA Posts: 88,616	*To Reef Central* Every brand has problem reports. There's no objective data on how well each brand works, but I am suspicious about such broad claims as that. __________________ Jonathan Bertoni

03/23/2010, 04:47 PM	#14
mikeintosh Mikeintosh Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 356	I am testing the effluent from my Calcium Reactor. And so far based on Yogre's suggestions, it seems to be working. Based on my reading/research, I should be shooting for a dKH of 30-50 in order to get the aragonite to start "melting". The pH probe is reading of 6.5 inside the chamber, so I guess I'll just wait and see to make sure the effluent is keeping up with the tanks needs. One other issue I am having, though, if anyone can shed any light, is I can't seem to keep the milwaukee regulator on a consistent bubble count. I'm always having to open up the fine tune valve slightly every few hours to keep the bubbles going. I've read some people just turned up the psi. But how high can I go? I have it up to 105psi and it still won't keep a steady count... Thanks

03/23/2010, 05:04 PM	#15
Boomer Bomb Technician (EOD) Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Duluth, Minnesota Posts: 11,842	Have you seen these ? A Guide to Using Calcium Reactors http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2002-0...ture/index.htm Calcium Reactor setup calculator (CaCO3/CO2 reactors) http://home.comcast.net/~jdieck1/reactor.html Note: be shooting for a dKH of 30-50 in order to get the aragonite to start "melting" Where did you hear that from ? If the effluent Alk is 30 - 50 dKH it is already melting big time. Lets pretend the tank Alk is 10 dKH, which is the water going into the reactor and is coming out 30 - 50 dKH. That is 3 - 5 times the influent Alk. __________________ If you See Me Running You Better Catch-Up Seawater Chemistry, Geology, ID Marine Life, Collecting Science Books, Explosives Technology, Audiophile An explosion can be defined as a loud noise, accompanied by the sudden going away of things, from a place where they use to be.

03/23/2010, 05:10 PM	#16
Boomer Bomb Technician (EOD) Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Duluth, Minnesota Posts: 11,842	I heard salifert gives unusual high readings on KH .... is it true? It is suppose to be slightly higher than all the others, as they are FW kits used for seawater and the Salifert is for seawater. So, it reads around 10 % higher than the others, as they are missing 10% of the Alk. FW kits do not titrate low enough for seawater to make End-Point, so they read to low. __________________ If you See Me Running You Better Catch-Up Seawater Chemistry, Geology, ID Marine Life, Collecting Science Books, Explosives Technology, Audiophile An explosion can be defined as a loud noise, accompanied by the sudden going away of things, from a place where they use to be.

03/23/2010, 08:19 PM	#18
Boomer Bomb Technician (EOD) Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Duluth, Minnesota Posts: 11,842	I only know of the Salifert. __________________ If you See Me Running You Better Catch-Up Seawater Chemistry, Geology, ID Marine Life, Collecting Science Books, Explosives Technology, Audiophile An explosion can be defined as a loud noise, accompanied by the sudden going away of things, from a place where they use to be.

03/24/2010, 07:51 AM	#20
Boomer Bomb Technician (EOD) Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Duluth, Minnesota Posts: 11,842	All it says is High precise alkalinty Test Kit, easy and safe to use for Saltwater Aquariums __________________ If you See Me Running You Better Catch-Up Seawater Chemistry, Geology, ID Marine Life, Collecting Science Books, Explosives Technology, Audiophile An explosion can be defined as a loud noise, accompanied by the sudden going away of things, from a place where they use to be.